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Old 07-25-2008, 03:55 PM
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Default Greed and health care

I was wondering if anyone can explain to me why people are so opposed to universal healthcare. I've heard all the greed fueled arguements already. I really don't care that you don't want to pay for something that is for the good of society, what I want to know is why you refuse to accept a system that will cost you less than you pay now due to lower overhead costs, and elimination of uninsured people that can't pay seeking care anyways. Is it because of the name? Grow up if that's the case. Not all socialization is bad. I don't hear many people complain about socialized police and fire departments. Most people agree that they serve a greater good for society, so they fork over their taxes and use the services when needed. They are comfortable in the knowledge that they are there for them in an emergency. Health care works the same way. When you get sick you go to the doctor. When you pay for insurance you know that they are there for you when needed, the difference is that the police are not run as a for-profit entity. It's been far too long that we have been suffering with these leeches on society that call themselves providers. They don't have your interest in mind as they decide to raise premiums. Do you see better care as a result, or do you hear about bonuses for their CEO's and record profits for their shareholders. I'm sick of all the greed in this country, both corporate and personal. I'm sick of the people that refuse to do their part to ensure the welfare of the society that they claim to be so proud to be a part of. It is, to me, the worst trait a person can have. This is America, start acting like you deserve to be here.
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Old 07-25-2008, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by jp_hart View Post
I was wondering if anyone can explain to me why people are so opposed to universal healthcare. I've heard all the greed fueled arguements already. I really don't care that you don't want to pay for something that is for the good of society, what I want to know is why you refuse to accept a system that will cost you less than you pay now due to lower overhead costs, and elimination of uninsured people that can't pay seeking care anyways. Is it because of the name? Grow up if that's the case. Not all socialization is bad. I don't hear many people complain about socialized police and fire departments. Most people agree that they serve a greater good for society, so they fork over their taxes and use the services when needed. They are comfortable in the knowledge that they are there for them in an emergency. Health care works the same way. When you get sick you go to the doctor. When you pay for insurance you know that they are there for you when needed, the difference is that the police are not run as a for-profit entity. It's been far too long that we have been suffering with these leeches on society that call themselves providers. They don't have your interest in mind as they decide to raise premiums. Do you see better care as a result, or do you hear about bonuses for their CEO's and record profits for their shareholders. I'm sick of all the greed in this country, both corporate and personal. I'm sick of the people that refuse to do their part to ensure the welfare of the society that they claim to be so proud to be a part of. It is, to me, the worst trait a person can have. This is America, start acting like you deserve to be here.
What right do you have to steal from me to pay for your own problem?

None.

I say that we let the government sell healthcare insurance so long as it doesn't use tax money to do so, so that people won't just attack CEO's and corporate greed. Then people will shortly find out that those companies are not making more profit than they need to cover the costs of running and expanding their businesses because the government would have to have roughly the same profit margin to run its program.
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Old 07-25-2008, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jp_hart View Post
I was wondering if anyone can explain to me why people are so opposed to universal healthcare. I've heard all the greed fueled arguements already. I really don't care that you don't want to pay for something that is for the good of society, what I want to know is why you refuse to accept a system that will cost you less than you pay now due to lower overhead costs, and elimination of uninsured people that can't pay seeking care anyways. Is it because of the name? Grow up if that's the case. Not all socialization is bad. I don't hear many people complain about socialized police and fire departments. Most people agree that they serve a greater good for society, so they fork over their taxes and use the services when needed. They are comfortable in the knowledge that they are there for them in an emergency. Health care works the same way. When you get sick you go to the doctor. When you pay for insurance you know that they are there for you when needed, the difference is that the police are not run as a for-profit entity. It's been far too long that we have been suffering with these leeches on society that call themselves providers. They don't have your interest in mind as they decide to raise premiums. Do you see better care as a result, or do you hear about bonuses for their CEO's and record profits for their shareholders. I'm sick of all the greed in this country, both corporate and personal. I'm sick of the people that refuse to do their part to ensure the welfare of the society that they claim to be so proud to be a part of. It is, to me, the worst trait a person can have. This is America, start acting like you deserve to be here.
Universal healthcare isn't free. This seems to be missed by most people. You still pay for it, just in a less direct way. And in many different unseen ways.

When introducing universal healthcare basically you and your government agree to take on responsibility for the behaviors of everyone in your society, no matter how lacking in responsibility they may seem to be. And we're not just talking the apparent, easily seen behaviors that will take money from you and yours...we're talking EVERYTHING.

