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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 10-01-2004, 07:36 PM
powergrid powergrid is offline
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Originally Posted by Captain-Rolex";p=&quot View Post
For instance, when people who have just lost all their relatives due to American bombs scream "down with America" they mean the second definition of America.
Like I said, some people have legit reasons. Others are blowing steam. There are some people in the world who want to feel political and be popular. So if people around them hate America, mob mentality makes them join the rush to fit in. Some people are jealous, and other are bored. See what I mean? That's why I answered your first question by basically saying "All of the above."

But some people love America. Some people love the money, some people love the freedom. You are never going to nail it down because veryone has their own reasons.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 10-02-2004, 04:36 AM
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Default no freedom

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Because of all the $$$$$$$ of course.

The US has seized most of the world riches and therefor people want to benefit of that. In ancient times people also tried to get to Rome, not because the Romans were such good guys, but because the money was there.......................and people got to eat.
It's the freedom. You seem to have cause and effect reversed. The freedom led to the riches, not the other way around.

Freedom? Which freedom?

We are talking about a nation that still treats its former slaves like a burdon and does its absolute best to just keep them in their own hoods where they can shoot each other, pollute each other and keep each other down.
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Old 10-02-2004, 09:43 AM
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Default what a double standard

Personally I really could care less at this point why other countries hate America. It seems that it's the popular thing to do. So you know what? Since other countries feel they have the right to openly proclaim their hatred for my country I will stop holding back my negative opinions when it comes to other countries.

I hate Iraq. There I finally said it. I hate that terrorist breeding sand dune of a country. I hate their fanatical religion and I hate they way the women wrap themselves in rags from head to toe.

I hate Afghanistan for the fact that they breed monsters such as Bin Laden. I hate it from boarder to boarder and everywhere in between. I hate their backward people with their fanatical beliefs.

So I guess it's okay for me to hate these places, huh? I mean after all, if other countries can scream their hatred of me and my country I guess it's only fair if I proclaim my hatred of their's just as loudly.
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Old 10-02-2004, 09:57 AM
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You have every right to, but it's still stupid .

I think you need to understand what it's like in Iraq and Afghanistan - any of the people question fundamentalist Islam and dictatorships were exiled or killed. As a result, we have a nation consisting 100% of people who are like this. When a child is born there, they grow up seeing, literally, only one point of view. They have no access to media that isn't state controlled, and are taught to believe everything the preacher says is absolute truth.

You, however, have access to plenty of information. You've grown up in a massing of cultures and in a Constitutional Republic, where differing opinion flourish. You then, have taken a deliberately ignorant stance, whereas the people in Iraq and Afghanistan who hate all Americans have taken a stance that is ignorant because they actually know nothing else.
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Old 10-02-2004, 10:09 AM
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Default Uncle Sam is the worse

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Originally Posted by raven724";p=&quot View Post
Personally I really could care less at this point why other countries hate America. It seems that it's the popular thing to do. So you know what? Since other countries feel they have the right to openly proclaim their hatred for my country I will stop holding back my negative opinions when it comes to other countries.

I hate Iraq. There I finally said it. I hate that terrorist breeding sand dune of a country. I hate their fanatical religion and I hate they way the women wrap themselves in rags from head to toe.

I hate Afghanistan for the fact that they breed monsters such as Bin Laden. I hate it from boarder to boarder and everywhere in between. I hate their backward people with their fanatical beliefs.

So I guess it's okay for me to hate these places, huh? I mean after all, if other countries can scream their hatred of me and my country I guess it's only fair if I proclaim my hatred of their's just as loudly.
Sure you have the right to hate other nations. I never said you didn't have that right. I'm not a "fan" of Iraq and Afghanistan either, but I just hate the States a little bit more and with good reason.

The States are just the worse of them. The biggest terrorist is still Uncle Sam.
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Old 10-02-2004, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by MICcheck";p=&quot View Post
You have every right to, but it's still stupid .

I think you need to understand what it's like in Iraq and Afghanistan - any of the people question fundamentalist Islam and dictatorships were exiled or killed. As a result, we have a nation consisting 100% of people who are like this. When a child is born there, they grow up seeing, literally, only one point of view. They have no access to media that isn't state controlled, and are taught to believe everything the preacher says is absolute truth.

You, however, have access to plenty of information. You've grown up in a massing of cultures and in a Constitutional Republic, where differing opinion flourish. You then, have taken a deliberately ignorant stance, whereas the people in Iraq and Afghanistan who hate all Americans have taken a stance that is ignorant because they actually know nothing else.
This is precisely the reason why the Middle East needs a democracy. It's also why they're fighting us there now. Democracy invites freedom of differing views of which they are threatened by.
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Old 10-02-2004, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Captain-Rolex";p=&quot View Post
Sure you have the right to hate other nations. I never said you didn't have that right. I'm not a "fan" of Iraq and Afghanistan either, but I just hate the States a little bit more and with good reason.

