If we're talking about Romney and Mormonism (maybe we aren't, I don't know), then I encourage people to find out as much as they can about it....you might find that it's not as mainstream as most people think...but I don't know enough about it to really go into detail about it.

He'll have to explain the whole 4 wives part (not practiced by most Mormons, but we still want to know more about it, from Romney himself.)

I like what I've seen of him personally, for the record.

Speaking of allowing 4 wives, there is ANOTHER religion that expressely allows that to this day, in .many many countries, especially in the Middle East.

It says to kill people who leave or criticize the religion, and followers DEFINITELY follow those instructions today, some 1400 years after the order was given....just google that, you'll see! Does that qualify as a cult? I think so.

Cults often display irrational behavior, and defending the founder when he had sex with a 9 year-old girl surely has to qualify (her name was Aisha) as irrational. I've never encountered a member of that religion who has said, "yes, it was dead wrong, and I wholehearted CONDEMN our prophet for pedophelia when he was 56 years old, and I've just removed that part - and the part about death to apostates - from my religious texts." You'll never hear them say that...never. If they believed that, then they'd probably leave the religion anyway. See my point? So most of them today don't believe the quote I just mentioned above. There twisted justifications for pedophelia and death to apostates is a sight to behold.

I like them personally, but question their thought-process.

Comments?

The weird things about Mormonism are irrelevant... because they are not practiced... pretty much ever.
This is also why the complaints about inherent evil of Islam fall on deaf ears. If Mormons can ignore all their baggage and live good lives... so can Muslims... if only the backwardness of tribal culture can be displaced by democracy and progress.

__________________
"Man lives in the sunlit world of that which he believes to be reality. But unseen by most is an underworld, a place that is just as real... but not as brightly lit... A DARK SIDE!"
-opening from Tales From the Darkside

I think you and Raytri have the most reasoned posts on this forum, so thanks for your input.

However, the Koran is the immutable word of god, Muslims believe (try openly REFORMING it, and see how soon you'd get killed!) Mormon beliefs....aren't they more of a guide?? I'd like to know.

Christianity underwent a reformation. Islam has not, hence much of the reason why Muslims are 3500% more likely to be terrorists than the average person. No one has shown me what the " real number" is on the other thread I did, by the way...they only say it's not 3500%.)

Also, certain OTHER cultures around the globe have a tribal mentality like you mention, and we aren't having to fight them in a war on terror, since a central part of their religious texts don't refer to JIHAD against non-believers and apostates. The Koran, 480 times, calls Muslims to Jihad.

Keep those comments coming, folks.

Being not a religious person, I tend to be able to look at the truth in positive terms that overall people are humans before they are slaves to their religions.
People have the ability to twist and turn religion anyway they want. Just look at Calvinism... How did anyone manage to turn Christianity into a religion that says the poor are (*)(*)(*)(*)ed and the wealthy are saved? Did he miss the camel/needlehole verse?
It's psychology.

There's a Newsweek article about Muslim punks. The punks that were spoken to were not very dogmatic and paid little attention to the book. They had a "personal relationship with Allah"... They'd be considered heretics in many parts of the Middle East, probably killed.
We hear more and more from liberal Muslims like the one in Sadistic's thread in current events.. and the lesbian one I posted about a while back.
And the Pew Research, while showing some disturbing things, also showed us clear differences between American Muslims and others.

Religion ultimately is not about words. It's about what individuals need from it and what they make it into.
The culture of most Muslim countries is the problem. But there are some in those nations that want change... and in any such situation, most people are rather inactive. It's all a matter of which active group is biggest and who the masses sympathize with... usually the group that makes them feel safest.
It is our best bet to boost the power of progressive Muslims and defuse the propaganda of the status quo.

It won't happen overnight... but as the world changes, so does religion. The chaos and tyranny of the Middle East has allowed the elites to hide the changes in the world or twist them into something to fear.

__________________
"Man lives in the sunlit world of that which he believes to be reality. But unseen by most is an underworld, a place that is just as real... but not as brightly lit... A DARK SIDE!"
-opening from Tales From the Darkside

JavaBlack: you make a lot of sense, but the problem is that while there are moderate Muslims, their is no moderate Islam (the beautiful and articulate Ayaan Hirsi Ali has said that, I believe.)

Jordan is considered "moderate" but they still follow the Islamic texts so much that if you, a NON-Muslim, and your (say) very well-qualified spouse were from Jordan, and you fell in love with a special-needs ORPHAN in Jordan, THEY WOULDN'T LET YOU ADOPT THE ORPHAN!! (Well I suppose they COULD, but then since you'd likely change the child's religion out of Islam, they'd have to KILL you...this is why you can't adopt an orphan in Islam.) INCREDIBLE.

Also, if you WERE Muslim, they wouldn't let you give your newly adopted child your last name (crazy but true), since someone 1400 years ago forbade this, specifically.

Do you see the insanity of this? From a "moderate", US-friendly Muslim nation.

They just can't get away from the basic tenants of Islam w/out leaving/reforming it, since it's the word of god.

Comments?

Why all this talk about AMERICAN Muslims, they only make up, what, not even 4% of all Muslims??

They were willing to move to, or at least not leave, the "Great Satan" (Hezbollah's leaders words), so of course they are going to be more moderate than the average Muslim world-wide.

But you might as well talk about how moderate the Muslims are who live in Barrow Alaska, because they're about as relevant as the Muslims that live in America are (to the global war on Islam.)

Comments? If I'm wrong, then as always, please show me where, as I want to learn/grow.

Freedom Seeker, this forum is not the place to be bashing Islam, you have started dozens of other ones where you can do that. This is about cults and neo-cons.

I'm tired and not totally following though, which candidate are we talking about who is supposedly in a cult? Please don't tell me we're talking about Romney, Mormonism is not a cult, I'll admit that many of it's practices are pretty weird, but it is not a cult. But I'll agree that Neo-Conservatism is...to a degree.

Those who go after other religions better be able to defend theirs.

Many people have scratched their heads at the definition of a cult and the similarities of Romney's "faith" - right down to the required handing over of money and claiming a "golden" tablet and "living" prophets.

How do the neocons like it?

Hey! Vhat's wronk vith beink Cherman?

__________________
Theodore Lamar Heiks
BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
MBA, Entrepreneurship/Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993

Repubs and neo-cons do tend to be very much into order and loyalty to leaders (as opposed to the Demos, who are very disorganized as a party) and they are politically on the right. But there, admittedly, the (very superficial) comparison to the Nazis stops, unless there are a few minor details I've missed. But there is one major difference: the Nazis killed their left-wing opponents, the Commies, but the Repubs don't kill their left-wing opponents, the Demos (even if they'd like to sometimes ). That is because, in our system, we try to settle matters peacefully, whereas it is okay to kill your opponents in totalitarian systems.

__________________
Theodore Lamar Heiks
BA, History/Political Science, Western State College of Colorado, 1984
MBA, Entrepreneurship/Marketing, City University of Seattle, 1993