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View Poll Results: Does 'trickle down' economics work?
Yes 25 26.60%
No 51 54.26%
Sometimes 18 19.15%
Voters: 94. You may not vote on this poll

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  #171 (permalink)  
Old 10-12-2008, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by SpankyTheWhale View Post
It depends on whether the rich people actually create more jobs and opportunities for the lower classes. It depends on whether they give to charity. It depends on whether they pay their employees more. What I hear is that usually rich people just invest their money to increase their own wealth.
yeah! like you say its not so simple. so how about tax the rich, then give tax exempts to those that are creating jobs ect. that would in turn encourage a growing economy.
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  #172 (permalink)  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:40 PM
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"Contrary to popular belief, the stock market crash of 1929 wasn’t the defining moment of the Great Depression. What turned an ordinary recession into a civilization-threatening slump was the wave of bank runs that swept across America in 1930 and 1931.

This banking crisis of the 1930s showed that unregulated, unsupervised financial markets can all too easily suffer catastrophic failure.

As the decades passed, however, that lesson was forgotten — and now we’re relearning it, the hard way.

(snip)

[For the last number of years,] Wall Street chafed at regulations that limited risk, but also limited potential profits. And little by little it wriggled free — partly by persuading politicians to relax the rules, but mainly by creating a “shadow banking system” that relied on complex financial arrangements to bypass regulations designed to ensure that banking was safe."

- Economist, Paul Krugman

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  #173 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2008, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by White Fox View Post
Oh.....my....(*)(*)(*)(*)ing....God........



WE DON'T HAVE TRICKLE DOWN ECONOMICS

LOOK AT THE GRAPH!!!!

THE TOP 1% PAYS 40%, THE BOTTOM 50% PAYS 3%

THAT'S CALLED TRICKLE UP ECONOMICS



And of course, had you been paying attention to the economy, you would have noticed that the cause of the economic meltdown is the government intervention in the economy in the form of government sponsored enterprise, artificial guarantees, the nature of the government and Wall St. with regards to having risk covered, the nature of the government and its involvement in the economy where companies are "too big to fail," and of course, the government requiring that many lenders give bad loans. Even had there been tons more regulation, the result would have been the same, if not worse.

Wow, yeah, yell it from the rooftops. Maybe the more you say it, the truer it will become.

Try Googling "trickle down economics" or looking it up on Wiki or something.

For that matter, try Googling EVERYTHING in your argument...

There is so much you obviously think you know and the rest of us ignorant peasants are just so stupid, aren't we...
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  #174 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2008, 04:36 PM
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In the Real World of Work and Wages, Trickle-Down Theories Don’t Hold Up

"Trickle-down theorists are quick to object that higher taxes would cause top earners to work less and take fewer risks, thereby stifling economic growth. In their familiar rhetorical flourish, they insist that a more progressive tax system would kill the geese that lay the golden eggs. On close examination, however, this claim is supported neither by economic theory nor by empirical evidence.

The surface plausibility of trickle-down theory owes much to the fact that it appears to follow from the time-honored belief that people respond to incentives. Because higher taxes on top earners reduce the reward for effort, it seems reasonable that they would induce people to work less, as trickle-down theorists claim. As every economics textbook makes clear, however, a decline in after-tax wages also exerts a second, opposing effect. By making people feel poorer, it provides them with an incentive to recoup their income loss by working harder than before. Economic theory says nothing about which of these offsetting effects may dominate.

If economic theory is unkind to trickle-down proponents, the lessons of experience are downright brutal. If lower real wages induce people to work shorter hours, then the opposite should be true when real wages increase. According to trickle-down theory, then, the cumulative effect of the last century’s sharp rise in real wages should have been a significant increase in hours worked. In fact, however, the workweek is much shorter now than in 1900.

Trickle-down theory also predicts shorter workweeks in countries with lower real after-tax pay rates. Yet here, too, the numbers tell a different story. For example, even though chief executives in Japan earn less than one-fifth what their American counterparts do and face substantially higher marginal tax rates, Japanese executives do not log shorter hours.

Trickle-down theory also predicts a positive correlation between inequality and economic growth, the idea being that income disparities strengthen motivation to get ahead. Yet when researchers track the data within individual countries over time, they find a negative correlation. In the decades immediately after World War II, for example, income inequality was low by historical standards, yet growth rates in most industrial countries were extremely high. In contrast, growth rates have been only about half as large in the years since 1973, a period in which inequality has been steadily rising."
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/12/business/12scene.html
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  #175 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2008, 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Infinate812 View Post
Wow, yeah, yell it from the rooftops. Maybe the more you say it, the truer it will become.

Try Googling "trickle down economics" or looking it up on Wiki or something.

For that matter, try Googling EVERYTHING in your argument...

There is so much you obviously think you know and the rest of us ignorant peasants are just so stupid, aren't we...
There is no purpose in googling it or looking up someone else's view of what "trickle down economics" is when the concept is this simple. Trickle down economics is an economic belief that people will benefit more when the rich are given more from society because of the belief that they will use the extra wealth they are given to produce more of it along with jobs.

"Trickle up economics" is the opposite, the economic belief that people in general will benefit more when wealth is taken from the rich and given down to the poor so that they will produce more from consumption of goods and the creation of demand.

Trickle down is a corporatist belief, trickle up is a Keynesian/socialist belief. What we have now is Keynesian economics mixed with certain corporatist elements. The Bush tax cuts represented not trickle down, but a reduction in trickle up. The two are not the same. We still have trickle up regardless of the Bush tax cuts, and we still have NEVER had trickle down economics running our economy.
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  #176 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2008, 06:09 PM
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We still have trickle up regardless of the Bush tax cuts, and we still have NEVER had trickle down economics running our economy.
The entire period of American history prior to 1913 (except the repealed/deemed unconstitutional acts of 1861-7 and 1894-5) was without progressive taxation.
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  #177 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2008, 06:10 PM
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"Trickle-down economics are shamefully ineffective and immoral. Since the conception of this ideology thirty years ago, the wages of CEOs have skyrocketed while the wages of average workers have stagnated. Corporate fraud is rampant, and capitalism is fraught with examples of privatizing profits and socializing risks. The current economic problems are a direct result of these economic viewpoints and practices. Has everyone forgotten the savings-and-loans scandals? These crises are not unavoidable components of a healthy economy; they are tragic consequences of irrational and dishonest fiscal policies."
http://www.kstatecollegian.com/trick..._united_states
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  #178 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2008, 06:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catawba View Post
"Trickle-down economics are shamefully ineffective and immoral. Since the conception of this ideology thirty years ago, the wages of CEOs have skyrocketed while the wages of average workers have stagnated. Corporate fraud is rampant, and capitalism is fraught with examples of privatizing profits and socializing risks. The current economic problems are a direct result of these economic viewpoints and practices. Has everyone forgotten the savings-and-loans scandals? These crises are not unavoidable components of a healthy economy; they are tragic consequences of irrational and dishonest fiscal policies."
http://www.kstatecollegian.com/trick..._united_states
Cutting and pasting articles that make the exact points that just got shot down gets you nowhere.
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  #179 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2008, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by White Fox View Post
Cutting and pasting articles that make the exact points that just got shot down gets you nowhere.
Being shot down in your mind does not make it so. We have 20 people on this thread that think TD economics work and 49 that agree with me that it doesn't work.

Your position is the one that is shot down, at least by the people that have voted in this poll.

Last edited by catawba; 10-13-2008 at 06:27 PM.
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  #180 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2008, 07:16 PM
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But not when opperated in a republican controlled manner.
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