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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2008, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth-Bringer View Post
FOX News Poll: Third Party President Good for Country

Thursday, June 28, 2007

By Dana Blanton

NEW YORK — Nearly half of Americans think it would be good for the country if an independent candidate won the 2008 presidential election, according to the latest FOX News Poll. And despite acknowledging the improbability of the candidate winning, a majority says they would consider voting for an independent for president.

Also:

"We also need third parties to represent a vast part of our population. A USA Today/CNN/Gallup poll in October, 2002 showed 35 percent of Americans consider themselves independents. Only 32 percent consider themselves Republicans and 31 percent consider themselves Democrats. So most Americans do not consider themselves a member of either major party. No wonder almost half of Americans don't vote even in presidential elections when we only have two major parties involved and so many people feel neither one speaks for them."

"The American people also say they want third parties included in the debates. A FoxNews/Opinion Dynamics Poll showed that in 2000, 64 percent of the American people wanted to see Ralph Nader and Pat Buchanan, the biggest third party candidates, in the debates. That was corroborated in other polls, including an NBC News Today Show Poll."
It is important to hear all the views. Why not just do it.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2008, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neoconfection View Post
Third party candidates can post websites, go on youtube, whatever. Nobody has a right to debate anyone. They can debate a Dem or Rep, by becoming the Nominee for the opposing party.

Don't waste my time with them in a Dem vs Rep. debate. I don't want to see Nader in a debate between Barack and McCAin. I want to see what the future Pres. has to say (it will be either Barack or McCain) not what some hack like Nader spouts off, since he's not going to be President, and not even going to be an elected official, or even appointed as dog catcher.
I have to disagree if they are registered to run then why not debate ? this country needs a shake up .the major parties have given us (*)(*)(*)(*) to pick from
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 07-22-2008, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Butercupp View Post
Truth Bringer - Thank you for posting that! Ineresting to see I am not the only one who feels this way.
You're welcome. We have nothing to fear from the truth.
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Old 07-22-2008, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quixote's Revenge View Post
It sucks to say it, but I really think that a vote for a 3rd party (in this election) is a vote for anarchy. - And remember, Kucinich is my guy....but this is serious effing business, and we all need to sacrifice to save this country from hell
You're forgetting one thing: If the third party candidates get enough votes to prevent one of the major party candidates from winning with 50% or more of the vote, then they have prevented them from claiming a mandate, and thus weakened them politically.
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Old 07-22-2008, 02:32 PM
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Where to put the blame on this?

You have to start with the electorate. As long as voters refuse to take a chance and either not vote for the most likely losers or vote at all, third parties have no chance. Even in defeat, the mainstream politicians will take note of a large vote total for a third (or fourth) party. They will then try to compete and move in that direction.

Second, I blame the media. Ralph Nader wrote a book about running for President and he felt that voters will take their cue based upon coverage in considering who a "real" candidate. Nader felt that coverage of either himself or any other third party will generally label them as "nonserious" and take attention away from their ideas.

Third, the amount of money it takes to run for President is crazy with a large amount of that money going to media networks for TV ads. We package candidates like we do breakfast cereal. More slogans, less real ideas.

We can hope that the internet might be the next great equalizer that turns things around and I think it has promise. But I think third parties have a tough battle to be seriously considered. I cannot image how a country that used to have three TV stations, now has 300+ to choose from and yet we still only have two political parties.
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Old 07-22-2008, 02:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth-Bringer View Post
You're forgetting one thing: If the third party candidates get enough votes to prevent one of the major party candidates from winning with 50% or more of the vote, then they have prevented them from claiming a mandate, and thus weakened them politically.

What do you mean, that's what I'm forgetting?

What percentage of the vote did Bush have in 2000?

It seems that my memory isn't the one that needs refreshing
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Old 07-22-2008, 03:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quixote's Revenge View Post
What do you mean, that's what I'm forgetting?

What percentage of the vote did Bush have in 2000?

It seems that my memory isn't the one that needs refreshing
That's not the factor in Bush's case because of one very important event - 9/11.
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Old 07-22-2008, 03:12 PM
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Ron Paul first ran as the libertarian candidate. Then, he discovered that the rules are just plain rigged against them. For instance, in my state of Oklahoma, in the last election I got to choose from Bush or Kerry. Period. There were many other candidates running, but I could not vote for them. The machine-read ballot did not allow write-ins. Then Paul ran as a Republican, and discovered that that was almost as rigged. The media immediately (before any debates had taken place) labeled him as "bottom tier" -even though he raised more money than McCain, and raised it completely grass-roots. Bottom line - our "democracy" or "republic" or whatever you want to call it is a joke. The will of the people matters not. It exists only to be manipulated by the corporate propaganda machine. If we do not have a new revolution we are doomed. The vote has become irrelevant, a scam to make you think that you wanted the tyranny you receive. America is gone.
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Old 07-22-2008, 03:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthofnovember View Post
Ron Paul first ran as the libertarian candidate. Then, he discovered that the rules are just plain rigged against them. For instance, in my state of Oklahoma, in the last election I got to choose from Bush or Kerry. Period. There were many other candidates running, but I could not vote for them. The machine-read ballot did not allow write-ins. Then Paul ran as a Republican, and discovered that that was almost as rigged. The media immediately (before any debates had taken place) labeled him as "bottom tier" -even though he raised more money than McCain, and raised it completely grass-roots. Bottom line - our "democracy" or "republic" or whatever you want to call it is a joke. The will of the people matters not. It exists only to be manipulated by the corporate propaganda machine. If we do not have a new revolution we are doomed. The vote has become irrelevant, a scam to make you think that you wanted the tyranny you receive. America is gone.
Nice to see someone who can see the forest for the trees.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 07-22-2008, 04:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth-Bringer View Post
That's not the factor in Bush's case because of one very important event - 9/11.
The 2000 election was before 9-11, so your reply makes no sense.

Were you even old enough to vote in 2000?

It was obvious to all those who paid attention, that the minority party candidates - and the general division withing the democratic party they created - cost this country dearly....

2000 Election - popular vote

George W. Bush Republican 47.87%
Al Gore Democratic 48.38%
Ralph Nader Green 2.7%


Kinda sucks when you see it in numbers like that, huh?





So my point is, let's not make this McSame McStake again....
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