Political Forum
     

Go Back   Political Forum > General Political Chat > Political Opinions & Beliefs


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #31 (permalink)  
Old 04-29-2008, 09:11 PM
JeffLV's Avatar
JeffLV JeffLV is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 1,155
usa us nevada
JeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really nice
Credits: 6,795
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raharu Haruha View Post
Since when?
ummm. since they were capable of it and decided they needed it. You're talking to an accountant, internal controls are my life, lol
__________________
True knowledge exists in being aware of what you don't know.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Red Cross - Donate Today    Save the Rainforest
  #32 (permalink)  
Old 04-29-2008, 10:55 PM
GovernmentCheese GovernmentCheese is offline
Analyst
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NC
Posts: 2,211
usa us north carolina
GovernmentCheese is a jewel in the roughGovernmentCheese is a jewel in the roughGovernmentCheese is a jewel in the roughGovernmentCheese is a jewel in the rough
Credits: 6,850
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigRed View Post
Actually a very intelligent idea.

I'd also put importance on a bill that is always proposed that says the you have to put in the bill how it doesn't infringe on the Constitution.
That or the Bill of Rights within the DOC.
__________________
And he said unto them, Ye will surely say unto me this proverb, Physician, heal thyself: whatsoever we have heard done in Capernaum, do also here in thy country.

And he said, Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own country.
Reply With Quote
  #33 (permalink)  
Old 04-29-2008, 11:06 PM
FlackBait's Avatar
FlackBait FlackBait is offline
Sr. Correspondent
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 688
usa us california
FlackBait has disabled reputation
Credits: 3,553
Default .:.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthofnovember View Post
If we had a constitutional amendment that would sunset ALL laws every 5 years, we could stop the insanity. Instead of laws from here to Hell, only important laws would be re-passed every 5 years. In this way people might actually be able to know what the law is. I mean, isn't it a load of crap to be told "ignorance of the law is no excuse" when there are more laws passed every year than you could read if that was ALL you did, on top of all the existing laws? This also would reduce selective enforcement. It would solve prison overcrowding, as well as end the shame of having so many good people labeled criminals in the "land of the free". The campfire that was our government has become a forest fire.
Kind of a neat idea but I think the reason we have so many laws is to try and make everyone happy. If we re-passed only the important laws every 5 years I don't think anyone could really agree on what is and isn't important.
Reply With Quote
  #34 (permalink)  
Old 04-29-2008, 11:29 PM
JeffLV's Avatar
JeffLV JeffLV is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 1,155
usa us nevada
JeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really nice
Credits: 6,795
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlackBait View Post
Kind of a neat idea but I think the reason we have so many laws is to try and make everyone happy. If we re-passed only the important laws every 5 years I don't think anyone could really agree on what is and isn't important.
That, to me, is the main problem with the idea. If the goal was to limit the number of laws on the book, sure, this might do it... but I don't think that is you're ultimate goal. Your ultimate goal seems to be the restoration of power to the states... but you don't know how the congress will prioritize their laws... what they "agree on is and isn't important". Nothing you said limits their scope of power, only possibly the time they have to implement it. Why not get to the point and limit their scope of power? No need to beat around the bush.
__________________
True knowledge exists in being aware of what you don't know.
Reply With Quote
  #35 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2008, 02:11 AM
BigRed BigRed is offline
Analyst
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,083
BigRed has much to be proud ofBigRed has much to be proud ofBigRed has much to be proud ofBigRed has much to be proud ofBigRed has much to be proud ofBigRed has much to be proud ofBigRed has much to be proud ofBigRed has much to be proud of
Credits: 21,175
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpankyTheWhale View Post
Well, I'd do it myself, but even if I spent every waking hour getting rid of unnecessary laws, it would take way too long to get rid of them for it to be effective. So, I do need people to help me. And then I realize that I don't even want to do it in the first place, so I need to get other people to do it. However, I still have to be part of the process in order to ensure that progress is being made in the direction I want, so I will probably like to have some supervisory role in all this. And then there is even more complexity., but as long as the goal is still in sight and unharmed, any complexity that gets there faster is fine by me.
Yea, but I'm sure those people will be just as incompetent and corrupt as the ones that are making the unnecessary laws. I'm just very skeptical.
Reply With Quote
  #36 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2008, 07:03 AM
JavaBlack's Avatar
JavaBlack JavaBlack is offline
Site Moderator
Guru
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Michigan
Age: 29
Posts: 16,289
usa us michigan
JavaBlack has a reputation beyond reputeJavaBlack has a reputation beyond reputeJavaBlack has a reputation beyond reputeJavaBlack has a reputation beyond reputeJavaBlack has a reputation beyond reputeJavaBlack has a reputation beyond reputeJavaBlack has a reputation beyond reputeJavaBlack has a reputation beyond reputeJavaBlack has a reputation beyond reputeJavaBlack has a reputation beyond reputeJavaBlack has a reputation beyond repute
Credits: 109,200
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthofnovember View Post
I think the states would step up and take their rightful place (see 10th Amendment) if the Federal government were not always in their business, micro-managing public schools and whatnot. Decentralization is as much the goal as smaller government. I think there would be less confusion and waste if state and local government weren't always trying to comply with the new federal guidelines for this or that. The states would provide all the stability needed. Murder and the like would still always be illegal.
To be honest I don't think it's that the federal government pushes to take power from the states who would supposedly otherwise step up.
I think the states and localities enjoy giving more responsibility (and more of the bills) to the federal government. You can count on that with at least most of the states (all that aren't donor states).
Sure they'll whine about states' rights when politically convenient, but overall they benefit by passing the buck.
How can federal taxes being higher than state taxes... while still providing the services taxpayers demand... be anything other than good from the state politician's point of view.
__________________
"Man lives in the sunlit world of that which he believes to be reality. But unseen by most is an underworld, a place that is just as real... but not as brightly lit... A DARK SIDE!"
-opening from Tales From the Darkside
Reply With Quote
  #37 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2008, 01:25 PM
fifthofnovember's Avatar
fifthofnovember fifthofnovember is offline
Sr. Correspondent
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 464
usa
fifthofnovember is just really nicefifthofnovember is just really nicefifthofnovember is just really nicefifthofnovember is just really nicefifthofnovember is just really nice
Credits: 2,882
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffLV View Post
That, to me, is the main problem with the idea. If the goal was to limit the number of laws on the book, sure, this might do it... but I don't think that is you're ultimate goal. Your ultimate goal seems to be the restoration of power to the states... but you don't know how the congress will prioritize their laws... what they "agree on is and isn't important". Nothing you said limits their scope of power, only possibly the time they have to implement it. Why not get to the point and limit their scope of power? No need to beat around the bush.
The coolness of the idea, which people haven't picked up on, is that We the People would get to make reviews on federal laws by electing those people who support (or oppose) the renewal of certain laws. If, for instance, you think the Federal Reserve Act which we've been saddled with since 1913 needs to go, elect people who campaign on not renewing it. This would shift the substance of campaigns from "what new laws am I going to pass" to "what laws will I get rid of". It is really just a mandatory periodic consideration of repeal for laws that may be considered obsolete or just bad. But it allows the people to vote more directly for getting rid of certain laws, and just makes it easier to get rid of them. If they can't reach enough of a consensus to keep something a law every 5 years, it probably wasn't a good or necessary law to begin with.
__________________
War is Peace.
Freedom is Slavery.
Ignorance is Strength.

