Thread: Explain to me how tax cuts to big business and the rich helps create jobs.

Heck, the republicans no longer call the rich... rich... But instead now "job creators"...

But the thing is the big businesses and often small ones right now are actually doing better than ever. Profits are up. Taxes are lower than ever. The money is in.

What do we get from this? Nothing.

The rich and businesses are actually doing great right now with the economy basically mostly affecting the lower and middle classes. The businesses are getting better and better at doing more and more and making more and more with less and less people. There's no incentive to hire anybody else because there's simply no reason to. It's often actually a boon to profits!



This is all mostly in the private sector. Frankly most of the private sector doesn't actually need to hire anybody else. And if you look at our recent history of tax cuts employment has been going DOWN as taxes go down.



Then you could look at the public sector. A lot of people want cuts that would result in the firing of potentially millions of public sector workers. What they don't seem to realize is that the public sector is a large force in the economy. When those people are fired the jobs simply disappear. With the current trend of the private sector not actually having many jobs available it'll just lead to a WORSE economy with HIGHER unemployment and LESS spending within the economy by the lower and middle classes.


Basically, the big businesses and rich are NOT job creators. The processes have become too good. They don't need to hire people to make massive amounts of record breaking money like they are right now.
Cutting jobs from the public sector will not result in much of anything beneficial. The private sector is not ready to absorb those jobs. The private sector is currently in the rut and no tax decreases will change that. Instead nothing but more job DESTRUCTION will come of these plans.


Mark my words, the current Republican plans would be just as damaging and unhelpful as the Bush years, probably significantly more so.
The key to helping the economy is helping the lower and middle class rise back up through creating incentive for businesses to hire more people, not firing them, not giving them massive pay cuts which leads to just less spending.
For years we've been DESTROYING jobs. Right now they're just gone. The rich and big businesses have no reason to hire anybody else.

The economy could mostly be fixed by job creation which the rich and big business are not. We MUST create incentive for job creation. Lowering taxes and cuts are usually COUNTER PRODUCTIVE. Job destruction through cuts is always COUNTER PRODUCTIVE. The middle class is key to the economy and is currently the most abused class paying the largest portion of taxes (as percent of their income) and disappearing. Instead our current path seems to want to continue to help only the upper rich class and the big businesses while shoving as much of the middle class to the lower class which screaming "You're too greedy! Cuts! Corporate tax breaks!"....




I'd like to see some alternative plans for job creation. Again, tax cuts and cuts in general will not work. The companies are doing better than ever. Taxes are lower than ever. Just continuing the Bush trend would be idiotic and ineffective.

It has been proven over and over that it DOESN"T.

The problem isn't that businesses currently want a tax cut. They think taxes as they are right now are just fine.

Why do you keep pushing this lie?

Repealing the Bush Tax Cuts for just those making 250k a year is a useless, class warfare gesture designed to make foolish people like you two feel like someone finally stuck it to those rich (*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)s. While the entire time the Government bureaucracy sucks up your tax money through lavish retirement, pension, medical and other government benefits, aided of course by the ever willing entitlement underclass.

As long as Obamacare is in office, and the Democrats and their bureaucratic bullies continue to wage economic warfare on American Business then we'll be lucky to see 3% growth until after 2016 elections when hopefully a real President, be they Democrat or Republican comes to the fore.

Originally Posted by SiliconMagician

The problem isn't that businesses currently want a tax cut. They think taxes as they are right now are just fine.

Of course they do, they are the lowest ever... What a surprise.

The fact is tax cuts to big business havent created jobs, they arent creating jobs and they wont create jobs.

Originally Posted by SiliconMagician

The problem isn't that businesses currently want a tax cut. They think taxes as they are right now are just fine.

Why do you keep pushing this lie?

It's shown everywhere that Republicans on average want more tax cuts. Even much of the ones in Congress. They just don't bother because it's got no chance of happening but it's still commonly proposed.

Right now I think they're holding back a bit because the Public would outcry if they put in a serious tax cut plan. But the balanced taxes plan they just put out DOES have some tax cuts. :P

So it's not a lie. Not at all.


I could also argue that employment was higher when the taxes were higher and has steadily been going down with taxes. And the continuation of the Bush Tax Cuts as part of a compromise by Obama (but mostly supported by Republicans) was in my eyes just a continuation of tax cuts that should have been repealed because they proved 100% ineffective in everything they claimed it would do. Why keep a broken law?

Originally Posted by SiliconMagician

Repealing the Bush Tax Cuts for just those making 250k a year is a useless, class warfare gesture designed to make foolish people like you two feel like someone finally stuck it to those rich (*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)s. While the entire time the Government bureaucracy sucks up your tax money through lavish retirement, pension, medical and other government benefits, aided of course by the ever willing entitlement underclass.

Why is it class warfare when it's something that's more against the rich and it's "they're being greedy" when it's against the lower and middle classes?
The evidence is there. The warfare is being brought onto the suffering lower and middle classes who are at a 1920s level while the rich are richer than ever. This is undeniable. These are the true statistics. If class warfare is truly happening the rich sure ain't hurt. They're doing nothing but benefit while the poor and middle class fall farther and farther. So I say you've fallen for the bullcrap like so many other people out there who have no actual grasp on the reality of this situation.

Originally Posted by ModerateG

It's shown everywhere that Republicans on average want more tax cuts. Even much of the ones in Congress. They just don't bother because it's got no chance of happening but it's still commonly proposed.

Right now I think they're holding back a bit because the Public would outcry if they put in a serious tax cut plan. But the balanced taxes plan they just put out DOES have some tax cuts. :P

So it's not a lie. Not at all.

