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Old 05-30-2008, 04:20 AM
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Heroes are Serbs. You need no better definition.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 05-30-2008, 04:22 AM
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Originally Posted by AmusedToDeath View Post
Heroes are Serbs. You need no better definition.
I beg to differ...
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Old 05-30-2008, 05:32 AM
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If both sides see the other side as the enemy, there is eithor no real enemy, or both sides are actually the enemy - right? We can't say that eithor side was the 'good guys' because there is no good side. There can't be.
The enemy is really a perspective thing whenever 2 people fight they both consider each other enemies. Doesn't mean there still not enemies though. Whos the good guy can be determined, often clearly, all you have to look at is what each side is fighting for.

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Did labelling them the enemy make it easier to go to war and kill them? If we went to war thinking these people were our friends, would that have made it harder to kill them?
Absolutely. Thats why every war has its propaganda to get its citizens rilled up and angry. It's a great way to win their approval. You have to make your enemy look like your peoples enemy.

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Were the soldiers themselves fighting to gain more land, or were they simply defending their countries against a people they deemed to be the enemy? Were they fighting for their Government, who wanted more land? If they faught for a Government, it makes them just as innocent as we were back then, doesn't it?

In the first world wars, children as young as 14 chose to go to war, even though it was illegal for them to do so, being too young. The soliders of today join the Army, knowing there is a chance they will be sent to war, so in a way, they choose to go to war.
Sure soldiers choose to go to war. But soldiers on both sides sign up for the service. So both are in it to fight and neither can be considered innocent. The only real innocent people were the citizens in their countries.

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Back during the first two world wars, they were not sent to war, they often chose to go to war, so therefore they chose to kill, because they knew that war involves violence and death.
Not sure if I managed to explain that well.
Soldiers who kill other soldiers really can't be called killers. Because both they and who there fighting signed up to fight each other. If 2 people challenge each other in a fight to the death you can't really call the guy who wins a murderer. The guy he killed knew it could happen when he agreed to it.

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But who is really innocent? The people who invade a country, or the people who reside in that country, and attempt to defend it? How do we decide who is innocent, and who is guilty?

Leaders - Guilty / Responsible
Soldiers - Neutral
Citizens - Innocent

So the leaders are responsible for what happens wether there guilty or not can be decided on after the war. (In your case of WWII i think well agree it was the german government who was at fault.)

Soldiers don't count because they choose to play a part and because the other side chooses to play aswell we can't label either murderers for killing each other.

And citizens are always innocent because there the ones who end up having loved ones killed and property destroyed.

So in conclusion war sucks but soldiers arn't to blame or label as killers.
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Last edited by TheChief; 05-30-2008 at 05:33 AM.
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Old 05-30-2008, 08:18 AM
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Heroes are Serbs. You need no better definition.
Butchers are Serbs you mean!!!!
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Old 05-30-2008, 08:19 AM
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How do we define Heroes?

They wear medals - that makes them easy to spot whenever you meet one.
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Old 05-30-2008, 08:22 AM
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How do we define Heroes?

They wear medals - that makes them easy to spot whenever you meet one.
Depends on the medal. Some medals are given out like candy.
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Old 05-30-2008, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by CrusaderRabbit08 View Post
Ridiculous. Do you think it's because I flunked Fanatical Flag Waving 101 when I was in school?



I don't categorize jobs that way. I'm not an elitist.
I flunked it too!

There is a wonderful book I read awhile back title is something like 'Ordinary People as Mystics and Saints--it's about ordinary folks from all walks of life who approach their lives in an extraordinary manner.

What they do for a living is irrelevant to 'heroism'. Motivation is hugely important in 'heroism' in my opinion.
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Old 05-31-2008, 03:21 PM
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A Hero to me is someone who is prepared to uphold his (rational) values in the face of ignorant opposition. The gay man who holds his head high and looks the world in the eye knowing he is a good person and lives his right to be an individual. The people who dare to say 'This is wrong' when the masses say otherwise.

I don't believe heroism is all about bravery. The men and women who protect my liberty have my sincere gratitude and respect but I'd want to have a chat first - before I could call anyone of them a Hero.

Oh yea, and my parents. They are my Heroes! And the man in my life - triple gold medal to him for putting up with me
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Old 05-31-2008, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Tuesday View Post
A Hero to me is someone who is prepared to uphold his (rational) values in the face of ignorant opposition. The gay man who holds his head high and looks the world in the eye knowing he is a good person and lives his right to be an individual. The people who dare to say 'This is wrong' when the masses say otherwise.

I don't believe heroism is all about bravery. The men and women who protect my liberty have my sincere gratitude and respect but I'd want to have a chat first - before I could call anyone of them a Hero.

Oh yea, and my parents. They are my Heroes! And the man in my life - triple gold medal to him for putting up with me
I agree.

Some heroes are people who have the courage to survive devastating loss, terrible suffering, and find a way to continue to have their hearts open to others.

These are ordinary heroes.
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Old 05-31-2008, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by wind View Post
I agree.

Some heroes are people who have the courage to survive devastating loss, terrible suffering, and find a way to continue to have their hearts open to others.

These are ordinary heroes.
That's an oxymoron.

At least in my view. By definition (my own perspective that is), if you are a hero, you aren't ordinary, but rather, extraordinary.
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