Hmm.... I've been hearing a lot of "liberal-bashing" from the conservatives here on this forum, and I have a comment to make in that regard, and let's see how it plays. Here's the central concept:

The struggle in politics these days, is not between the liberals and the conservatives. I mean, let's face it, the liberals are ineffectual. Their act is "not together". They can't even agree on "anything", much less the meaningful issues.

No, rather, the struggle is within the conservative ideology itself. The struggle is between the people who believe that:

a) the "small government" conservatives, who support the concepts that less government is better, fiscal sanity is a good thing, government works better when it's at the local level, charity and compassion are worthy values, and people should be able to get ahead by working hard....

against

b) the "establishment" conservatives, who don't mind big government, don't mind borrowing to finance pet projects, want to standardize the rules along federal lines, are mainly interested in power, and don't mind making it harder for the Average American to get ahead.

Right now, there's no doubt that group (B) is in power. They are represented by the Bush administration, and by many if not most of the wealthy Senators, and also by a substantial majority in the House of Representatives.

It is my contention, that group (B) basically considers group (A) to be an outmoded and ill-informed segment of the population, valuable only insofar as it votes in favor of the Republican Party.

Group (A) though, is the new Silent Majority. This group, basically represents the values of the hard working people of America. Included in that group, would probably be most middle class breadwinners, including small businessmen, and the portion of the remaining population that is not too enamored with "liberal ideas" like high taxes and government giveaways.

It is also my contention, that Group (B) is using Group (A) for political purposes, by focusing their attentions on irrelevant issues like flag-burning and gay marriage. And meanwhile, unbeknownst to the majority of people in Group (A), their rights and freedoms are being slowly eroded.

Group (B) is basically using issues like 9/11 as "wedges", to paint a false picture of where America's true loyalties lie. They're using these issues to create a powerful media campaign using sound bites like "stay the course" and "cut and run", to divert the attention of the Silent Majority, in an effort to make us believe that "the liberals" are the people causing all the problems.

But in reality, what these people (in Group B) are really interested in, is power and money. And they don't really care who they get it from, or how they acquire it. They'll use any excuse in the book to get it, up to and including an all-out frontal assault on Constitutional values that have served this nation well for over two hundred years.

Consider: Freedom of the Press has never been a "liberal" issue. Never. It's always been an "American" issue. But now, suddenly, the New York Times is being accused of treason. And for what? Because it published something that Group (B) doesn't like. And it's because the one thing they can't stand, the one thing that will bring them down, is exposure.

Some people, may really truly believe that "the liberals" (TM) are the evil ones, but I'm not buying it. To me, I see this political conflict as a struggle between the Statists (Group B) and the "small government" conservatives (Group A). That's where the real struggle lies.

And the one issue that makes this struggle so difficult, is that both Group A and Group B are within the same political party. And therefore, it becomes a no-brainer to point the finger at the opposite party, and to blame them for everything that goes wrong. Because, this provides a convenient scapegoat for the people in Group A, who happen to believe that "the liberals" (TM) are more dangerous than "the Statists" (TM).

And my final contention, would be that the Statists exist within both political parties. To people with a Statist mindset, politics is a big game. Whoever's in power, gets the prizes - the free trips, the lobbying dollars, the four hotels on Boardwalk - and there's no doubt that the political parties will continue to oscillate in terms of who's in power at any given moment, so no one's really raising a big fuss.

Well, they've got us all hoodwinked. We yell and scream about the "media issues du jour" - yesterday it was gay marriage and flag-burning, tomorrow it'll be the liberal press and porn on the internet. But meanwhile, dollars are draining out of our bank accounts in the name of a "war" that isn't even real, and Constitutional freedoms are being assaulted in the name of a "secrecy" that isn't even needed.

I'm trying to appeal to the people in Group A - which, I'm guessing, is most of the conservatives on this forum. I'm asking you, to see the people in Group B for what they really are. My contention is, that these people are far more evil than "the liberals" (TM) will ever be. I mean, we can all probably agree on a lot of conservative principles, but the important issues are what I'm talking about here. Look how much airplay Ann Coulter is getting - and for what? 'Cause she picked on four liberal housewives. What's up with that? She's doing the same thing they did - hiring PR people to spin a few dollars their way. So why do people even listen to her drivel? She has nothing valuable to contribute to the debate on the important issues, does she? Really, she's no different from that nutball Ward Churchill, whom no one should be listening to either. So why are we seeing these people on the airwaves all the time? Whereas a guy like Ron Paul, who has a lot of intelligent things to say about foreign policy and so on, gets no airtime at all?

The reason is, because the people in Group B have been allowed to "set the political agenda" by pointing fingers everywhere but the one place they really belong - right in their own faces. My statement to all you well-meaning conservatives out there, is PLEASE, wake up. We can not allow these Statist weasels in Group B to continue destroying this great nation. And the only way they can destroy it, is if they get well-meaning people like yourselves, to buy into their inane media drivel.

Don't let them tell you what the issues are.

'Cause we all know what the issues are, right? I can point to a few of them - my gas prices are going up, my childrens' college tuition is going up, my city is being over-run by people who are crowding out my elderly neighbors from emergency room treatment, and the streets around my house are full of potholes.

And meanwhile, they're sending my neighbor's kids overseas to fight in a foreign war that has no impact on any of that stuff, except a continuing drain on their pocketbooks and a continuing stress on their families. But oh yeah, "stay the course". Don't "cut and run". Don't even "jog and run". Not until George Bush says it's okay.