Everything we do in society reverberates through the wires and creates costs. Lifestyles determine health, and the cost required to treat lifestyle induced conditions in a universal system is passed along to everyone including you.

Fine...if you're in favor of being your brother and his brother and his brother and his brother's keeper and so on...so be it...but you'd better be the last person in the country to complain when you glance at your paycheck and hate all of the deductions you see.
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Old 07-25-2008, 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by White Fox View Post
What right do you have to steal from me to pay for your own problem?

None.
I am quite happy to pay for peoples healthcare through the taxes I pay. I just dislike paying for those people who have brought illnesses upon themselves.
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Old 07-25-2008, 07:47 PM
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I am quite happy to pay for peoples healthcare through the taxes I pay. I just dislike paying for those people who have brought illnesses upon themselves.
But what right do you have to force another person to pay if they aren't "happy" about it?
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Old 07-25-2008, 07:52 PM
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Until these issues are addressed it wont work. This issure is being discussed in current events.

What I want to know is how are we going to deal with the problems of the Mexican people coming into the US to get free healthcare? Doesn’t the idea of Universal health care and the flood of Mexican people that are going to come to this country to use it scare anyone?
How do we deal with an aging population that now can kept alive for years beyond their time of a natural death by machines and drugs? At the cost of millions of dollars per person.
I would love to hear how we deal with the real issues that will bankrupt any governmental run health care system.
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Old 07-25-2008, 07:53 PM
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But what right do you have to force another person to pay if they aren't "happy" about it?
Well I wouldn't say I am being 'forced'. We all have to pay taxes, and those taxes often go towards things we don't like. Do you mean to say that we should all get to pick and choose where our tax dollars go?
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Old 07-25-2008, 07:55 PM
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Well I wouldn't say I am being 'forced'. We all have to pay taxes, and those taxes often go towards things we don't like. Do you mean to say that we should all get to pick and choose where our tax dollars go?
It's called "having a voice in your government."

Democracy, in other words.
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Old 07-25-2008, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by jp_hart View Post
I was wondering if anyone can explain to me why people are so opposed to universal healthcare. I've heard all the greed fueled arguements already. I really don't care that you don't want to pay for something that is for the good of society, what I want to know is why you refuse to accept a system that will cost you less than you pay now due to lower overhead costs, and elimination of uninsured people that can't pay seeking care anyways. Is it because of the name? Grow up if that's the case. Not all socialization is bad. I don't hear many people complain about socialized police and fire departments. Most people agree that they serve a greater good for society, so they fork over their taxes and use the services when needed. They are comfortable in the knowledge that they are there for them in an emergency. Health care works the same way. When you get sick you go to the doctor. When you pay for insurance you know that they are there for you when needed, the difference is that the police are not run as a for-profit entity. It's been far too long that we have been suffering with these leeches on society that call themselves providers. They don't have your interest in mind as they decide to raise premiums. Do you see better care as a result, or do you hear about bonuses for their CEO's and record profits for their shareholders. I'm sick of all the greed in this country, both corporate and personal. I'm sick of the people that refuse to do their part to ensure the welfare of the society that they claim to be so proud to be a part of. It is, to me, the worst trait a person can have. This is America, start acting like you deserve to be here.
Why do you assume everyone who argues against you is driven by greed? Is it wrong to want lower taxes and a higher quality of life at the "expense" of a smaller government?

If you are upset at the present state of health care in the country, blame the Clintons. HillaryCare had this country scared half to death over letting the government control anything, and those fears are justified. Think of the waste we have in every other government enforced monopoly in our country. We have billions of dollars that magically disappear, teachers who can molest children and not be fired, and epic failures across the board in times of emergency. The free-market works well for everything we do, so the best solution to health care involves the government helping to extend the free market's grasp to those who can't afford health care, not ditching the system all together.
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Old 07-25-2008, 08:30 PM
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It's called "having a voice in your government."

Democracy, in other words.
If we all had the choice to choose where our taxes go, some things would be left neglected because no one would want to contribute.

I personally hate some of the things us taxpayers have to pay for, many things are a total waste of money and do not benefit us at all. But then at the same time, there are many things that do benefit us all as taxpayers and we should contribute to that, including health care, although as I said, I object strongly to paying for someones health care when they are responsible for their illness.
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