In no way? Riiiight.
I did not say they were equivalent (in fact I made it a point to say they were not).



I read it... and again, it changes nothing.
You haven't been reading me very clearly.
I don't think the notion of "representing islam correctly" means anything. However Muslims decide to represent it... that's what the religion becomes.



We defeated the ideology of fascism by defeating the fascist nations... The rest of fascism's defeat was mostly the work of fascism itself- It doesn't work!
Who exactly needs to surrender for the alleged goals of Islam?

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"It's never over... BOY!"
The Tall Man, Phantasm III

I'd imagine she's talking about the practicing, devout Islamists, not people who live in Islamic countries but are not active in their religion.

Agreed.

That doesn't mean they want to kill me. I also probably didn't meet a single Japanese who did now view me as a gaijin. They don't want to kill me because of it, either.

On a public message board? Not bloody likely!

Who said "destroy"? You did. I'd rather liberate the peaceful masses. Just because my system describes the most evil religions, there is no need to go after the religion as a whole. Because, because the evil in a religion is concentrated in its fundamentalist sect(s), the correct course of action is to destroy or undermine the fundamentalist sect(s). I do agree that fundamentalism is more ruinous to its own religion than to outsiders, so removing the fundamentalist elements of a religion can only make the religion happier and love us more.

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^My First Knockout Victory!^

Of course, the only "solution" would be the destruction of Israel since islam will never allow for that land to not be theirs. They will kill forever for control and will never negotiate in good faith over that land. Islam is commanded to expand, not give up territory already once conquered.

If you want to debate whether objectivism is religious, start a thread. I'll debate it with you a little, at least to hear your case. For Randians, I might be able to predict the case, that its based o an "irrational" worship of Ayn Rand and to a very small extent I think that is legitimate, hence my emphasis that I am an objectivist not a Randian. But, we digress.

Agreed. As has been ceded over and over, there are evil elements to many ideologies. The difference, as you point out, is that muslims are acting on the evil of islam in ever increasing and global fashion in other words, as you say, muslims are violent and evil and that is what the religion has "become". You see YOU and your like are hung up on individuals, focusing on whether ALL of this is ALL of that, while your like claim I "stereotype and generalize." You have it backwards. I do not speak to the individual but to the idelogy, the ideas behind the individuals. I speak of the ideology of islam and I speak the hard, cold truth.

Yes, agreed, and the same is necessary here, we must defeat the islamofascist nations (aghanistan, iraq, iran, syria, pakistan, suadi arabia). Some will require more military conflict to do so and some may be possible to defeat using all the other tactics and strategies. But, defeated, they all must be, along with their pxoxies, hezzbolah, hamas, islamic jihad, and all the other islamomoron terrorist groups out there murdering in the name of muhammed and islam.

The war was started by the muslims, not us. All we can do is continue to fight back against their aggression, destroy their bases, resources, allies, soldiers, economic assets, propaganda tools (vote out the dems!), etc, etc. Eventually, they will stop their stupid jihad, especially as we continue to inevitably increase the cost they will pay for continuing it. And, we will just know its over because they will stop the terrorism. This is decades away at best. This war, WWIII, will get much, much bigger because islam teaches death is wonderful if its for their stupid religion and there are a lot of them. They are going to cause a lot of trouble and have a lot of muslims die before they give up.

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Qur'an:8:39 Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.
Qur'an:8:67 It is not fitting for any prophet to have prisoners until he has made a great slaughter in the land.
Qur'an 8:12 I will terrorize the unbelievers...Strike off their heads and cut off each of their fingers and toes.
Qur'an 9:5 Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, torture them, and lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.

Ah... okay... so I guess we're pretty much in agreement... at least in principle.

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"It's never over... BOY!"
The Tall Man, Phantasm III

I think we are even in agreement in action. Eleanor has gone way over the top for me now. I have always thought that she was overdoing it, but I thought that overall, what she was saying is justifiable, but she continues to refuse to acknowledge that judging a religion on its scripture instead of on the activity of its practitioners is deceptive and pedantic. People don't just blindly follow words.

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^My First Knockout Victory!^

Not at all. It seems we all agree on that point. The problem is that we have this massive number of terrorist attacks all over the world committed in the name of islam along with a massive propaganda campaign targeted at the liberals, in large part successful. Heck, even W gets up and blabs about how islam is peaceful. Its bizarre. A very large percentage of the West is simply in denial and the islamoterrorists love it and are doing everything in their very limited power (homicide bombs and such) to take advantage. Mostly they are like fleas or cockroaches easily crushed, but they get the press and the appeasers fighting for them in a much more significant way. This is what I fight. I do not speak to the muslims, but the liberals and the open minded Westerners. I am all for someone sweet talking the muslims and winning them over and away from the dark side, but thats not my mission.

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Qur'an:8:39 Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.
Qur'an:8:67 It is not fitting for any prophet to have prisoners until he has made a great slaughter in the land.
Qur'an 8:12 I will terrorize the unbelievers...Strike off their heads and cut off each of their fingers and toes.
Qur'an 9:5 Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, torture them, and lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.

Eleanor should not be taken seriously in any way!! I have asked him multiple times, "if you hate islam so much and think it is so evil, are you in the military fighting this evil?" I have asked him in threads, I have asked him in PMs and he has never responded! If he really believes this, and wants to come on here spouting this extreme rhetoric, he can at least have the courage to fight the war he so vehemently calls for!

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"He who would trade liberty for some temporary security, deserves neither liberty nor security"
Benjamin Franklin

R.I.P. Molly, I miss you every day!!


Beatitude # 9- "Blessed are those who spread freedom and democracy, for they shall invade the earth!"

As much as I might even like to go fight, the USA military isn't in such desperate shape that they will accept a 45 year old woman in combat. I do some volunteer work however, for the military.

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Qur'an:8:39 Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.
Qur'an:8:67 It is not fitting for any prophet to have prisoners until he has made a great slaughter in the land.
Qur'an 8:12 I will terrorize the unbelievers...Strike off their heads and cut off each of their fingers and toes.
Qur'an 9:5 Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, torture them, and lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.

When you say Liberalism, you mean the American understanding of this term? If so, no that wouldn't make any dent.