I don't know about you guys and girls, but I'm getting mighty upset about this stuff. This has gone way past the comfort level, for me and most of my friends and neighbors. It's time we opened our eyes and realized who the real enemy is. It ain't the iiberals, 'cause most of 'em are clueless and out of power anyway. The people who are responsible for this stuff are the Statist weasels in Group B. Those are the people who have the most direct impact on our lives. Let's pay attention to the real priorities, and not get side-tracked by stupid stuff like gay marriage. Who cares about gay marriage? Not me. Let the gays do what they want, I couldn't care less what they do. Stuff like that doesn't impact me in the least. What impacts me is that I'm paying forty five bucks to fill my gas tank, and somehow I've got to scrounge up almost half a million bucks to give my kid a decent education. I can teach my son a respectable set of morals and values, and I don't need the government for that purpose.

In this next election, I'm going to vote for the people who understand this issue. I'm sick to death of being told what's in "my" best interest. I know what's in my best interest, and I don't need some Statist weasel to set the agenda for me.

'Nuff said.

I agree with everything you say nonsqtr but I would go a lot further.

The Zionist had control of the democratic party. Well they still do for that matter. But as a backup they always had their presence in the Neocon camp of the Republican party. They consistently delivered 90% percent of the Jewish vote to the Democrats while they were the "in" political group. After Bill Clinton "Liberal" became a dirty word and any one with any sense knew the Republicans would take power for the near future.

That's when the "real" conservatives got played big time. If you remember G.W. Bush came out of no where to take the Republican nomination. Many well known and prominent Republicans were completely overlooked. Then when he was elected it was found out these Neocons were dominated with these Zionist. It must have really pleased them that they could do much more hidden behind the "conservative" label than they ever could under the "liberal" label.

Everything they advocated while democrats have become reality much faster and without any opposition hidden under the "conservative" title. They hijacked the conservatives and played them like a violin.

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Voltaire: “Anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices.”

Rota, I assume you've read the Walt/Mearsheimer paper on AIPAC?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Isr...Foreign_Policy

Your theory is entirely unfounded and unreasonable. Firstly one should ask, "what is Zionism?" Zionism is the philosophy/belief that a Jewish homeland/state must be brought into existence. Because such a thing has been brought into being in the form of Israel the modern-day Zionist movement mainly occupies itself with the goal of protecting Israel's existence etc. Zionism being a purely nationalist movement has no reason anymore to interfere with the politics of other nations where Israel isnt an issue. America being a nation that supports and recognizes Israel (out of spiritual bond I think) is no longer a priority for Zionists. On the contrary US/Israeli relations have become more a problem to Palestinian sympathizers and anti-Semetists. The reason the Republican Party would have a big vote from the Jewish community would most likely be due to the conservative and traditionalist views they both share in common. The Democrats recieve votes from Jews out of the hope that Joe Lieberman might someday have a shot at becoming President. Anything accusing Zionism of being internationalist or a "world domination plot" is nothing more than racism, anti-Semetism, and/or ignorance (stupidity to but take your pick).

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“Capitalism cannot reform itself; it is doomed to self-destruction. No universal selfishness can bring social good to all.” —Dr. W.E.B. Du Bois

I have no need to go over all that again. There are many threads here I have participated in that discuss that very topic. I decline to pick the label you want to pin me with since I've had all of them pinned on me at one time or another so it doesn't matter at all.

However for you to call zionism a national thing is laughable at best. A recent study from Harvard or some similar institution went into detail about it. I suppose the many Israei influence peddlers including AIPAC are just innocent groups in Washington making sure no one questions the 6 million holocaust number of dead. I would invite you to participate in my new thread about this here:
http://www.politicalforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=18048

__________________
Voltaire: “Anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices.”

The kicker is that if Zionists, a minority in the support base for either party, are the single biggest group in deciding US foreign policy... that means no other large group actually cares... or the other big groups agree.
A minority cannot take control of the majority in a pluralistic society without having a (*)(*)(*)(*) good argument that their way works for the majority.
So even if our entire foreign policy is mandated by Zionists, it is working with the goals of the majority of interest groups that care one way or the other. Otherwise we'd see more opposition.
And strangely many of them seem to be against the war in Iraq. Many who are very pro-Israel. How can you explain a massive piece of foreign policy that a good chunk of the group you believe runs things does not like it?

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And I do not need to know.

Get your daily dose of truth*

* or something approximating it

Your entire post was disingenuous, and here is why:

In other words, "the good conservatives"

In other words, "the bad conservatives".

What is really funny is that you probably honestly believe you are being fair and unbiased...

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My Political Blog (Most recent update Oct 3rd) - Which Flame Warrior are you?

Point Sadistic


(tennis analogy humor)

Does the truth sting?

Sure they can. Get the majority of post graduate degress and place your people in the "gatekeeper positions and you are the boss. simple.


Zionist are not the same things as Jews. Sure you will find Jews against the war but not many Zionists.

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Voltaire: “Anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices.”

Hey, I'm not Bill O'Really.

And this is not a no-spin zone.

No, I'm merely trying to get people to think, about what their true values are.

After all, we should all be aware that many people on thie forum simply regurgitate what they hear on the news (and in some cases, what they hear in the talking points).

I myself, happen to distrust big government, and above all, I distrust placing enormous power in the hands of one man.

I believe in checks and balances, and I believe in the wisdom of the Founding Fathers in that regard.

Had I been alive in 1776, I definitely would not have been a monarchist.

Yes Virginia, there are good Republicans and there are bad Republicans. A lot of the bad ones are landing in jail these days. And if you look carefully, you'll discover that they're all "big government" types.