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View Poll Results: Which of These Statements Describes Your Stance on the Death Penalty?
All felons should be executed. 3 11.54%
All murderers and sexual predators should be executed. 4 15.38%
All murderers should be executed. 2 7.69%
Murderers who feel no remorse should be executed- and swiftly. 3 11.54%
Murderers who feel no remorse should be executed- but with an extensive waiting period. 0 0%
Only mass murderers, such as serial killers and terrorists, should be executed. 0 0%
The death penalty is acceptable only in wartime emergencies; it should not be used in peacetime. 1 3.85%
The death penalty is never acceptable. 9 34.62%
None of the Above (Please Explain) 4 15.38%
Voters: 26. You may not vote on this poll

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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2006, 09:07 AM
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Default they didn't know it was an illegal

Quote:
Originally Posted by lunecat";p=&quot View Post
I wonder if you had been there at the time of his original crime and you had your loaded gun with you and you actually tracked him down would you have shot him yourself? And why because he is an illegal alian or a kiddy fidler?
Yeah, I would have shot him while he was still covered with that little girl's blood. And, no matter what else happened, that little girl and her parents would never have to worry about him coming back. Even though she has blocked out the attack and couldn't identify the guy, he doesn't know that. The threat to that family is very real.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Java
The court system should be cold and distant and simply ask before doing something "What will this accomplish?
Check out the story of Mary Vincent, the teenager who had her arms cut off. Only her attacker's prompt execution would have saved her from decades of trauma. That's what would have been accomplished by his death.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2006, 09:14 AM
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Default ///

I have seen no evidence that execution actually removes trauma. Trauma stays with people even after the cause of the danger is removed. There might be a sense of "justice" to slightly balance the trauma, but nothing that can fully remove the scars of it.
I stand by my opinion that the point of execution is not for the emotional state of the victims regardless. In a majority of murder cases, you could execute a scapegoat and get the same effect so long as it appears that you have the right guy.
In the few cases that we are 100% sure we know who did it and the crime was extra obscene, I can look the other way for a death penalty... but I still think it's a slippery slope because it takes us away from the purpose of the justice system.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2006, 09:46 AM
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Default .

If someone tried to kill me and they were executed, it would add to my trauma, particularly if they had raped and/or tortured me. The reason is that I would, as a normal instinct, feel a temporary sense of triumph when they were executed. But then it would hit me: I enjoyed the fact that another human being died. I would recognize that I had sunk morally to the level of my victimizer. Then I would feel guilt in addition to whatever other horrors I was experiencing.
My mother and I discussed a related topic several times. Both she and my father have always told me that, if they were murdered, they would want me to tell the court that they opposed the death penalty when they were alive and would not want the criminal executed. I state the same about myself. If I were murdered, I would want the criminal put away for life to prevent them from re-offending, but I would want those who know me to speak against executing my murderer. Perhaps the main reason I would want them to live is that the longer they lived in prison, the greater the chance that God could get through to some part of their mind. Ultimately, the most twisted people are the ones who need God's help the most. Christ said he came for the sick not for the well, and he didn't just mean the physically ill. Physical illness is nothing compared with moral illness.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2006, 10:48 AM
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Default the renegade who had it made

Quote:
Originally Posted by JavaBlack";p=&quot View Post
I have seen no evidence that execution actually removes trauma. Trauma stays with people even after the cause of the danger is removed. There might be a sense of "justice" to slightly balance the trauma, but nothing that can fully remove the scars of it.
Scars are fine, but sometimes we're talking about open wounds like with Mary Vincent and the little girl I know.
Quote:
I stand by my opinion that the point of execution is not for the emotional state of the victims regardless. In a majority of murder cases, you could execute a scapegoat and get the same effect so long as it appears that you have the right guy.
In the few cases that we are 100% sure we know who did it and the crime was extra obscene, I can look the other way for a death penalty... but I still think it's a slippery slope because it takes us away from the purpose of the justice system.
Ideally, a life sentence would work just as well. But, we all know that there's no such thing. I'm guessing that less than 100 people are executed each year. I don't have a guess at how many people are murdered by people who've been previously convicted of violent crimes.
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Old 11-09-2006, 11:07 AM
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Default justice

