It is not that Californians hate the military; it is that we don't worship it. The military is in place to serve the people and their will, and most Californians agree that a defensive European-style force is best. That's why Europeans have a far greater percentage of tax revenue to spend on quality of life issues than the US does.

And as to your last comment, it would be humanly impossible for me to agree with you any more. TRUE....we are not Americans, we are proud to be called Californian, unique and distinct.

So we want to have weak militaries like the EU, and have economies that are so far behind our, the two aren't even comparable... Maybe we'd all be happier if YOU moved to Europe. Euro's also have more tax revenue, because they tax their citizens more....

And you're so right, Californians don't just hate the troops...

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European Defense Forces are possible only because of the US Military.

But it's not fair to say that California Liberals are not Americans. The truth is that no socialist is an American. Socialism in all of its various Isms, be that communism, fascism, progressivism, liberalism are all the complete opposite of being an American.

This wouldn't even be debatable except for the socialists in early 20th century America that used their customary deciet to pass the 14th amendment. What we know for sure is that the 14th amendment is detrimental to the US Constitution and freedom itself because the socialist blur the difference between fairness and equality. Which they do for the aquisition of power.

Many Californian liberals are socialist.
No socialist is an American.
Therefore, many Californian liberals are not American.

Simple logic.

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"It is no crime to be ignorant of economics, which is, after all, a specialized discipline and one that most people consider to be a 'dismal science.' But it is totally irresponsible to have a loud and vociferous opinion on economic subjects while remaining in this state of ignorance.

--Murray Rothbard

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skinny. A liberal is just a libertarian who hasn't studied economics.

It is not that Californians hate the military; it is that we don't worship it.


You don't need to worship it, but it would be nice to hear you appreciate it.
oh, But then again you would turn to the old jargon, "we don't appreciate it because it's an illigal war"
So, I can only give you some good old addvice, "Don't bite the hand the protects you" you may need
them someday.


The military is in place to serve the people and their will, and most Californians agree that a defensive European-style
force is best.


LMAO, It appears that you don't know much about the European defense, if you did, you would know just how weak it
is. it can't protect, nore can it serve the people. Also the Europeans have no will to serve. NON.

weakness does not make the enemy leave you alone. when was the last time a school yard bully left you alone
because you was to weak in front of him??? LMAO

face it, you like being disrespect full, you love acting like you, and you alone, know whats best.
while you give all your Democrat leaders a pass for voting for an illegal war, then give the Dems
respect for not living up to their own actions regarding the lead up to the war in Iraq.

Bush lied, he fooled us dumb azz Democrats, we are fooled so easy, we need to be fired by the
American people. because we failed to use our own brains.

I don't buy that crap for one second.


...

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The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

I love how Conservatives constantly sing praise to the 'supremacy of the military', and anyone who doesn't support the supremacy of the military is 'unpatriotic' and 'pacifists'.

It's always a textbook definition of how the Nazi's came to power, next the White House will get burnt down and the Conservatives will blame it on the 'liberals'.

Hey, Andaras, do you know what the most militarily minded nation in the last 50 years was? Maybe you should ask all the conservatives that supported the Soviet Union.

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"It is no crime to be ignorant of economics, which is, after all, a specialized discipline and one that most people consider to be a 'dismal science.' But it is totally irresponsible to have a loud and vociferous opinion on economic subjects while remaining in this state of ignorance.

--Murray Rothbard

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skinny. A liberal is just a libertarian who hasn't studied economics.

I like to think we're the good guys, and as long as I keep seeing it that way, I'm going to keep thinking that we need to carry the biggest stick on the block.

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The EU economy is STRONGER than the US economy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._%28nominal%29

Have you ever actually looked into tax rates before? The US federal tax burden is between 10%-35% plus you have to add between 6%-13% for local and state taxes.

Calculating total tax burden is difficult because of our convoluted tax system but some researchers have tried:

"In a study for the National Bureau of Economic Research, Boston University economists Laurence J. Kotlikoff and David Rapson have found that our all-in marginal tax rate is 40%. Most workers will pay about that much on each dollar of income when all taxes -- federal and state income taxes, sales taxes, taxes for benefit programs, etc. -- are considered.

The average marginal tax rate on incomes between $20,000 and $500,000 is 40.3%, the median tax rate is 41.8%, and the standard deviation of all of those rates is 5.3 percentage points. Basically, most of us pay about 40%, plus or minus 5.3 percentage points."

Average tax rates in Europe range from around 10% in Bulgaria to 40% in France to 50% in Sweden. Germany has a tax system closer to ours and ranges from 15%-45% and the UK is 22%-40%. Pretty close to our rates.

Europeans don’t pay that much more than we do and they get benefits such as universal healthcare, free college education, excellent public transportation, and a low crime rate.

So maybe we all should consider a move to Europe, or at least change the way we look at military funding vs. quality of life funding in America.

Or maybe you should move to Europe.