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Old 03-27-2008, 02:41 PM
Publius Infinitum Publius Infinitum is offline
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Default In the Absence of God: Human rights is a concept without meaning...

We've heard many people in here defend this or that activity because it's legal... we've heard them declare that this or that activity SHOULD BE made legal despite the historical taboo against it...

One of the things that strikes me about the bulk of these people is that they always make these claims on the basis that what is legal, is by default, right and just... This is the mindset of the collectivist, who believes that rights come from the government, the Constitution or some similar secularist origin...

Below is a scenario aimed specifically at our secular humanist members... read the scenario and provide for us your reactions...

The Scenario: This morning you awoke to find that the government has determined that Atheists do not have a right to life; that they are to be killed on sight or for those unable to do so, they're to be turned into the gov't for summary execution.

There US Supreme Court, the Federal Legislature and most state governments were decimated by 9:00 am by the more heads up citizens who realized that there were four humanist on the SCOTUS and the Congress and Senate were indeed target rich environments... So a speedy appeal is NOT looking good.

Since you believe that what is legal is right and just and that government determines the scope of human and civil rights, you're without a right to life and presumed persona non grata.

You walk over to the kitchen counter to fix a cup of coffee to clear your head and you see your neighbor seeing you... he's armed and walking your way...

What's your next move? OH... and why?

Last edited by Publius Infinitum; 03-27-2008 at 02:44 PM.
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Old 03-27-2008, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Publius Infinitum View Post
We've heard many people in here defend this or that activity because it's legal... we've heard them declare that this or that activity SHOULD BE made legal despite the historical taboo against it...

One of the things that strikes me about the bulk of these people is that they always make these claims on the basis that what is legal, is by default, right and just... This is the mindset of the collectivist, who believes that rights come from the government, the Constitution or some similar secularist origin...

Below is a scenario aimed specifically at our secular humanist members... read the scenario and provide for us your reactions...

The Scenario: This morning you awoke to find that the government has determined that Atheists do not have a right to life; that they are to be killed on sight or for those unable to do so, they're to be turned into the gov't for summary execution.

There US Supreme Court, the Federal Legislature and most state governments were decimated by 9:00 am by the more heads up citizens who realized that there were four humanist on the SCOTUS and the Congress and Senate were indeed target rich environments... So a speedy appeal is NOT looking good.

Since you believe that what is legal is right and just and that government determines the scope of human and civil rights, you're without a right to life and presumed persona non grata.

You walk over to the kitchen counter to fix a cup of coffee to clear your head and you see your neighbor seeing you... he's armed and walking your way...

What's your next move? OH... and why?

My first response! Never respond to the nonsense you go on about, with serious answers!

So what I would do is summon an army of zombie vampires to help me take over the planet from the new terrible government!!
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Old 03-28-2008, 07:31 AM
Publius Infinitum Publius Infinitum is offline
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Isn't it wild how the left can't respond to this simple scenario?

Friends their absence and refusal to engage here, makes this the most illustrative thread on the vacuous leftist ideology in the history of this site.

Ixtellor just spent three DAYS informing us of his total lack of concern for the plight of the unborn, because the unborn does NOT enjoy the protections of the LAW...

Yet she can't come here and explain how she would react to the law removing protections for HER life...

The list of those who have adhered to the same on this site is endless, and not one possesses the courage to face their own principles...

ROFLMNAO...

Leftists...

Last edited by Publius Infinitum; 03-28-2008 at 07:32 AM.
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Old 03-28-2008, 07:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Publius Infinitum View Post
The Scenario: This morning you awoke to find that the government has determined that Atheists do not have a right to life; that they are to be killed on sight or for those unable to do so, they're to be turned into the gov't for summary execution.
How exactly do you know an athiest by sight?

But getting beyond the willing suspension of disbelief (you'd have to have the kind of tyrant who thinks people only act moral with God in order to have a result like this- that's what makes it comical), I don't see how that changes anything about human rights.
At that point the social contract turns against my right to live or to have religious freedom.
That means for some reason society went retarded and decided these rights are superceded by some nonsensical ideology that athiests are dangerous or whatnot... similarly how we determine criminals have no freedom (if rights are inalienable, how do criminals lose them).

Why am I supposed to think God is a better answer? If this were the law, no amount of praying would change the fact that my life was forfeit (well... actually it might. If I prayed, people wouldn't think I was an athiest). God is irrelevant.
So what does it all mean?
That no rights can be taken for granted. All of our rights are subject to the worldview of the population. This is true regardless of religion or political system. God does nothing to ensure rights. Nor does any constitution unless it has legitimacy with the people.

Not a very sunshiny answer, is it? If I say something is my right, it does not matter when the people decide I don't have it. I can try to fight for it, try to convince people. But I cannot make it so by asserting the name of any deity or political principle. Not unless people agree my interpretation.

But despite that, people do seem to be expanding freedoms to more people and as a result athiests are able to not practice as they see fit. Despite God not doing a (*)(*)(*)(*) thing to ensure rights and the constitution being just ink on paper, we do manage as humans to retain human rights rather well.
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Old 03-28-2008, 07:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Publius Infinitum View Post
We've heard many people in here defend this or that activity because it's legal... we've heard them declare that this or that activity SHOULD BE made legal despite the historical taboo against it...

