Thread: The Catholic Church is a criminal organization...

Billy Graham: Pope John Paul II Was "Most Influential Voice" in 100 Years
By Michael Ireland
Chief Correspondent, ASSIST News Service


CBN.com – LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA (ANS) -- Speaking on the April 2 edition of CNN's Larry King Live program Dr. Billy Graham said that that Pope John Paul II was the most influential voice for morality and peace in the world in the last 100 years.

Dr. Graham told Larry King he had the privilege of seeing the Pope on several occasions at the Vatican.

"And tonight, I have a very strange feeling of loss. I almost feel as though one of my family members has gone. I loved him very much and had the opportunity of discussing so many things with him. And we wrote each other several times during the years," Dr. Graham said.

Larry King asked Dr. Graham: "Did he actually say to you once, "We are brothers' "?

GRAHAM: That's correct. He certainly did. He held my hand the first time that I met him about 1981 -- he'd just been Pope for two years when I saw him first. Because when he was elevated to the papacy, I was preaching in his cathedral in Krakow that very day. And we had thousands of people in the streets. And watching the television today of Krakow has brought back many memories.

KING: You said that he was an Evangelist.

GRAHAM: He was, indeed. He traveled throughout the world to bring his Christian message to the world. And we see tonight the outpouring from the world that he touched. And I think he touched almost everybody in the whole world.

KING: What, Billy, in your thoughts -- you said you feel like it's a personal loss. What in the human sense was so special about him?

GRAHAM: I think it was his background in Poland. And I had finished preaching all over Poland, gotten to know many people, and I knew a little bit about where he came from.

"And he was a suffering pope, too. He suffered as much as anybody you could ever imagine. His mother died when he was young. And he had that terrible assassination attack. And through it all, he taught us how to suffer. And I think in recent days he's taught us how to die.

KING: There is no question in your mind that he is with God now?

GRAHAM: Oh, no. There may be a question about my own, but I don't think Cardinal Wojtyla, or the Pope -- I think he's with the Lord, because he believed. He believed in the Cross. That was his focus throughout his ministry, the Cross, no matter if you were talking to him from personal issue or an ethical problem, he felt that there was the answer to all of our problems, the cross and the resurrection. And he was a strong believer.

KING: I understand that you've been invited to the funeral, but because of your own health, you can't attend. But someone in the Graham family is going to go?

GRAHAM: That's correct.

KING: Do you know who will go?

GRAHAM: I don't have the physical strength to go, and I have been invited. I was invited about six or seven months ago by the Vatican ahead of time. And they've asked that I come. So I asked if I could send my daughter. They wanted a woman to come representing me. So I'm asking my daughter, Anne Lotz, to go. And she's going with an associate of mine. And then my son, Franklin, will be going to the enthronement of the new Pope.

Originally Posted by CatholicCrusader

Jesus said his Church would be "the light of the world." He then noted that "a city set on a hill cannot be hid" (Matt. 5:14). This means his Church is a visible organization. It must have characteristics that clearly identify it and that distinguish it from other churches. Jesus promised, "I will build my Church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it" (Matt. 16:1 8 ). This means that his Church will never be destroyed and will never fall away from him. His Church will survive until his return.

Among the Christian churches, only the Catholic Church has existed since the time of Jesus. Every other Christian church is an offshoot of the Catholic Church. The Eastern Orthodox churches broke away from unity with the pope in 1054. The Protestant churches were established during the Reformation, which began in 1517. (Most of today’s Protestant churches are actually offshoots of the original Protestant offshoots.)

Only the Catholic Church existed in the tenth century, in the fifth century, and in the first century, faithfully teaching the doctrines given by Christ to the apostles, omitting nothing. The line of popes can be traced back, in unbroken succession, to Peter himself. This is unequaled by any institution in history.

Even the oldest government is new compared to the papacy, and the churches that send out door-to-door missionaries are young compared to the Catholic Church. Many of these churches began as recently as the nineteenth or twentieth centuries. Some even began during your own lifetime. None of them can claim to be the Church Jesus established.

The Catholic Church has existed for nearly 2,000 years, despite constant opposition from the world. This is testimony to the Church’s divine origin. It must be more than a merely human organization, because any merely human organization would have collapsed early on. The Catholic Church is today the most vigorous church in the world (and the largest, with a billion members: one sixth of the human race), and that is testimony not to the cleverness of the Church’s leaders, but to the protection of the Holy Spirit.

FOUR MARKS OF THE TRUE CHURCH

If we wish to locate the Church founded by Jesus, we need to locate the one that has the four chief marks or qualities of his Church. The Church we seek must be one, holy, catholic, and apostolic.

The Church Is One (Rom. 12:5, 1 Cor. 10:17, 12:13)
Jesus established only one Church, not a collection of differing churches (Lutheran, Baptist, Anglican, and so on). The Bible says the Church is the bride of Christ (Eph. 5:23–32). Jesus can have but one spouse, and his spouse is the Catholic Church. His Church also teaches just one set of doctrines, which must be the same as those taught by the apostles (Jude 3). This is the unity of belief to which Scripture calls us (Phil. 1:27, 2:2).

