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Old 08-17-2008, 06:30 PM
Conrovist Conrovist is offline
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Default Nuclear power is selfish and immoral.

Nuclear power is selfish and immoral.

OK. Let us for a moment assume that modern nuclear power plants cannot melt down and are completely safe. (Google – Nuclear accidents)
Let’s also ignore the cost and time lag of building these perfect reactors, as well as all the problems of decommissioning, and just concentrate on the nuclear waste that they all produce.

Fisrtly, this stuff is more toxic than most of us are able to comprehend. A minute particle entering your body means certain painful sickness and death. At a time when cancer is reaching epidemic levels, we should remain cognisant of our own vulnerability.

Radioactive waste is also very hard to contain. It is unstable by definition, often requiring cooling and can cause unpredictable behaviour in the materials it comes in contact with. Every time it is rehoused or handled in any way, another load of “low grade” waste is created.

Many types of nuclear waste, take tens of thousands of years just to become half as toxic. Taking proper care of even one ton of such waste, for so long, is an inconceivably massive undertaking. If the cost of this, were factored in, then it would be clear that nuclear, is the most expensive power yet.

The dreadful cost of our irresponsible production of radioactive waste, will be born by our descendants for thousands of generations. Just how selfish are we? Not only have we squandered a large proportion of earth’s fossil fuel reserves and consequently rendered the planet a less hospitable place, but we are now demanding that the cost of our excessive energy use, be paid for by all the people of the future. We did not inherit any such foul legacy from our ancestors. It is absolutely immoral to foist this horror on our descendants.

As a species, we appear to be so proudly obsessed with our own cleverness, that we are utterly incapable of objectively assessing the cost/benefit balance of our technologies.

Real green policies are in direct opposition to the precepts of capitalism. Real green means LESS consumption, whereas capitalism depends upon perpetually increased consumption. A reasonably bright 3 year, old could point out that constant growth is ultimately unsustainable!

Accepting that we must use less, is a very unpopular concept to champion. But unless physics takes another quantum leap forward, it remains the grim reality.
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Old 08-17-2008, 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Conrovist View Post
Real green policies are in direct opposition to the precepts of capitalism. Real green means LESS consumption, whereas capitalism depends upon perpetually increased consumption.
Where I grew up we called this communism
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Old 08-17-2008, 07:04 PM
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Hooray for anti-capitalism and less-consumption!

If only the worlds leaders were like Stalin.......






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Old 08-17-2008, 08:12 PM
sunnyside sunnyside is offline
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What are you two talking about with communism? This guys talking about something else, communism tend to be even less green than capitalism because in capitolism people can make life hard on plants that are polution factories like in China.

The OP is talking about some kinda luditte thing.

At any rate nuclear waste is deadly, but we're getting great at containing it.

And so long as it's contained nuclear is better than other options to get up to full energy production.

At least until someone invents a better energy storage system so we can better utilize stuff like wind and solar.

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Old 08-17-2008, 08:19 PM
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What are you two talking about with communism? This guys talking about something else. Some kinda luditte thing.
Actively promoting a policy which is, to use his own words, "direct opposition to the precepts of capitalism" is Communism in some way by default. Ludittism is more of an extremist form of protectionism for workers.

If you need more evidence, then look at some of this guy's other threads:

Fallacies of capitalism 1 : Profiteers make perfect citizens
Fallacies of capitalism 2 - Free Trade = capitalist utopia.
Fallacies of Capitalism 3
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Old 08-17-2008, 08:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Conrovist View Post
Real green policies are in direct opposition to the precepts of capitalism. Real green means LESS consumption, whereas capitalism depends upon perpetually increased consumption. A reasonably bright 3 year, old could point out that constant growth is ultimately unsustainable!

Accepting that we must use less, is a very unpopular concept to champion. But unless physics takes another quantum leap forward, it remains the grim reality.
Great thoughts. How exactly do you plan on preventing sovereign countries from allowing their citizens to procreate? Are you in favor of telling mothers how many children they can have?

Conservatism is a fantastic idea, but nearly impossible to impose upon the human race unless you have some plan to either keep people from procreating, or kill them off en masse.
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Old 08-17-2008, 08:23 PM
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unless you have some plan to either keep people from procreating, or kill them off en masse.
Fear not, there is a perfect plan! Right here
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Old 08-17-2008, 08:25 PM
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Extreme environmentalism is no better then any other form of oppressive system.
Anytime one group wants to force and ideology on to another group without debate and vote it's fascism be it green, red, black or white.

Disclaimer:

I am all for protecting the environment we have to protect our earth, but why the hell do we have to go back to horse and buggy in the process?
Why can't we not drill for oil, build windmills, install solar panels, build nuclear reactors, perfect hydrogen and research fuel cells at the same time?
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Old 08-17-2008, 08:28 PM
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Actually yeah OP. Looks like you complain that some things aren't super perfect as we all dance around the maypole, but what is it that you actually advocate.
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Old 08-17-2008, 08:32 PM
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Nuclear power isn't selfish or immoral - but it is inefficient, polluting and expensive, and therefore, not much use.
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