Did you see all those conservatives outside the DNC vandalizing public property in the name of change? [/sarcasm]

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I'M DOWN WITH G-O-P
"Republicans believe every day is the Fourth of July, but the democrats believe every day is April 15."
Ronald Reagan

Barack's 66 Page List of Earmarks

I will take a page from the DLC and allow conservatives to frame and define what "liberalism" is.

On off-election years, a "liberal" is anyone who opposes the far right dogma that the GOP has been trying to frame as purely "American" for decades, thereby totally "unAmerican". This group contains roughly 70% of the population.

During election years, a "liberal" is only one who goes to the far left or is politician opposed to the GOP... so basically the average Congress Democrat, even Jim Webb, and aside from that- the anarchists that attacked the RNC Convention... Other than that we are all "moderates" who are alleged to be more like the right even if we are just too dumb to know it.
The "liberals" at this time make up much less than 10% of the population (a liberal estimate )

Of course if a "moderate" pisses the true-believers of conservatism off enough... the non-election year definition comes back temporarily. Thus I can be a "liberal" rather than a "misled moderate" simply by posting opinions here.

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That information is classified and to be given only on a need-to-know basis...

And I do not need to know.

Java, good post. It is true that while America is liberal it is still castigated by the far right. Given the failure of Cheney/Bush you would think this would change but now Palin/McCain are running against their own party's dismal record. What an odd bit of reversal; it makes one's head spin.

"Freedom depends on how men actually do behave, not upon how they are allowed to behave. It is a matter of character, not of foolproof constitutional devices. For fools are paramount in politics, and there is nothing which they are unable to destroy." p 156 The Liberal Mind Kenneth Minogue

http://oll.libertyfund.org/Home3/Book.php?recordID=0089

Conservatism=Constitutionalist.
That would be good.

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"The only title superior to President of the United States of America is Citizen."

Did you know the word "gullible" isn't in the dictionary?

Tresha quote:
I'm not sure why you are under the impression that because someone has mental health problems, they are incapable of intelligent and rational thought.

I would define a liberal as someone who:

• Was opposed to the Iraq invasion from the beginning.
• Is opposed to the kind of imperialistic meddling in the affairs of other regions that we've engaged in ever since the end of WWII.
• Believes that we must look beyond narrow American interests and work with other nations to solve environmental, economic and political problems.
• Is not a big gun buff (but is willing to allow others reasonable use of firearms).
• Is okay with paying taxes to fund government programs that are worthwhile.
• Believes that the decision of whether to have an abortion is a personal one, and none of the government's business.

That's my definition of a liberal. And by the way, I fit all of those criteria, so you can consider me a liberal.

I wonder why that could be. Oh, that's right.:

"You know, it's a funny thing, every one of the bastards that are out for legalizing marijuana is Jewish." - Richard M. Nixon - Republican Former President

"You have to face the fact that the whole problem is really the blacks. The key is to devise a system that recognizes this all while not appearing to." -Richard Nixon, to Chief of Staff, H. R. Haldeman, according to Halderman's diaries.

The kid who wrote this, clearly has no understanding of what has happened in the Middle East, or the authotarian - borderline fascist nature of the new terror laws.

Indeed, as in, they hate black people.

Ditto (with the exclusions of Mizha and White Fox). Most conservatives I've met, are either spoiled rich kids who know they are better off with some right wing nut job in power, or they are stubborn hicks from the southern states of America.

Yes, Liberals become liberals becuase they want to be rebels. that's such a ludacris statement it's embarrassing.

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Individuality is the aim of political liberty. By leaving the citizen as much freedom of action and of being as comports with order and the rights of others, the institutions render him truly a freeman. He is left to pursue his means of happiness in his own manner.
– James Fenimore Cooper

Liberalism is a concept that has roots in both left and right wing ideology. Basically, a liberal is someone who supports maximum freedom and liberty for all peoples without stepping on said liberties of others in order to achieve it. Today's conservatives certainly aren't liberals and most people who are identified as liberals today are really socialists and Marxists.

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Carolina Politics Online

OK... Sure... We can go with that, as impossible as it is (really it has to involve "minimal" stepping on others' liberties... otherwise we must define liberty so narrowly, that it is practically without meaning).

By definition.
Of course they are relatively liberal given the total scope of the political spectrum.
But today's conservatives are basically old Whigs with "libertarian" flare to make their message sound more appealing...

Socialists can be liberals (depending on the definition of socialism, broad or narrow). They have a different philosophy on how liberty is maximized than the "liberal-conservatives" (Goldwater, Buckley, Reagan, etc.) that created the frame you are subscribing to.
The whole "conservative/liberal = individualist/collectivist" concept is simplistic and distorted to the point of being retarded... but a lot of people buy it, and as such- we have more quasi-libertarian conservatives and illiberal liberals than we should.
But if you buy into that whole "Taxes=Collectivism=Not liberal" paradigm, you are buying into the paradigm that keeps this trend going.

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That information is classified and to be given only on a need-to-know basis...

And I do not need to know.

Of all the members of this forum I can think of, there is one reasonable and seemingly intelligent conservative. Submarinepainter. Other than that, I am at a loss(even though I am probably forgetting someone).


PS. I know a number of reasonable and intelligent conservatives in real life. So I don't just hate conservatives. I just wonder why none of the reasonable ones come to this forum?

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R.I.P. Molly, I miss you every day!!

Im a Tarte, what! you want some of this?


And what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. Thomas Jefferson

Some day they may even be smart enough to learn how to use capital letters.

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My Political Blog (Most recent update Oct 3rd) - Which Flame Warrior are you?