One of the things that strikes me about the bulk of these people is that they always make these claims on the basis that what is legal, is by default, right and just... This is the mindset of the collectivist, who believes that rights come from the government, the Constitution or some similar secularist origin...

Below is a scenario aimed specifically at our secular humanist members... read the scenario and provide for us your reactions...

The Scenario: This morning you awoke to find that the government has determined that Atheists do not have a right to life; that they are to be killed on sight or for those unable to do so, they're to be turned into the gov't for summary execution.

There US Supreme Court, the Federal Legislature and most state governments were decimated by 9:00 am by the more heads up citizens who realized that there were four humanist on the SCOTUS and the Congress and Senate were indeed target rich environments... So a speedy appeal is NOT looking good.

Since you believe that what is legal is right and just and that government determines the scope of human and civil rights, you're without a right to life and presumed persona non grata.

You walk over to the kitchen counter to fix a cup of coffee to clear your head and you see your neighbor seeing you... he's armed and walking your way...

What's your next move? OH... and why?
I would organize and get together with any sane person in the United States (which atheist or not, would be a (*)(*)(*)(*)load of people surprisingly) and do what is necessary to defend the right of these atheists.

In self-defense, if necessary, I'd shoot him. I wouldn't shoot on sight. I'd see what his intentions were and if he was deemed a threat to my life, I'd shoot the bastard. Why? Because God or no God, at birth, I have the rights to life. Nobody owns my rights to life. Nobody should be able to dictate my rights. Therefore, if someone is infringing on my rights and is a threat to my very life, that person needs to be taken out. If possible and in this scenario obviously not, I'd prefer them to go to jail.
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Old 03-28-2008, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
You walk over to the kitchen counter to fix a cup of coffee to clear your head and you see your neighbor seeing you... he's armed and walking your way...

What's your next move? OH... and why?
Is he a zombie? And, will his saliva make me a zombie? Your answers to these questions are very important to my response.
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Last edited by catzmeow; 03-28-2008 at 07:55 AM.
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Old 03-28-2008, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by JavaBlack View Post
How exactly do you know an athiest by sight?
Shouldn't be all that hard to spot drooling athiest zombies by sight.


PS
A better question would be; are they gay liberal drooling athiest zombies?
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Last edited by Tedminator; 03-28-2008 at 07:54 AM.
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Old 03-28-2008, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Publius Infinitum View Post
... makes this the most illustrative thread on the vacuous leftist ideology in the history of this site.
Tony Schiavone? Is that you?

Your scenario doesn't make any sense. It's a science-fiction scenario. How are we supposed to respond to a science-fiction scenario?
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Old 03-28-2008, 08:23 AM
Publius Infinitum Publius Infinitum is offline
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Originally Posted by JavaBlack View Post
How exactly do you know an athiest by sight?

But getting beyond the willing suspension of disbelief (you'd have to have the kind of tyrant who thinks people only act moral with God in order to have a result like this- that's what makes it comical), I don't see how that changes anything about human rights.
At that point the social contract turns against my right to live or to have religious freedom.
That means for some reason society went retarded and decided these rights are superceded by some nonsensical ideology that athiests are dangerous or whatnot... similarly how we determine criminals have no freedom (if rights are inalienable, how do criminals lose them).

Why am I supposed to think God is a better answer? If this were the law, no amount of praying would change the fact that my life was forfeit (well... actually it might. If I prayed, people wouldn't think I was an athiest). God is irrelevant.
So what does it all mean?
That no rights can be taken for granted. All of our rights are subject to the worldview of the population. This is true regardless of religion or political system. God does nothing to ensure rights. Nor does any constitution unless it has legitimacy with the people.

Not a very sunshiny answer, is it? If I say something is my right, it does not matter when the people decide I don't have it. I can try to fight for it, try to convince people. But I cannot make it so by asserting the name of any deity or political principle. Not unless people agree my interpretation.

But despite that, people do seem to be expanding freedoms to more people and as a result athiests are able to not practice as they see fit. Despite God not doing a (*)(*)(*)(*) thing to ensure rights and the constitution being just ink on paper, we do manage as humans to retain human rights rather well.
So you can't say what you'd do if presented in the scenario or why you'd take those actions?

Go figure.

You FAIL!

Friends this screed is representative of the inability of the left to recognize ANY principle and act on the authority of that principle.
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Old 03-28-2008, 08:26 AM
Publius Infinitum Publius Infinitum is offline
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Originally Posted by BigRed View Post
I would organize and get together with any sane person in the United States (which atheist or not, would be a (*)(*)(*)(*)load of people surprisingly) and do what is necessary to defend the right of these atheists.

In self-defense, if necessary, I'd shoot him. I wouldn't shoot on sight. I'd see what his intentions were and if he was deemed a threat to my life, I'd shoot the bastard. Why? Because God or no God, at birth, I have the rights to life. Nobody owns my rights to life. Nobody should be able to dictate my rights. Therefore, if someone is infringing on my rights and is a threat to my very life, that person needs to be taken out. If possible and in this scenario obviously not, I'd prefer them to go to jail.
A sound and cogent response... thank you for taking the time to thoughfully respond to the unjust circumstances which have occured many times throughout human history.

In modern times the life of the unborn has been deemed without rights... in the previous century, the Jews were stripped of their humanity.

You've acted in high principle and took action based upon the bed-rock authority of that principle.

Well done.
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