I’m very new here, but I see many of the same arguments that I’ve seen elsewhere. So.. for what it’s worth—take it or leave it—here is my humble opinion on the whole “religion v. politics” debate, followed by a simple challenge.

Religion and politics have served pretty much the same purposes over the millennia.

(1) They both provide rules and principles for civilization. Murder, stealing, and all the big favorite “sins” are both sins and crimes because they hurt people or they interfere with other people’s ability to live their own lives. (Please note: I’m sticking here with the ones pretty much anyone can agree on. I know there are a lot more potential discussions about what all those sins / crimes may be, but I couldn’t begin to cover all that.)

(2) Both have been used around the world to control the masses and to protect the status quo.

I’d argue that the second observation is the more nefarious of the two; however, controls are part of a civilized society. If we ever reached a utopia where we didn’t need external controls anymore, the controls themselves would still be in place, but they would be entirely internalized in each individual.

This idea of internalizing moral rules / laws may seem a lot like some sort of universal religious code; however, in everyday life, I think perhaps we can reach more of an agreement than we sometimes imagine, no matter from which side we approach the “religion v. politics” debate.

And here is my challenge. Whatever our beliefs, let’s not stop with merely expressing them through our votes and in our conversations.

How do we live?

Personally, I’m a communist. I’m also a strong believer in the Bible, and I love God. Personally, my belief in Communism is informed by my religious beliefs. I believe that anything I have—money, time, talent—comes from God, and that the best way I can express my gratitude is to share it with others wherever I can. As this is my core religious and political belief, I vote with this in mind. I believe in government protections and assistance for the most vulnerable members of our society—whether they be children or the mentally ill or disabled veterans.

Sound idealistic? It is. So is the idea that every four years we can potentially experience a huge shift in government and survive as a country. Somehow, it works. It doesn’t work perfectly by any stretch of the imagination, but it works.

I do not ask you to share my beliefs. Many people believe there are better methods for improving our lives and our country, and that is fine by me. After all, I’m a Texas Democrat. You can’t be a Texas Democrat and expect everyone around you to think like you do; you’d go nuts in no time flat!

So. Whatever our beliefs, let’s challenge ourselves to live them every day. Put simply (I know; why start now?), if you’re a Liberal, then buy somebody a tank of gas. If you’re more Conservative, then perhaps teach someone a skill. Whatever you believe in politically or religiously, live it. If you’re already doing it, then cool. If not, then think about it. Let’s see what kind of world we can make.

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Marthascrewit

Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me." Matthew 19:21

Ok first off.. lol.


Your ideas of communism and individual charity are very conflicting. But i would definetly encourage everyone to give more to those in need!

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Collective? I'm sure thats easy when your not surrounded by a bunch of (*)(*)(*)(*)ing retards!!!

This isn't communism, this is altruism.

Communism is using violence to force everybody to act that way.

The purpose of religion and government couldn't be further apart. Religion seeks to impose a strict set of beliefs and opinions upon the People whereas government seeks to prevent the imposition of beliefs and opinions upon the People. Governments, in the ideal sense, ensure the freedom and liberty of the People and religion seeks to restrict it through dogmatism.

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Soldiers swear to protect and defend the Constitution with their lives.

Politicians swear to protect and defend the Constitution with someone else's life.

No, you are once against using McCarthyist B-grade stereotypes of communism, not reality.

You want to look at forcing everyone to act the same, look at some of the libertarian fascists like Ayn Rand who support invading any foreign country which nationalizes private property.

Libertarianism is also at least incipiently, and often explicitly, racist, supports the whole 'white man and his property' and opposes more collective cultures in Africa and Asia as opposed to the private-ownership model of late 18th-century Germany.

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'A conservative is a man with two perfectly good legs who, however, has never learned how to walk forward'. - Franklin D. Roosevelt

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One can only wonder where some come up with dribble like this. Libertarianism is the philosophy that it is the government's responsibility to protect the rights and liberties of the individual, regardless of race, religions, sexual orientation, or any other criteria, from the abuses of others. The "others" include the collective violation of those rights and liberties by the government. Libertarians are opposed to any form of discrimination and to imply it is racist is false.

Does Libertarianism oppose collective cultures? Of course, but that is because collectivism violates the rights and liberties of the individual. We would also include the restriction that a Libertarian society would not attempt to force its philisophies upon another nation as that would violate the rights and liberties of the People of that nation.

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Soldiers swear to protect and defend the Constitution with their lives.

Politicians swear to protect and defend the Constitution with someone else's life.

No, individualism is an unnatural and dangerous imposition (always by force) on human civilization, which is fundamentally social. We are social creatures. This is why neo-liberal policies are so unpopular, and are usually carried out by corrupt or authoritarian governments, ie Pinochet.

Individualism is an alien concept to human society, and it's dangerous, I personally think it needs to be repressed.

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'A conservative is a man with two perfectly good legs who, however, has never learned how to walk forward'. - Franklin D. Roosevelt

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This is an opinion of a small minority and is certainly not a belief based upon the ideals upon which the United States was founded.

The Orwellian society where the government is all powerful and in the extreme dictates what the individual eats, what the individual owns (which they don't actually own but are merely allowed to use), the personal relationships of the individual, and literally enslaves the Individual as a source of labor, is not likely to be embraced by many who would prefer the freedom and liberty of the Individual.

And yes, individualism is dangerous to any entity, whether government or religious, which seeks to treat the individual as slaves.

From an American perspective the sole role of government is to secure the rights of the People.

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Soldiers swear to protect and defend the Constitution with their lives.

Politicians swear to protect and defend the Constitution with someone else's life.

I realize, Chief, that my being a Communist and a Democrat are, in a lot of ways, conflicting. But think beyond Marx's class struggle. The goal of communism--albeit most often approached in the most brutal of manners--is an anarchist utopia. Do I think this could happen in reality? Maybe, in a future I can't even spot from here. Do I think I would see it in my lifetime? Heck no. Do I think we could get much closer with a democratic society? We're talking same goals, different process. Yes, I do. And that would actually require more people believing in the same goals. Now I know that most people in this country don't believe in the same goals I do, and I respect that. Hence, I participate in the existing political process and in society anyway.

And how can I live out my belief that people ought to get along and actually provide support for all members of society? By doing what I do. And if I want to participate in the US political process, well, I'm pretty far left from Republican or Democrat. But if I'm going to vote anything within 100 light years of my conscience, well, I can't vote Republican, can I? Entirely free markets are pretty much anathema to me. In my experience, corporations are out to screw 2 groups of people: their employees and their customers.

I just don't buy the idea that the goals of Communism cannot be reached without bloodshed; on the contrary, I think they must be reached without bloodshed.

There are different brands of Communism, just as there are different brands of Christianity. Any school of thought has probably as many different variations as there are people who subscribe to it.

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Marthascrewit

Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me." Matthew 19:21

Ah, I think you might be applying two separate sets of rules. You talk about religion in its worst light, but you speak of government in its most flattering light. Either may be used to bring freedom or slavery.

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Marthascrewit

Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me." Matthew 19:21