Much has been said or written about how ignorant we Americans are of the middle east and how that has contributed to our current situation. And there is a lot of truth in that. However, it is also true that in the middle east, a lot of rather paranoid viewpoints exist very widely - they think we are supporting Israel out of some grand scheme to ruin Islam...oh brother...but they think it...their leaders don't have a clue about our culture...anyone read that a part of the 9-11 attack plan was that one of the guys was going to land a plane and blow it up while yelling about our "changing our policies" or something like that? That illustrates the problem. These fanatics over there, and most of the population too, buy into ever conspiracy/evil intentions theory they hear about America, and think its true. They think that we actually UNDERSTAND why they crashed planes into the WTC and that it must have sent us a clear message - they are so deluded they don't realize that they are nuts, their actions are criminal in the lowest sense and that they just send the message that they deserve to lose the battle...is there any way we can reach out to the common folk, not the maniacal ones, and illustrate the ways we benefit them...gains from trade, bosnia, for example...

With all due respect, Middle Easterners are about as ignorant as those Americans who do not recognize how often the US Government (both Republican and Democrat) have violated Human rights acts throughout the world.

Some examples:

Cambodia, East Timor, Sudan, Vietnam, Nicaragua, Hiroshima, etc, etc... Not to mention that it was the U.S. that helped put Saddam into power to begin with and gave him arms WHILE he was committing horrendous acts to his own people.

I don't blame some Iraqis for their lack of trust of the United States - I do fault them for their methods of conveying this message. But the fact is the US are not saints, and not taking ownership for your countries actions is ignorant - no matter which side of the fight you come from.

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Truth is by nature self-evident, as soon as you remove the cobwebs of ignorance that surround it, it shines clear. Gandhi

The first sentence or two of my post make that very point. However, they don't own the intellectual high road, and the difficulties we have with them are as much their fault as ours. Planes into office buildings a legitimate political statement - never! (maybe you agree with it though, can't speak for you.... )

One: Arabic inability to understand Western culture does not absolve us Westerners from the responsibility of doing as good a job of understanding Arabic culture as possible

Two: the misunderstanding of the West by the Arab world is something that has not been addressed nearly enough, either by Arabs or Westerners. I'm glad someone is finally willing to talk about it, but I hope they keep in mind point one above.

It would perhaps be more productive to illustrate the areas in which the US and other Western countries are not actually guilty of many of the alleged crimes of which we get accused. Pointing out the good could be seen as a way of trying to justify the alleged bad.

I dont believe we have any obligation to "understand" oppressive cultures. Cultures that allow slavery for example are inferior, and should be stamped out if it is within our power to do so.

At the very least, many mid-east cultures oppress women.

I made a separate post on this, but I think this article applies here as well - http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=105001688 - "Why the Muslims Misjudged Us"

Then back to you then - was The US bombing the Al Shifa Pharmeceutical plant in Sudan(199 a legitimate political statement? It resulted in the death of tens of thousand Sudanese civilians (and still counting) and (believed) to have speared headed Osama's attacks on the US.

My point is the ignorance, hatred and violence didn't start on 9/11 - The people of the Middle East do have legitimate reasons for being mad at the US - long before these nightmares we're currently facing ever began.

It's only ignorance when you close your eyes to what may have contributed to their anger.

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Truth is by nature self-evident, as soon as you remove the cobwebs of ignorance that surround it, it shines clear. Gandhi

what was the proper response to Sudanese production of the nerve agent VX which was being made at that plant (an allegation that Richard Clarke, remember him?, makes in his book).

That's something that kills me about the left....their selective memory of history. That bombing was undertaken for specific strategic necessities. Would it have been preferable to allow production of that nerve agent to go on, given sudanese links to terror organizations and attacks?

D'oh.

Catz

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I'll get nicer when you get smarter.

[quote="PoliticallyIncorrect";p="53228"]HUH? Link, please.

Not everything comes attached with a link - I've read it in several Books - But I am certain if you google your brains out, you'll find that the number is accurate (Ie: the pharmaceutical plant was responsible for all of the medical supplies in the region - the lack of malaria vaccines, for example, has escalated the number of Deaths in Sudan since the initial attack)

ROFL - Selective memory????

Clinton bombed a BAND-AID factory - not a weapons factory - The Al -Shifa Pharmeceutical plant WAS NOT a chemical Plant - It was a prelude to the CIA lack of ability to gather accurate information

http://www.iacenter.org/sudanrt.htm
http://www.fact-index.com/a/al/al_sh...l_factory.html

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Truth is by nature self-evident, as soon as you remove the cobwebs of ignorance that surround it, it shines clear. Gandhi

It just seems like common sense to me that if you are making the claim, it is up to you to provide the evidence to back your claim. Which book was it?