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Old 11-29-2005, 12:33 PM
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Default Random thoughts

I originally posted this on another Forum (introverts.com). It is
a reply, but it considers quite common topics so I thought it would be suitable as a political opinion..

Quote:
Well, I have problems with the following ideas mentioned before:
1) Anarchy
2) World without money

I view the anarchists rather naive and short sighted considering the consequences, which follow the removal of the state..

First, it is critical to undertand that that the state's primary function is to work as violence monopoly in the society.. All thought the historical states gained birth throught violence, the state itself has a strong pacifying effect on the society.. It is very simple, the violence monopoly cannot tolerate competing organized groups of violence on its territory.. For the state, the violent groups form a threat and competing force against the state, and therefore they must be outlawed and destroyed..

The removal of the state would again reallow these organized violent groups.. Likely, they would soon restart the destructive conflict for the power monopoly in the area and toss the 'peaceful' anarchy to a bloody conflict and a war.. It would be the end the anarchist 'freedom' and it would only mean a begin for a more oppressive era for the people, who would now be living under the iron-fist of the fighting paramilitary groups..

Besides, the state's violence monopoly guarantees the order and the functional legal system, which contributes a _huge_ deal to the welfare of the people and the economy..

To conclude, if there were no state, then one should be soon invented and organized..

...

I have also some problems with this 'world without money'-thing.. The problem is that economics and people simply _need_ a unified currency to organize the trade and economy.. It is a great matter for efficiency, that there is a single meter for value that can be easily handled and exchanged.. In many ways, the money in itself is major service and a very valuable product, which has numerous practical applications.. It just makes both life and economy much easier..

Money is another of these things, which should be invented, if not exist..

--

About the political systems, I like the Scandinavian welfare states (I live myself in Finland).. The things, which really matter to the life quality, are well present in our societies..

On the theorethical basis, I would prefer a society, which would be truly free in the non-economic issues.. Still, I would like to see such distribution of wealth, which would support the society disadvantaged and drop outs..

I more general terms, I would like to see a society, which would provide both freedom and also an opportunity for happy life for its citizens..

- BtD
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Old 11-29-2005, 06:58 PM
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Despite your valid critiques of anarchy, I shall still hold on to my dreams. I'm not going to go supporting any wackos planning to overthrow the government, but if there is an opportunity to increase the scope of freedom, encourage voluntary acts of responsibility for others, and decrease the level of violence in the world state or otherwise, I will support it. In my mind these things are paving the way for anarchy. Many people are driven to good by irrational dreams.
I agree with the money thing. Bartering would have been a pain in the @$$! Imagine having to find something someone else needs in order to get something you need, especially when you have specialized in one product out of economic necessity! Running errands must have truly sucked back then!
Furthermore, I think most of us seek an optimum mix of freedom and quality of life, with something even for the downtrodden among us. But we've got a thousand ideologies that claim these ideals and most of the time is spent arguing amidst each other about which are good.
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Old 11-29-2005, 07:38 PM
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Default Hmm...

I think of anarcho-syndicalism as desirable but impossible, whereas I think of anarcho-capitalism as possible but undesirable.
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Old 11-29-2005, 08:01 PM
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Default You may be on to something, Force..

but it seems to me rational to always move in the path toward the impossible goal that just seems worthwhile. No disrespect intended, but isn't that the power of religion?
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Old 11-29-2005, 08:13 PM
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Default In a Way

Yes, but religion deals with the supernatural, whereas politics deals exclusively with the natural.
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Old 11-29-2005, 08:28 PM
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The two are interrelated. You have to have a goal in order to make use of your ideology. Otherwise the ideology is nothing but an inherited trait. Sometimes I think religion is the same way. What could be more supernatural than a dream of Utopia? And what is a better mark of faith than to try to bring it closer to reality? Sometimes, as a nonreligious (kind of) person, I see people who are deeply religious and think "Oh, ye of little faith."
So I'm weird. What else is new?
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Old 11-29-2005, 08:53 PM
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Default .

No, you're not weird. It is true that some religions have attempted to form Utopian societies. I gave the example of the anarcho-syndicalist Levelers, who were a splinter group of the English Puritans. As a Christian (and not a Leveler), though, I tend to think of this world as having certain natural limitations. So I think in terms of what is possible without expecting any basic flaws in human nature (and hence in society) to lessen or disappear. Regarding anarcho-syndicalism, which would be Utopia, I have realized three things. First, human beings are by nature selfish, which isn't "bad", but which prevents the equitable distribution of wealth without some sort of governmental influence or authority. Second, there will always be some people who behave in destructive ways and other people who are unable to survive in pure capitalism, which, because of what I mention in my first realization, is the only economic system that could exist in anarchy. Third, government social control increases to a degree roughly proportional to government economic control. For that reason, government influence on an economy can increase only up to a certain point before social authoritarianism results. In turn, however, decreasing government economic intervention, when taken past a certain point, results in extremes of economic inequality because of #1 again. Hence we are forced to concede to inequality or to authoritarianism, but taken to either extreme each results in the other. What does all of this make me is sociological terms?
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Old 11-30-2005, 06:15 AM
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Default Smart

It makes you smart, doesn't necessarily put you in any box. Keep in mind, sociologists don't subscribe to a paradigm (in general) unquestioningly, but switch them around like different pairs of reading glasses. Different situations require a different lens. That's why I often seem a bit erratic in my political moves. I can argue against either side and feel it is necessary to do so. You are among those gifted enough in thought to look at issues as they need to be looked at without getting caught up in the inertia of ideology.
Where my ideals stand guide me, but sensibly compared to any. Rather than trying to impose my will and blindly state mistruths to justify, I attempt to figure out how to make my ideals work. For instance, the trouble of violence makes it impossible to disband the State. So the question I ask, rather than how to get rid of the State, is "How can we decrease the level of violence in the long run?"
Humans are not good or evil by nature. They are reciprocal (want to hurt those who hurt us, help those who help us) and they also learn to think in certain patterns. A moral philosophy is better than obediance to authority in that it is a more stable goodness that allows personal autonomy.
The best way to increase goodness is to increase the opportunities for it. As fiscal conservatives note, this means economic growth should help everyone. But what happens when those who have are more worried about losing what they have than sharing the wealth and increasing prosperity for all? That is a concern.
You see, my draw toward the social sciences is an arena for slowly gaining insight into these questions. I cannot possibly figure it out in my lifetime, but I can lay a foundation or add to those that are already there.
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Old 11-30-2005, 07:51 AM
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Default ?

If, a couple of years from now, there is a groundbreaking sociologist making international headlines, should I suspect that he formerly went by the pseudonym of JavaBlack? By the way, I'll try to find an excerpt from Rothbard today.
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