So, how did you develop your political beliefs? - Page 3

stekim · #21 (**permalink**) 05-19-2008, 07:33 AM

Quote:

There is nothing like working with the children of the poor to disabuse you of a lot of conservative mantras.

It's often the case that one's failures are only one's fault to a certain percentage. There is a reason why very, very few people born into poverty end up being rich. It is far easier to pull yourself up by your boot straps if you have boots. Likewise, it's far easier for someone of limited mental abilities to become President if his grandfather is named Prescott Bush.

Whaler17 · #22 (**permalink**) 05-19-2008, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chesby05

I think this would be an interesting discussion. We all obviously believe very strongly in what we believe - I'm curious to know why. Was it how we were raised? Experiences we have had? People we've met? Were our families politically informed or didn't they care?

I was raised in a pretty politically active family. My folks used to attend Labor party rallies when I was younger (yes, my claim to fame as a child was being kissed by Bob Hawke...lol) and I was always raised to be pretty much of a leftie. Not so much as I am now, though. My Dad's quite conservative and my middle brother is certainly a capitalist...lol.

I was reasonably politically aware (in that I made my own decisions about who to vote for) during my 20s but most of that time I was caught up in my miserable marriage and didn't give it much time or thought.

It wasn't until I met the Chesboy and his family and started learning so much from him and his Mum in particular that I really cemented my political ideology and became quite clear in my own mind where I stood. I guess that also happens with age and motivation to learn, but he has probably had the most significant recent impact on my way of thinking.

It wasn't until I joined this site that I decided to quantify my views and so I suppose I would identify most with the ideology of social democracy. When I'm joking around I call myself a socialist but I'm not, really. I have some pretty conservative views on some things (namely, abortion) but certainly not on others.

I'd really like to hear how the rest of you developed your own political identity.

I was raised by two college professors, so needless to say our household growing up was Democratic Party loyal. Once I graduated from college with a business degree, my views changed. I realized that the path to prosperity in America was through hard work and economic expansion, not government social programs and forced wealth redistribution. I watched Jimmy Carter wreck our nation using nothing more than basic Democratic Party principles while I was in my teens, and tried to reconcile that with my parents' assertion that he was a good president. It just didn't wash given the facts!

As I matured as an adult my belief that the Democratic Party's principles were misguided and detrimenal just grew. I watched Clinton accomplish nothing while his own party had control of congress, and then start to accomplish things in his second term only after Republicans took control of congress, and he started siding with them on issues, NAFTA for example. The issues he did not side with them on went nowhere!

Reagan was perhaps the greatest president of my lifetime! He was a great communicator, did not cower when threatened by other nations, and through his strength of character and love for America, brought an end to the cold war! He is the example to follow for future presidents in my opinion!

Herkdriver · #23 (**permalink**) 05-19-2008, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ixtellor

My first degree ended up being in political science, and during my final year, I made a total change to basically a die hard liberal.
My biggest influence, which several of you will misread or not understand, was Marx. I was not swayed by his political arguments, but by his economic histories and explanations.
The mantra that I basically hold today, that I got from Marx is:

Economics explains everything.

Karl Marx, that figures.

There is only one book that matters in the area of Economics

The Wealth of Nations by Adam Smith

Whaler17 · #24 (**permalink**) 05-19-2008, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stekim

It's often the case the one's failures are only one's fault to a certain percentage. There is a reason why very, very few people born into poverty end up being rich. It is far easier to pull yourself up by your boot straps if you have boots. Likewise, it's far easier for someone of limited mental abilities to become President if his grandfather is named Prescott Bush.

Its also easy to claim intellectual superiority to someone when you are hiding behind a keyboard and an assumed name. W has an MBA, what is your highest level of education? What have you accomplished in life that allows you to feel superior to a 2 time President of the United States???

All important questions!!!

stekim · #25 (**permalink**) 05-19-2008, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Its also easy to claim intellectual superiority to someone when you are hiding behind a keyboard and an assumed name.

It's also easy when it's true. Just for the record.

Quote:

W has an MBA, what is your highest level of education?

I win! I have an MBA, too. Got it while getting my Master's in Finance and Econ (just took a few more classes, so why not?)

Quote:

What have you accomplished in life that allows you to feel superior to a 2 time President of the United States???

I didn't say I was superior to anyone. I said it's far easier for someone of limited mental abilities to become President if his grandfather is named Prescott Bush. And that's quite true. The odds of W being born in rural West Virginia to two, poor, hillbilly parents and then working his way to President would have been nil. That's not to blame him or anything. He won the sperm lottery. Good for him. I'm not a class warfare kind of dude.

Whaler17 · #26 (**permalink**) 05-19-2008, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stekim

I said it's far easier for someone of limited mental abilities to become President if his grandfather is named Prescott Bush. And that's quite true.

So you're saying that Obama will have to work harder because he doesn't have the rich grandfather?

catzmeow · #27 (**permalink**) 05-19-2008, 09:59 AM

Well, duh.

stekim · #28 (**permalink**) 05-19-2008, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Well, duh.

Indeed. And someone born to two hillybilly parents in rural West Virginia or someone born to a single, black parent in a gang infested inner city slum will have an even harder time than Obama. The farther down you are on the ladder, the more rungs you need to climb to reach the top. That's not to say it can't be done. It's just far harder. You need be smarter, work harder and get a little lucky along the way. Paris Hilton only needed to be born and Viola! She's rich and "successful". Not sure how this is controversial.

Ixtellor · #29 (**permalink**) 05-19-2008, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herkdriver

Karl Marx, that figures.

Which is why I prefaced my remark with:

Quote:

My biggest influence, which several of you will misread or not understand, was Marx

You see Marx as a communist, and probably nothing of his exhaustive works in economic history.

For example I do not subscribe to his labor theory of value, and see wages as a result of market principles. (ie supply and demand)

Quote:

There is only one book that matters in the area of Economics

The Wealth of Nations by Adam Smith

Adam Smith while doing a good job of describing and predicting several economic principles, failed to fully appreciate several economic arenas. Including monopoly, income distribution, systemic market failure, and comparative advantage just to name a few.

I would recommend any modern day introduction to economics book over Wealth of Nations.

I believe you were once in the military, so let me make an analogy.

You equating wealth of nations to the finest book on economics, is tantamount to me saying "The M-16 is the finest assault rifle ever made".

The fact is that the field of economics is far more complicated than Smith gave credit too. While he might have a layed a nice foundation for some core principles, it is by no means complete.

Ixtellor

BigRed · #30 (**permalink**) 05-19-2008, 10:55 AM

Common sense and logic are the best places that started them...

But I read a lot of books, watch a lot of documentaries (on both sides of the fence -- that is to say on view points completely opposite of mine just to get an idea), watch various news networks and pundits to get the variety of opinions and my own moral compass dictates a lot as well.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
‘Major Powers’ To Pay Iran To Develop Nukes	SweetnessBlog	Political Blogs	0	05-02-2008 02:10 PM
Quick Survey Surrounding Political Beliefs/Candidate Choices	system18	Political Opinions & Beliefs	0	02-19-2008 07:46 PM
USA continues to develop a tendency of double standards	Observer	Political Opinions & Beliefs	1	10-08-2006 04:11 AM
Europeans to develop an unhijackable plane	Sadistic-Savior	Current Events	19	08-16-2006 02:15 PM
Have you ever switched your political beliefs?	Hansmoleman	Political Opinions & Beliefs	26	07-17-2004 08:23 PM