It is shown everywhere that you do lie. It's is shown everywhere that liberals have only one solution for what they perceive as a problem: tax and spend. If it doesn't solve the perceived problem: tax and spend even more. Hey, it's been shown everywhere.

Liberals repeating each other in a circle jerk to not constitute evidence or proof. How create jobs and fuel the liberal (*)(*)(*)(*)ups? The hated private sector.

Originally Posted by SiliconMagician

The problem isn't that businesses currently want a tax cut. They think taxes as they are right now are just fine.

Why do you keep pushing this lie?

Repealing the Bush Tax Cuts for just those making 250k a year is a useless, class warfare gesture designed to make foolish people like you two feel like someone finally stuck it to those rich (*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)s. While the entire time the Government bureaucracy sucks up your tax money through lavish retirement, pension, medical and other government benefits, aided of course by the ever willing entitlement underclass.

As long as Obamacare is in office, and the Democrats and their bureaucratic bullies continue to wage economic warfare on American Business then we'll be lucky to see 3% growth until after 2016 elections when hopefully a real President, be they Democrat or Republican comes to the fore.

So in other words our tax policy should be based on the feelings and emotions of big business. Not actually the effect is has on our economy. Gotcha. So if higher taxes simply means more revenue and not less jobs we shouldn't raise taxes because it might hurt big business's feelings.

Originally Posted by TheTaoOfBill

So in other words our tax policy should be based on the feelings and emotions of big business. Not actually the effect is has on our economy. Gotcha. So if higher taxes simply means more revenue and not less jobs we shouldn't raise taxes because it might hurt big business's feelings.

Exactly. Now you've got it.

Originally Posted by ModerateG

Heck, the republicans no longer call the rich... rich... But instead now "job creators"...

But the thing is the big businesses and often small ones right now are actually doing better than ever. Profits are up. Taxes are lower than ever. The money is in.

What do we get from this? Nothing.

The rich and businesses are actually doing great right now with the economy basically mostly affecting the lower and middle classes. The businesses are getting better and better at doing more and more and making more and more with less and less people. There's no incentive to hire anybody else because there's simply no reason to. It's often actually a boon to profits!



This is all mostly in the private sector. Frankly most of the private sector doesn't actually need to hire anybody else. And if you look at our recent history of tax cuts employment has been going DOWN as taxes go down.



Then you could look at the public sector. A lot of people want cuts that would result in the firing of potentially millions of public sector workers. What they don't seem to realize is that the public sector is a large force in the economy. When those people are fired the jobs simply disappear. With the current trend of the private sector not actually having many jobs available it'll just lead to a WORSE economy with HIGHER unemployment and LESS spending within the economy by the lower and middle classes.


Basically, the big businesses and rich are NOT job creators. The processes have become too good. They don't need to hire people to make massive amounts of record breaking money like they are right now.
Cutting jobs from the public sector will not result in much of anything beneficial. The private sector is not ready to absorb those jobs. The private sector is currently in the rut and no tax decreases will change that. Instead nothing but more job DESTRUCTION will come of these plans.


Mark my words, the current Republican plans would be just as damaging and unhelpful as the Bush years, probably significantly more so.
The key to helping the economy is helping the lower and middle class rise back up through creating incentive for businesses to hire more people, not firing them, not giving them massive pay cuts which leads to just less spending.
For years we've been DESTROYING jobs. Right now they're just gone. The rich and big businesses have no reason to hire anybody else.

The economy could mostly be fixed by job creation which the rich and big business are not. We MUST create incentive for job creation. Lowering taxes and cuts are usually COUNTER PRODUCTIVE. Job destruction through cuts is always COUNTER PRODUCTIVE. The middle class is key to the economy and is currently the most abused class paying the largest portion of taxes (as percent of their income) and disappearing. Instead our current path seems to want to continue to help only the upper rich class and the big businesses while shoving as much of the middle class to the lower class which screaming "You're too greedy! Cuts! Corporate tax breaks!"....




I'd like to see some alternative plans for job creation. Again, tax cuts and cuts in general will not work. The companies are doing better than ever. Taxes are lower than ever. Just continuing the Bush trend would be idiotic and ineffective.

It seems you advocating for increasing demand which can be done by increasing wages and hiring people.

You are right that 67% of our jobs and creativity come from small companies where the owner makes 250k or less a year. So the middle class is how you drive the economy. We need hire wages and reduction on taxes of the middle class.

However Republican indoctrination only believes in helping the super rich so that won't happen anytime soon.

Originally Posted by ModerateG

big businesses and often small ones right now are actually doing better than ever. Profits are up

This is highly dubious. Source?

Originally Posted by ModerateG

no incentive to hire anybody else because there's simply no reason to. It's often actually a boon to profits

This is because of the current downturn in aggregate demand. Businesses have less incentive to expand when people can't afford to buy as much.

Originally Posted by ModerateG

employment has been going DOWN as taxes go down

We've been cutting taxes recently because employment has dropped, not the other way around.

Originally Posted by ModerateG

big businesses and rich are NOT job creators

Big businesses employ 38% of the workforce.

Originally Posted by ModerateG

private sector is currently in the rut and no tax decreases will change that

Since cutting taxes makes things easier for every business in the country, it's the most basic way of raising aggregate supply, which expands business, raising salaries/wages and lowering prices.

Originally Posted by ModerateG

middle class is key to the economy and is currently the most abused class paying the largest portion of taxes (as percent of their income)

The richer you are, the higher your income tax percentage in the USA: http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/rp-11-12.pdf

Originally Posted by ModerateG

alternative plans for job creation

The Recovery Act is a good example.