Thread: Foreigners and Anti-Semitism

Originally Posted by Ethereal

I am just generalizing. To be honest, I haven't debated the whole Israel-Palestine thing in a long while and this thread was the result of a certain Brit who routinely posts anti-Jewish threads. I mentioned Brits and Aussies specifically because I vaguely recollect them as being the most anti-"Zionist" individuals. So, yes, I will admit my generalization was hasty and unfounded, but I still think there is some substance there. I am genuinely curious as to why Europeans and the like seem to side with the "Palestinians" who, in my opinion, are a fabricated people. In reality, they're just Arabs, Jordanian Arabs, if you want to be specific about it. Why are they the pet project of so many Euros on this forum? What's so special about them?

Look, in so many ways - some of which I explained - I am appalled and disgusted by antisemitism, even to the extent of being offended by derogatory references to 'the Jews'. So I can understand anybody taking offence at what appears to be blatant antisemitism. I am not criticising you, in some ways I admire you for defending Jewish people - I have some understanding why you would do so.

But you must forgive me if I suggest that you are perhaps misinterpreting some opinions posted on these pages as antisemitism, whereas they are simply critical of the actions of the state of Israel. I do not know if you are aware of this, but it is a particularly British characteristic to take the part of the underdog - and we see the Palestinians as facing unequal odds. As far as I can see, Americans tend to admire success, and will tend to similar admiration for victors - irrespective of the circumstances. Perhaps this might explain the alignment of the majority of Americans with the state of Israel. I am not criticising either stance, simply trying to explain them.

As to the legitimacy or otherwise of the designation Palestinian, it is of no importance to me. All I see is human beings who are being disadvantaged by a nation which enjoys greater force, and the support of the world's most powerful military nation. I am sympathetic to anyone in that situation. Little Palestinian children are no less little children, and as worthy of protection as little Israeli children.

And may I take this opportunity of thanking you for your polite and reasoned response to my post.

Originally Posted by ryanm34

Wow that sounds exactly like my understanding of SF. But they are also socialist and therefore even more evil.

If that is what SF believes, than anyone who votes for them is not deserving of an ounce of empathy or sympathy. Irrational hatred is irrational hatred and I do not "empathize" with anyone who supports it, directly or indirectly.

Originally Posted by ryanm34

What about the people of NI consistently voting for SF? The political wing of the IRA? Does their election of terrorists and gunrunners mean I cannot sympathies with them or support their cause?

I was going to bring up Sinn Fein and Gerry Adams a few pages back, but thought better let sleeping dogs lie.

Originally Posted by lizarddust

I was going to bring up Sinn Fein and Gerry Adams a few pages back, but thought better let sleeping dogs lie.

They nominated Martin McGuinness, Second in Command of the IRA in derry, for the presidency last year. They are absolutely shameless.

Originally Posted by Leo2

But you must forgive me if I suggest that you are perhaps misinterpreting some opinions posted on these pages as antisemitism, whereas they are simply critical of the actions of the state of Israel. I do not know if you are aware of this, but it is a particularly British characteristic to take the part of the underdog - and we see the Palestinians as facing unequal odds. As far as I can see, Americans tend to admire success, and will tend to similar admiration for victors - irrespective of the circumstances. Perhaps this might explain the alignment of the majority of Americans with the state of Israel. I am not criticising either stance, simply trying to explain them.

Taking out of context Palestinians do look like underdogs. That's if we ignore the fact that they are supported by 23 arabs states who not only support the Palestinian cause but are dead set on wiping Israel off the map one way or another. Israel occupies 0.2% of the Middle Eastern land and is outnumbered 75:1 against Arabs only (never mind not-arab muslims like Iranians etc). It was the arabs who rejected the partition resolution in 1948, it was the arabs who rejected the land for peace resolution in 1967, it's still the arab world that refuses to recognize Israel's right to exist. Who is the real undergod?

