McCain claims to be Muslim - Page 2

Makedde · #11 (**permalink**) 06-24-2008, 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spare

But, tell me .... if a person supports, or doesn't support, a candidate because of his belief system, how does that make him a bigot? Doesn't that make him true to HIS belief system?

Why would a Christian vote for another Christian? Don't the candidates policies and ideas come into it? Should an election be all about someones religious beliefs?
Religion doesn't necessasarily make one person a more worthy candidate than the other, does it? At least, I would hope it's not seen this way.

Spare · #12 (**permalink**) 06-24-2008, 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makedde

Why would a Christian vote for another Christian? Don't the candidates policies and ideas come into it? Should an election be all about someones religious beliefs?
Religion doesn't necessasarily make one person a more worthy candidate than the other, does it? At least, I would hope it's not seen this way.

Ok, let's see --

First of all, nobody said that you vote for a person just because of his religion. What was said is that you can begin to evaluate a person's belief system based on his religious affiliation. That belief system is the underpinning of the candidate's policies and ideas. That doesn't mean that his religion defines his policies and ideas, but rather that his policies and ideas are shaped by his experiences and his education.

A simple example ... I think we can agree that a Christian candidate would be more tolerant of other religions, since Christianity does not call for the death of all those who do not practice Christianity. Obama, for example, is not going to call for the expulsion of all non-Christians from his country. Yet, we see Muslim political leaders who do just that ... all the while spouting death threats to non-Muslims. Death to all Muslims is NOT a policy I want to hear from my President.

So ... no, religion shouldn't be a defining issue, but the ensuing belief system (*)(*)(*)(*) well should.

Makedde · #13 (**permalink**) 06-24-2008, 01:01 AM

Obama is a Christian, but he doesn't seem to hold very Christian views - especially when it comes to his thoughts on abortion, for example.
McCains opinions are something I could expect, but not from Obama. He seems liberal (is that the right word to use here) about his beliefs on this.

So I guess from McCain's religion I was able to gather a little about how he thinks, but from Obama it was different, because he's obviously not as religious as McCain appears to be.

Spare · #14 (**permalink**) 06-24-2008, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makedde

Obama is a Christian, but he doesn't seem to hold very Christian views - especially when it comes to his thoughts on abortion, for example.
McCains opinions are something I could expect, but not from Obama. He seems liberal (is that the right word to use here) about his beliefs on this.

So I guess from McCain's religion I was able to gather a little about how he thinks, but from Obama it was different, because he's obviously not as religious as McCain appears to be.

A very astute observation !

It would lead you to question -- not challenge, but wonder about --- Obama's core beliefs. Are they grounded in something firm, or are they malleable depending on the situation? It forces you to look elsewhere to get a sense of the man. Given his willingness to throw both Rev Wright and his grandmother under the bus, you have to wonder where his bottom line might be. What is his bottom line?

Makedde · #15 (**permalink**) 06-24-2008, 01:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spare

A very astute observation !

It would lead you to question -- not challenge, but wonder about --- Obama's core beliefs. Are they grounded in something firm, or are they malleable depending on the situation? It forces you to look elsewhere to get a sense of the man. Given his willingness to throw both Rev Wright and his grandmother under the bus, you have to wonder where his bottom line might be. What is his bottom line?

I have no idea what his bottom line is. I do like him over McCain, though. Religion doesn't bother me as long as it doesn't influence someone in their decision making, and I think McCain could be influenced. There's no telling if Obama will also be influenced by his religion to make decisions, but even if he was, I don't think those decisions would be anything major.

Spare · #16 (**permalink**) 06-24-2008, 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makedde

I have no idea what his bottom line is. I do like him over McCain, though. Religion doesn't bother me as long as it doesn't influence someone in their decision making, and I think McCain could be influenced. There's no telling if Obama will also be influenced by his religion to make decisions, but even if he was, I don't think those decisions would be anything major.

I hear that argument all the time ... "He'll be influenced by his religion" ... I'm not even sure what that means. I would expect a leader, any leader, to be true to his belief system. I wouldn't want him all over the map. McCain believes that murder is bad .. Obama believes the same thing. That is a core belief. I would expect both of them to be true to that .. that, if a life had to be taken, they would agonize over the decision, that they would try to find alternatives.

The only way I think a person can be influenced by his religion is if he calls his pastor for a vote !

When you say McCain can be influenced by his religion, what do you mean?

BillyBob · #17 (**permalink**) 06-24-2008, 01:28 AM

No.

I would not vote for ANY (*)(*)(*)(*)ing muslim piece of (*)(*)(*)(*)!

In case some of you have forgotten, islam has declared war on us.

By the way, Obama is a muslim.

Pat_Riot · #18 (**permalink**) 06-24-2008, 06:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spare

.. and that is exactly the crux of the issue. Which one's belief system do you feel more comfortable with? When you know the answer to that one, you then have a sense of the man.

(Unless he's Bill Clinton, of course, whose only religion was his slavish commitment to the most recent poll results)

But, tell me .... if a person supports, or doesn't support, a candidate because of his belief system, how does that make him a bigot? Doesn't that make him true to HIS belief system?

Anyone who doesn't vote for B.O. is a bigoted racist sexist homo-phobe and a big old farty pants. And no - it doesn't matter if you've researched the candidates, their voting records and their positions on issues or not. If you don't vote for B.O. then you are a big fat white male conservative homophobic racist devil worshiper and baby eater.
Oops, I was typing so fast I dropped by Starbucks latte - better call my lawyer.

Yeshua_Lives · #19 (**permalink**) 06-24-2008, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makedde

No, I think a persons religion does influence them - but if Obama was a Muslim, lets say, and McCain is? whatever he is, which would be better to vote for?
Both hold religious beliefs, one more than the other. How do you decide which candidate to vote for, and which religion is more likely to influence?

Good question.....people would probably get in line with the candidate who best express their views and beliefs.

Yeshua_Lives · #20 (**permalink**) 06-24-2008, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makedde

Obama is a Christian, but he doesn't seem to hold very Christian views - especially when it comes to his thoughts on abortion, for example.
McCains opinions are something I could expect, but not from Obama. He seems liberal (is that the right word to use here) about his beliefs on this.

So I guess from McCain's religion I was able to gather a little about how he thinks, but from Obama it was different, because he's obviously not as religious as McCain appears to be.

very good point.........Obama seems to be kind of slippery when trying to get an idea of his beliefs and views......would like see him take a stand.....and say....this is my stance on the issue....and then take action to prove it......instead of just coming across as a BIG talker......

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