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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 03:41 AM
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Originally Posted by The Jovial One View Post
And stupid lenders made the LOANS to these "stupid" people, because of conditions set in place by stupid people like Phil Gramm and John McCain, and now that these stupid people have caused the stupid investors in these stupid financial corporations to fail, the stupid taxpayers who stupidly voted for a Republican administration will lose their stupid retirement savings if any of their 401Ks are heavily invested in stupid financial stocks.
Please show the Forum where John Sydney McCain sits on the Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs Senate Committee.

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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 03:42 AM
heikstheo heikstheo is offline
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Originally Posted by Diuretic View Post
In England even before WWII they still used "poor houses". WWII was a horrendous experience for Britain but in many ways it kicked out the old way and allowed a new form of society to arise from the ashes of the old. Don't forget that Churchill was kicked out of office by the Brits in the wake of WWII, they elected an avowedly socialist government and it set about rebuilding a shattered nation but also took the opportunity to put in place socialist policies which radically improved the lot of the average Briton.
Didn't the Brits put Churchill back in as PM in the early 1950's?
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 03:47 AM
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Originally Posted by heikstheo View Post
Didn't the Brits put Churchill back in as PM in the early 1950's?
They could well have, I'm only going from memory here. I was focussed on the achievements of the Attlee government but it could well be the case that Churchill was returned to power. I should look it up of course. Again from memory the Attlee government years which I think were from about 1945 or 1956 up until 1951? (can't remember off hand). Anyway they were pretty stringent for the Brits. Ration cards were still used until the mid-1950s for many things, the economic recovery was slow and tortuous. The irony is that while Europe was being rebuilt with foreign capital the poor old Brits were left to struggle by themselves and were burdened with a huge war debt which was only paid off to the US a few years ago. So I wouldn't be surprised if the Brits, tired of the tough times, voted Tory. I do know that the Tories were in power from the 1950s until 1965 with the Wilson government (the Tories were bloody woeful of course). But yes, I must check, thank you for the correction.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 03:53 AM
Guy Fawkes Guy Fawkes is online now
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Originally Posted by heikstheo View Post
didn't The Brits Put Churchill Back In As Pm In The Early 1950's?
1951............
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 04:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Guy Fawkes View Post
Correction, a Stupid mans copout.

Stupid people took loans they couldn't afford and suffered as they should for their stupidity.
Methinks we as a society don't do enough to offer people a good financial education before releasing them into society. What can we do about that situation? I get the impression that most people, when applying for a loan, have no idea what their payments will be and that, moreover, they assume that some all-knowing and all-powerful financial person will make a loan decision on the basis of their (the borrower's) ability to repay the loan. And that was a true assumption a generation or two ago. Back in the day, the banks held the line at your mortgage payment could not be more than 25% of total income nor could total debt be more than 36% of total income (hence, you reduce monthly payments on credit cards, student loans, and car payments to no more than 11% of what you're making before you apply for a home loan). Plus, jobs tended to be rather a bit more secure back then.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 04:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Guy Fawkes View Post
1951............
Thank you for that. I was only 1, I should be forgiven
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 04:18 AM
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Originally Posted by heikstheo View Post
Methinks we as a society don't do enough to offer people a good financial education before releasing them into society. What can we do about that situation? I get the impression that most people, when applying for a loan, have no idea what their payments will be and that, moreover, they assume that some all-knowing and all-powerful financial person will make a loan decision on the basis of their (the borrower's) ability. And that was a true assumption a generation or two ago. Back in the day, the banks held the line at your mortgage payment could not be more than 25% of total income nor could total debt be more than 36% of total income. Plus, jobs tended to be rather a bit more secure back then.
I'd agree. I remember being taught about compound interest in maths class but no bugger told me what it meant if I applied for a loan. Perhaps our school systems should teach us about citizenship and personhood as well as Pythagoras?
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 04:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Guy Fawkes View Post
1951............
Thanks! I thought I remembered reading in a biography of QEII (back when I was still yet a child) that when the then 26-year-old Elizabeth came to the throne in 1952 she begged Churchill to stay on as PM (apparently, in the British system, the PM resigns with a change of monarchs).
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 04:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Talo76 View Post
Sorry guys but most people (meaning anyone who isn't a Capitalist) hates 'freedom', people hate freedom, they want security and a strong sense of direction in life, they want security in employment, security in food, security in their home. The government can provide this,

People like stability, they like routine, they like government.
totalitarianism (tōtăl"itār'ēunizum) [key], a modern autocratic government in which the state involves itself in all facets of society, including the daily life of its citizens. A totalitarian government seeks to control not only all economic and political matters but the attitudes, values, and beliefs of its population, erasing the distinction between state and society. The citizen's duty to the state becomes the primary concern of the community, and the goal of the state is the replacement of existing society with a perfect society.
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 04:37 AM
Guy Fawkes Guy Fawkes is online now
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Originally Posted by heikstheo View Post
Thanks! I thought I remembered reading in a biography of QEII (back when I was still yet a child) that when the then 26-year-old Elizabeth came to the throne in 1952 she begged Churchill to stay on as PM (apparently, in the British system, the PM resigns with a change of monarchs).
He died in 55 if I remember correctly.
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