Quote:
Originally Posted by The12thMan";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by lunecat";p=&quot View Post
I wonder if you had been there at the time of his original crime and you had your loaded gun with you and you actually tracked him down would you have shot him yourself? And why because he is an illegal alian or a kiddy fidler?
Yeah, I would have shot him while he was still covered with that little girl's blood. And, no matter what else happened, that little girl and her parents would never have to worry about him coming back. Even though she has blocked out the attack and couldn't identify the guy, he doesn't know that. The threat to that family is very real.
...
Then I would expect you to stand trial for murder

Quote:
Originally Posted by JavaBlack";p=&quot View Post
...
In the few cases that we are 100% sure we know who did it and the crime was extra obscene, I can look the other way for a death penalty... but I still think it's a slippery slope because it takes us away from the purpose of the justice system.
No "looking the other way" you believe in the death penalty or you don't - it is immoral to take someones life, it is a sin!
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2006, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lunecat";p=&quot View Post
No "looking the other way" you believe in the death penalty or you don't - it is immoral to take someones life, it is a sin!
You're right. But I can't bring myself to feel sad when a true monster who we know to be a true monster is removed from the earth. I would prefer that person to have been gunned down in self defense during the crime, before he could take an innocent life.
The strange part is that murderers in general have a pretty low rate of recivitism compared to other crimes... but we always hear about the exceptions to the rule.

I think the big problem is the way we look at insanity... We think the insane, because they are less in control of their actions, should be treated less harshly- which generally means less time. This is flawed. Someone who kills for insane reasons should never be released as they cannot be expected to learn from mistakes. IMO the admission of insanity as a reason for a crime is an admission that you can never be trusted to be free. Only rational people can be rehabilitated through punishment.
The high profile murders we hear about tend to be people that cannot be sane. It amazes me that we do not make it much harder for such people to ever see the light of day again... but I don't feel killing them accomplishes anything.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2006, 11:35 AM
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Default waterfall

Quote:
Originally Posted by JavaBlack";p=&quot View Post
You're right. But I can't bring myself to feel sad when a true monster who we know to be a true monster is removed from the earth. I would prefer that person to have been gunned down in self defense during the crime, before he could take an innocent life.
The strange part is that murderers in general have a pretty low rate of recivitism compared to other crimes... but we always hear about the exceptions to the rule.
...


Quote:
Originally Posted by JavaBlack";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by The12thMan";p=&quot View Post
I think anyone who doesn't think that man deserves the death penalty is a sick b'tard.
Deserving is irrelevant in my opinion. I believe the justice system is meant to protect us, rehabilitate when possible. The call for vengeance is a base and foul human emotion which should not be glorified as it is part of the reason we need such a strong state (look at Israel and Palestine to see a modern example of what vengeance has done for society).
The court system should be cold and distant and simply ask before doing something "What will this accomplish?"
I think its best to stick with your original instincts
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 11-14-2006, 11:51 AM
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Default Is Mr Bush right ?

It is my understanding that Mr Bush once sanctioned the execution of a man with the inteligence of a 10 yr old, this sort of state murder will always happen while the death sentence is available. How many people have been mistakenly executed. Death by state can never be right, however, life should mean life in cases of mass murder and terrorism. I think I would also include paedophiles especially those who kill their victims.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 11-17-2006, 12:34 AM
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Default Well

The death penalty should be removed, and that prisons should be a little less of a holiday spa. A lot of tramps end up breaking the law in return for good meals and cable tv.
If the afterlife does exist, the convicted will receive an eternity of glorious hot pokers up his/her ass.
If it doesn't exist, they'll suffer as long as possible waiting to die in a 4-wall room with no windows.
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 11-27-2006, 11:17 AM
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Default Harsh swift penalties mean much less crime

I've been to China twice in the last three years, it's much safer there in the big cities than any big city in the US. While people there do commit major crimes over 60 crimes have the death penalty and it's applied swiftly and often in public view...just missed one outside of Wuhan but saw the blood evidence a couple of hours later of 7 criminals. The locals in the big cities feel safe any time of day anywhere or so they said.

Make any type of illegal drug dealing a capital crime with swift execution (in this country) and I'll bet the drug problem drops drastically.
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