The States are just the worse of them. The biggest terrorist is still Uncle Sam.
You are leveling a really general attack against an entire nation. What is it that you hate about America. The basic values it was founded on, its policies, it's people, it's government? Me? I am an American citizen, so you must hate me right? I doubt that you do, but my point is that this is the kind of thing MLK Jr was talking about. This sort of generalized hatred.

What frustrates me about people from other countries with potent opinions like yours, don't realize or want to realize that there are millions of people in this country who have their own thoughts and ideas, many who might agree with you. But you seem to think that there is this oneness of opinion here. That everyone has the same idea and opinion about the world. I think that is ignorant.
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Old 10-02-2004, 10:47 AM
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This is precisely the reason why the Middle East needs a democracy. It's also why they're fighting us there now. Democracy invites freedom of differing views of which they are threatened by.
I agree.

The Iraq war, however, wasn't the right way to do that.
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Old 10-02-2004, 11:20 AM
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Default Is the US really just misunderstood?

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Originally Posted by Captain-Rolex";p=&quot View Post
Sure you have the right to hate other nations. I never said you didn't have that right. I'm not a "fan" of Iraq and Afghanistan either, but I just hate the States a little bit more and with good reason.

The States are just the worse of them. The biggest terrorist is still Uncle Sam.
You are leveling a really general attack against an entire nation. What is it that you hate about America. The basic values it was founded on, its policies, it's people, it's government? Me? I am an American citizen, so you must hate me right? I doubt that you do, but my point is that this is the kind of thing MLK Jr was talking about. This sort of generalized hatred.

What frustrates me about people from other countries with potent opinions like yours, don't realize or want to realize that there are millions of people in this country who have their own thoughts and ideas, many who might agree with you. But you seem to think that there is this oneness of opinion here. That everyone has the same idea and opinion about the world. I think that is ignorant.
O I don't have real issues with Americans in general, those who share my views I reagard as comrades. However I have huge problems with the terrorism that US uses for its own interests.

I probably hear "nine eleven" a thousand times a day. The US wants the whole world to grieve for its citizens who died in those effect. If I'm not mistaken about 2500 people died in the attacks. Yet what the US doesn't tell us is that they have no problem killing people or backing up killer regimes as long as it is in their own interest.

Remember that Pinochet guy??A real psycho dictator. Well guess who backed this guy up! It was the US. Same goes for Saddam, Osama, The Sjah. Let's not forget the good people of Vietnam who died as a consequence of US terrorism. Remember the massacre US soldier started in Mai Lai? Where is THEIR monument or memorial day or annual presidential speech? When did the US grieved for THEM?
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Old 10-02-2004, 12:00 PM
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Why do so many hate the USA? Are they all crazy? Are they just jealous or perhaps just sadists? Are they all just bored, and decide to burn the American flag out of boredom?

Or, could it be that they have good reason for hating the USA?
I think it is mostly jealousy and/or crazyness (meaning irrational).

The main problem I have is that they see only the bad, and none of the good. Their view is not balanced...which is why I dismiss it.

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Can we really blame the North Koreans for hating the US after the crimes US troops committed over there?
Which North Koreans are you talking about? The average North Korean citizen, or the oppressive dictatorship that is in control of them?

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Can we blame an Iraqi who lost his child due the the embargo for hating the US?
What about the Iraqi who's child is still alive because Saddam is now gone?

Quote:
Basically, a lot of people have good reasons for hating the US. The US would do wise to change its attitude toward the world. What goes around comes around. September 11th was an example of that.
And our response to it was another example; threaten us at your own risk. Once aroused, we are relentless.

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Nope. The Iraqis never harmed the USA.
We were not attacking the Iraqi People. In fact, we went out of our way to avoid harming them and have gone to great expense to help them set up a government under their own control...as opposed to what they had before.

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So what you imply is wrong.
What you imply is wrong. Harming people by accident is not the same as targeting them deliberately. Even liberals dont really believe that.

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We are talking about a nation that still treats its former slaves like a burdon and does its absolute best to just keep them in their own hoods where they can shoot each other, pollute each other and keep each other down.
Um...who is it exactly that's trying to keep them in their own "hoods"? Could you elaborate?

Quote:
I probably hear "nine eleven" a thousand times a day. The US wants the whole world to grieve for its citizens who died in those effect.
I couldnt care less personally. I was actually suprised that the French didnt applaud it. Though many in the middle east did...that was predictable.

Quote:
If I'm not mistaken about 2500 people died in the attacks. Yet what the US doesn't tell us is that they have no problem killing people or backing up killer regimes as long as it is in their own interest.
We do not target civilians. When was the last time the US supported an oppressive regime?
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