Political Irony - Page 2

JavaBlack · #11 (**permalink**) 05-15-2008, 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronin-Talgar

Who was it that split the Republican vote in '92? I'm surprised that didn't result in prefferential voting, it would have been far larger than Gore in 2000.

Perot. Perot was a bit different because he got bipartisan support.
Also I'm not sure I buy into the idea that Nader lost the election for Gore. For one thing... in all that Florida chaos, it's quite possible Gore really won anyway (Nader usually brings that up).
For another who says the people who voted Nader would have voted Gore rather than another Green candidate or no one?
And for another, some argue that Nader actually boosted the showing of Gore supporters by forcing Gore to acknowledge issues important to his own base.

ABoyNamedSue · #12 (**permalink**) 05-15-2008, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whaler17

Is it just me or is the current state of the Democratic party perplexing?
This is supposedly "the party of the people", yet they have a system in place that ensures that if the votes of the people do not lines up with the desires of the hyper wealthy party elite, the party elite can change the nominee. The Superdelegate system is such a blatant slap in the face to the common man voter, that I cannot conceive of anyone joining this party who deos not have a shot at being one of the party elite. Furthermore, they oppose field levelling actiosn like enactinga flat tax rate. My guess is that it is becasue the current system allows hidden tax looopholes that the hyper wealthy party elite love.

There are contradcictions everwhere you look in the Democratic Party.
Don't get me wrong, the Republican party has its problems as well, but they seem far less deceptive.

You're right. The democrat sheeple should just stay home, and not vote. Their vote doesn't count anyway!

Whaler17 · #13 (**permalink**) 05-15-2008, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ABoyNamedSue

You're right. The democrat sheeple should just stay home, and not vote. Their vote doesn't count anyway!

Isn't it amazing how the Democrats can get followers so excited, when all the while the party elite is plotting to herd them into their chosen candidate's camp, and if they can't they will outright reject the voters' wishes?

It baffles me!

Ronin-Talgar · #14 (**permalink**) 05-16-2008, 06:01 AM

Quote:

Perot. Perot was a bit different because he got bipartisan support.
Also I'm not sure I buy into the idea that Nader lost the election for Gore. For one thing... in all that Florida chaos, it's quite possible Gore really won anyway (Nader usually brings that up).
For another who says the people who voted Nader would have voted Gore rather than another Green candidate or no one?
And for another, some argue that Nader actually boosted the showing of Gore supporters by forcing Gore to acknowledge issues important to his own base.

Huh, still its a glaring problem in the system, I wish something had comeof it- from Perot for instance- its supposed to be a definite answer, not a rough estimate of the people's will.

As for Gore, yeah it not his fault ultimately, and the Democrats that have focused on him and not the actual theft are...dissapointing collectively, several other things more specifically.

I hadn't thought about higher turn-out; not nearly the same issue here. Its a huge shame they couldn't do a preference deal beforehand though, would have beaten the scrublists etc. if he could ahve directed those voters in exchange for an issue or two- standard practice elsewhere wherethe votes are properly prefferenced, someone said it would have been illegal over their though...

Ronin-Talgar · #15 (**permalink**) 05-16-2008, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Isn't it amazing how the Democrats can get followers so excited, when all the while the party elite is plotting to herd them into their chosen candidate's camp, and if they can't they will outright reject the voters' wishes?

It baffles me!

You're right, whereas the Republican's inability to make anyone care about the election, seeing as their nomination process ended long before everyone voted. See that makes sense, whereas the Democrats...

Might have something to do with the inspirational leaders I guuuueeesss...

Whaler17 · #16 (**permalink**) 05-16-2008, 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronin-Talgar

You're right, whereas the Republican's inability to make anyone care about the election, seeing as their nomination process ended long before everyone voted. See that makes sense, whereas the Democrats...

Might have something to do with the inspirational leaders I guuuueeesss...

Wow you really should watch some news channels! There was a rather large field of candidates early on, but the Republican Party united behind one fairly quickly. Whereas the Democrats can't agree on anything!!!!

Whaler17 · #17 (**permalink**) 05-16-2008, 06:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronin-Talgar

Might have something to do with the inspirational leaders I guuuueeesss...

typically People bacome excited about an election because of fear of the negatives the opposing candidate represents. So it appears as though your party is EXTREEMELY divided and fearful of its internal opposition!

McCain will win this election!

TheChief · #18 (**permalink**) 05-16-2008, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whaler17

McCain will win this election!

Seems the most likely result. Dems are ripping each other apart while mcain has a very solid base. There will most likely be a few dems jumping ship when there candidate doesn't get to run. Also the 90% of the black population its vote is leaning on never bothers to vote. It will be close but hopefully 4 years of (hopefully) succesful republican leadership will relax some of the lefts histeria..

Ronin-Talgar · #19 (**permalink**) 05-17-2008, 06:03 AM

Ok Superdude17, you're deluding yourself if you think the story here is fear of McCain, over admiration/joy/hope/love of Obama, and I'd have to say, Clinton too.

My comment was based on the low turn-outs, before McCain got it, which also meant that the majority never got to vote meaningfully. Those that have have still voted a significant amount for candidates that have stepped down, so your theory about a solid base might just be wrong there, not to mention the many republicans/right wings that are condemning him for several things, mainly being too sane, to my mind.

Quote:

Seems the most likely result.

I don't think we'll know until the Democratic candidacy is decided how mu ch damage has really been done here- there are pros and cons having a long contest like this, with McCain stuck on the sidelines, or increasingly attacked by both candidtaes.

TheChief · #20 (**permalink**) 05-17-2008, 06:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronin-Talgar

I don't think we'll know until the Democratic candidacy is decided how much damage has really been done here- there are pros and cons having a long contest like this, with McCain stuck on the sidelines, or increasingly attacked by both candidtaes.

Full sprint to the finish line well let the camera decide!

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