Originally Posted by Borat

Taking out of context Palestinians do look like underdogs. That's if we ignore the fact that they are supported by 23 arabs states who not only support the Palestinian cause but are dead set on wiping Israel off the map one way or another. Israel occupies 0.2% of the Middle Eastern land and is outnumbered 75:1 against Arabs only (never mind not-arab muslims like Iranians etc). It was the arabs who rejected the partition resolution in 1948, it was the arabs who rejected the land for peace resolution in 1967, it's still the arab world that refuses to recognize Israel's right to exist. Who is the real undergod?

Palestinians are NOT 23 other Arab states.. They are just people who have lived in Palestine for 3000 years and planted all those 400 year old olive trees.

Originally Posted by Leo2

Look, in so many ways - some of which I explained - I am appalled and disgusted by antisemitism, even to the extent of being offended by derogatory references to 'the Jews'. So I can understand anybody taking offence at what appears to be blatant antisemitism. I am not criticising you, in some ways I admire you for defending Jewish people - I have some understanding why you would do so.

But you must forgive me if I suggest that you are perhaps misinterpreting some opinions posted on these pages as antisemitism, whereas they are simply critical of the actions of the state of Israel. I do not know if you are aware of this, but it is a particularly British characteristic to take the part of the underdog - and we see the Palestinians as facing unequal odds. As far as I can see, Americans tend to admire success, and will tend to similar admiration for victors - irrespective of the circumstances. Perhaps this might explain the alignment of the majority of Americans with the state of Israel. I am not criticising either stance, simply trying to explain them.

As to the legitimacy or otherwise of the designation Palestinian, it is of no importance to me. All I see is human beings who are being disadvantaged by a nation which enjoys greater force, and the support of the world's most powerful military nation. I am sympathetic to anyone in that situation. Little Palestinian children are no less little children, and as worthy of protection as little Israeli children.

And may I take this opportunity of thanking you for your polite and reasoned response to my post.

Well, you see, I am also an ardent defender of the underdog, and in my humble opinion, the poor Jewish people are history's ultimate underdog. Their entire existence has been plagued by Biblical propaganda and the like. That's why my favorite Shakespeare character of all time is Shylock! I empathize with him a great deal...

Israel is just a TINY little sliver of land in an ocean of Islamic countries. Why can't the "Palestinians" just cede to the Jews that tiny little piece of land? Why can't they just rejoin with Jordan and peacefully coexist with the Israelis? I think the answer is obvious. They are, by and large, religious fanatics, no different than the right-wing Christian zealots who think Jew bankers run the world. They have been systematically brainwashed by the Islamist terror network into believing Jews are subhuman rats and pigs and dogs. And I find it perplexing why so many "leftists" refuse to see this! Why are they so critical of American Christian zealots, but so "empathetic" towards Islamic zealots? To me, religious fanaticism is bad no matter who it is...

Originally Posted by Margot

Palestinians are NOT 23 other Arab states.

Dozens of arab states attacked Israel in 1948 and 1967 on behalf of the Palestinians. You can't have it both ways, they are hardly underdogs if countries with combined population of 350 million people send armies to fight for them.

Originally Posted by Borat

Dozens of arab states attacked Israel in 1948 and 1967 on behalf of the Palestinians. You can't have it both ways, they are hardly underdogs if countries with combined population of 350 million people send armies to fight for them.

LOLOL.. No they didn't ..

The Arabs basically had NO armies in 1948..

You inflate your enemy.. what else is new.

Originally Posted by Borat

Dozens of arab states attacked Israel in 1948 and 1967 on behalf of the Palestinians. You can't have it both ways, they are hardly underdogs if countries with combined population of 350 million people send armies to fight for them.

Indeed! The Jews have been bullied and attacked for thousands of years! Why can't the Islamic world just let them have a home, a relatively tiny one at that? Will they only be satisfied if the Jews are running scared around the world, desperately searching for a place to call home like they have been for the past five thousand years?