Thread: Outsourcing is not about competition, it's about maximising dividends

Originally Posted by Taxpayer

It's not slavery, folks are free to leave those jobs should they find the working conditions unsatisfactory. If you honestly believe these folks have no alternative to these jobs but starvation, I find it hard to understand why you want to take that alternative away from them.

No they aren't. You apparently haven't read very much about worker abuses in these factories. Many of them are basically self-contained compounds that the workers are banned from leaving. They can't just quit. If they could jus quit, they wouldn't have record breaking numbers of suicides.

As for your second comment, I don't want America to be party to it. Slavery is just about the most anti-American thing that can possibly exist, tied with dictatorship in my opinion. If I had my way, all trade between the US and China would cease until they democratized.

Originally Posted by Questerr

No they aren't. You apparently haven't read very much about worker abuses in these factories. Many of them are basically self-contained compounds that the workers are banned from leaving. They can't just quit. If they could jus quit, they wouldn't have record breaking numbers of suicides.

As for your second comment, I don't want America to be party to it. Slavery is just about the most anti-American thing that can possibly exist, tied with dictatorship in my opinion. If I had my way, all trade between the US and China would cease until they democratized.

Are you referring to the requirement to remain on campus during the work week? That's not the same as forced labor or preventing folks from quitting the company. Medical doctors, fire fighters, and soldiers have similar requirements. Suicide rates are very high among postal workers, this does not mean the U.S. postal service practices slavery.

A political system other than democracy is not the equivalent of slavery or necessarily a dictatorship. You are free to your prejudice against Chinese, but that prejudice isn't an excuse for dishonestly labeling people as slaves or governments as dictatorships.

It's a bit odd how people are defending labor conditions where suicide is prevalent but then are condemning labor conditions where it isn't....

Folks, let's get something straight here. It's not our regulations that cause outsourcing in low skill manufacturing.

It's comparative advantage. This is economics 101.

Protectionism isn't the answer, but neither is deregulation. The answer is educating your workforce to adjust to America's comparative advantage -- high skill labor.

Originally Posted by Serfin' USA

It's a bit odd how people are defending labor conditions where suicide is prevalent but then are condemning labor conditions where it isn't....

Folks, let's get something straight here. It's not our regulations that cause outsourcing in low skill manufacturing.

It's comparative advantage. This is economics 101.

Protectionism isn't the answer, but neither is deregulation. The answer is educating your workforce to adjust to America's comparative advantage -- high skill labor.

The only problem I see with this is that not everyone will be able to adjust. But regardless of weather those people adjust or not, they still need to live. They need a roof over their head, food in their bellies, and clothes to wear at the very least.

And if all our high paying jobs are outsourced, and the low paying jobs do not pay enough to cover these costs, then how are they going to live? Are we going to subsidize those costs onto the American taxpayer? If not, are you okay with telling those people to their faces 'You are boned, we are not helping you'?. Is the cost of not helping them less than the cost to help them?

Answers to these questions would make the decision a lot easier, in my opinion.

Originally Posted by Taxcutter

You know companies offshore for a reason. The US makes it so difficult to make a buck here.

Way to go 100% ignoring the facts of the matter as clearly stated in the OP.

If the iPhone 4G was made in the US, the phone would still be the most profitable phone in the world.

Fact.

Originally Posted by Serfin' USA

I agree with you to a point, but it also demonstrates how the complaints about outsourcing are somewhat stupid.

Exactly the point I was trying to make in this thread. The very people who complain that Obama isn't doing enough to keep jobs in the US, are the very same people as those who support outsourcing on the basis of profit.

It's not a matter of competition, it's a matter of profit maximisation.

Apple could still be world leader and make their products in the US, they simply chose to maximise profits by producing elsewhere. They will always do this if there's another country in the world, which can manufacture more cheaply than the US. There will always be a country in the world which is capable of manufacturing more cheaply than the US - unless the US becomes a 3rd world country. These are the simple facts of the matter.

Originally Posted by Serfin' USA

It's a bit odd how people are defending labor conditions where suicide is prevalent but then are condemning labor conditions where it isn't....

Folks, let's get something straight here. It's not our regulations that cause outsourcing in low skill manufacturing.

It's comparative advantage. This is economics 101.

Protectionism isn't the answer, but neither is deregulation. The answer is educating your workforce to adjust to America's comparative advantage -- high skill labor.

I'm amazed that tech products require so much man-power to manufacture. Aren't these places automated? Don't robots and computers manufacture electronic gizmo's nowadays? Surely the people asspect is in the design, build and maintenance of machines, and in supplying components and warehousing?

What do all these Chinese people do in an Apple factory?

Originally Posted by Serfin' USA

It's a bit odd how people are defending labor conditions where suicide is prevalent but then are condemning labor conditions where it isn't....

Folks, let's get something straight here. It's not our regulations that cause outsourcing in low skill manufacturing.

It's comparative advantage. This is economics 101.

Protectionism isn't the answer, but neither is deregulation. The answer is educating your workforce to adjust to America's comparative advantage -- high skill labor.

The skill level in China is rapidly increasing so more jobs will continue to be lost. I wonder when the white-collar jobs are replaced if the same attitude will remain in the corporate world. To help the country that will replace us as the main superpower within 20 year seems illogical. I am fairly sure they will not repay the favor when they do.

Originally Posted by Leffe

...This is not a pop at the rich, it is a demonstration that it is not US government policy which is driving many of your job woes, it is corporate greed.

Money tends to corrupt! Greed and power mixed with government leads to oppression. People need to accept that, and apply the necessary controls and regulations to what corporations are allowed to do. The FANTASY of unregulated commerce and business, needs to be laid to rest for the sake of this entire society's well-being.

What lame defenses for the hyperbolic lie of slavery. Have you ever bothered to read Uncle Tom's Cabin or Roots? Chinese workers may have to stay on-campus during their work week but at the end of the week they can go anyplace they like. The claim of "slavery" is just a lie.

Government oppresses, not the private sector.

Again, the treatment of a non-profitable GM shows why making as much profit as possible is mandatory.