It's a post 9/11 world.
Reply With Quote
  #38 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2008, 02:14 PM
JeffLV's Avatar
JeffLV JeffLV is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 1,155
usa us nevada
JeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really nice
Credits: 6,795
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthofnovember View Post
The coolness of the idea, which people haven't picked up on, is that We the People would get to make reviews on federal laws by electing those people who support (or oppose) the renewal of certain laws. If, for instance, you think the Federal Reserve Act which we've been saddled with since 1913 needs to go, elect people who campaign on not renewing it. This would shift the substance of campaigns from "what new laws am I going to pass" to "what laws will I get rid of". It is really just a mandatory periodic consideration of repeal for laws that may be considered obsolete or just bad. But it allows the people to vote more directly for getting rid of certain laws, and just makes it easier to get rid of them. If they can't reach enough of a consensus to keep something a law every 5 years, it probably wasn't a good or necessary law to begin with.
I've picked up on the coolness, I just think it comes at a heavy price... namely stability. I think it's good to review laws, just that it's a step to far to force them to be reviewed every 5 years or they're out. The fact that the whims of the people would be so represented as you said through campaigning for what to get rid of makes me all the more nervous. I'm all for a government for and by the people, but I think the founders had the right idea when they made our government cumbersome and difficult to change. It's a balance of stability and predictability vs the will and whim of the electorate.
__________________
True knowledge exists in being aware of what you don't know.

Last edited by JeffLV; 04-30-2008 at 02:17 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #39 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2008, 02:17 PM
SpankyTheWhale's Avatar
SpankyTheWhale SpankyTheWhale is offline
Guru
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: right behind you
Age: 2
Posts: 7,770
SpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond reputeSpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond reputeSpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond reputeSpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond reputeSpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond reputeSpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond reputeSpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond reputeSpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond reputeSpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond reputeSpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond reputeSpankyTheWhale has a reputation beyond repute
Credits: 26,773
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffLV View Post
I've picked up on the coolness, I just think it comes at a heavy price... namely stability. I think it's good to review laws, just that it's a step to far to force them to be reviewed every 5 years or they're out. The fact that the whims of the people would be so represented as you said through campaigning for what to get rid of makes me all the more nervous. I'm all for a government for and by the people, but I think the founders had the right idea when they made our government cumbersome and difficult to change. It's a balance of stability and predictability vs the will and whim of the electorate.
I would be far more in favor of it if we changed "5 years" to "50 years."
__________________
You don't have to pretend to like someone just because you are voting for him.
Reply With Quote
  #40 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2008, 02:24 PM
JeffLV's Avatar
JeffLV JeffLV is offline
Commentator
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 1,155
usa us nevada
JeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really niceJeffLV is just really nice
Credits: 6,795
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpankyTheWhale View Post
I would be far more in favor of it if we changed "5 years" to "50 years."
I agree.... I think that that's not too short as to be chaotic and unpredictable, and not too long as to make people complacent with the law. maybe even a little shorter than 50. I might even go as low as 15 or 20. Maybe less for "new" laws.
__________________
True knowledge exists in being aware of what you don't know.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Clinton Wins Nevada (most likely) - Momentum's Power Limited SeminalBlog Political Blogs 0 01-19-2008 02:50 PM
A Practical & Doable Plan to Take Back Our Government BMcDonald Political Opinions & Beliefs 32 10-29-2006 09:29 AM
Dems plan for securing America vs the Reps plan.. exigent Latest World News 47 10-06-2006 06:49 PM
Should high performance cars also be limited? LoSconosciuto Gun Control 2 01-09-2005 01:56 PM
House Conservatives Steer Course For Return to Limited Gover EuP Current Events 4 11-15-2004 07:53 PM

Sponsored Links

All times are GMT -8. The time now is 10:43 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0
Template-Modifikationen durch TMS
vBCredits v1.3 ©2007 by Darkwaltz4
Advertisement System V2.1 By   Branden