The Church Is Holy (Eph. 5:25–27, Rev. 19:7–8 )
By his grace Jesus makes the Church holy, just as he is holy. This doesn’t mean that each member is always holy. Jesus said there would be both good and bad members in the Church (John 6:70), and not all the members would go to heaven (Matt. 7:21–23). But the Church itself is holy because it is the source of holiness and is the guardian of the special means of grace Jesus established, the sacraments (cf. Eph. 5:26).

The Church Is Catholic (Matt. 28:19–20, Rev. 5:9–10)
Jesus’ Church is called catholic ("universal" in Greek) because it is his gift to all people. He told his apostles to go throughout the world and make disciples of "all nations" (Matt. 28:19–20). For 2,000 years the Catholic Church has carried out this mission, preaching the good news that Christ died for all men and that he wants all of us to be members of his universal family (Gal. 3:28 ). Nowadays the Catholic Church is found in every country of the world and is still sending out missionaries to "make disciples of all nations" (Matt. 28:19). The Church Jesus established was known by its most common title, "the Catholic Church," at least as early as the year 107, when Ignatius of Antioch used that title to describe the one Church Jesus founded. The title apparently was old in Ignatius’s time, which means it probably went all the way back to the time of the apostles.

The Church Is Apostolic (Eph. 2:19–20)
The Church Jesus founded is apostolic because he appointed the apostles to be the first leaders of the Church, and their successors were to be its future leaders. The apostles were the first bishops, and, since the first century, there has been an unbroken line of Catholic bishops faithfully handing on what the apostles taught the first Christians in Scripture and oral Tradition (2 Tim. 2:2). These beliefs include the bodily Resurrection of Jesus, the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist, the sacrificial nature of the Mass, the forgiveness of sins through a priest, baptismal regeneration, the existence of purgatory, Mary’s special role, and much more —even the doctrine of apostolic succession itself. Early Christian writings prove the first Christians were thoroughly Catholic in belief and practice and looked to the successors of the apostles as their leaders. What these first Christians believed is still believed by the Catholic Church. No other Church can make that claim.

Pillar of Fire, Pillar of Truth

Man’s ingenuity cannot account for this. The Church has remained one, holy, catholic, and apostolic—not through man’s effort, but because God preserves the Church he established (Matt. 16:18, 28:20).

He guided the Israelites on their escape from Egypt by giving them a pillar of fire to light their way across the dark wilderness (Exod. 13:21). Today he guides us through his Catholic Church.

The Bible, sacred Tradition, and the writings of the earliest Christians testify that the Church teaches with Jesus’ authority. In this age of countless competing religions, each clamoring for attention, one voice rises above the din: the Catholic Church, which the Bible calls "the pillar and foundation of truth" (1 Tim. 3:15).

Jesus assured the apostles and their successors, the popes and the bishops, "He who listens to you listens to me, and he who rejects you rejects me" (Luke 10:16). Jesus promised to guide his Church into all truth (John 16:12–13). We can have confidence that his Church teaches only the truth.


Adapted from this source: http://www.catholic.com/documents/pi...illar-of-truth

Including the Roman version of catholism.
Rome crucified Jesus. Killed Peter. But you say it is the origin of catholicism. Not sure Peter and Jesus would agree.

Originally Posted by Sean Michael

When did exactly the Roman Catholic Church stray was it before or after the reformation?.
Please tell me what rules and man made ideologies did the Catholic Church introduce?, so as I can at least defend my faith against these accusations, which are completely fabricated.
The reason why purgatory and limbo are things you have never heard of is because it is not in the King James Bible. It is in the books of Maccabees which is some of the books Martin Luther got rid of to create the King James version. The Catholic Church never said anyone can pay their way into heaven or pay for anyone else to go to heaven, this is a misconception of many Protestants. However we do believe praying for a loved ones soul can alleviate their time and suffering in prugatory. If someone is in hell there is no way out of there.

http://www.catholic.com/tracts/purgatory
A Catholic "Invention"?


Fundamentalists may be fond of saying the Catholic Church "invented" the doctrine of purgatory to make money, but they have difficulty saying just when. Most professional anti-Catholics—the ones who make their living attacking "Romanism"—seem to place the blame on Pope Gregory the Great, who reigned from A.D. 590–604.

But that hardly accounts for the request of Monica, mother of Augustine, who asked her son, in the fourth century, to remember her soul in his Masses. This would make no sense if she thought her soul would not benefit from prayers, as would be the case if she were in hell or in the full glory of heaven.

Nor does ascribing the doctrine to Gregory explain the graffiti in the catacombs, where Christians during the persecutions of the first three centuries recorded prayers for the dead. Indeed, some of the earliest Christian writings outside the New Testament, like the Acts of Paul and Thecla and the Martyrdom of Perpetua and Felicity (both written during the second century), refer to the Christian practice of praying for the dead. Such prayers would have been offered only if Christians believed in purgatory, even if they did not use that name for it. (See Catholic Answers’ Fathers Know Best tract The Existence of Purgatory for quotations from these and other early Christian sources.)

Maybe somewhere in this time frame. BTW - I don't believe hell to be as most christians say it is. I'll say at this time I beleive, hell = without God. Nothing more, nothing less.

Originally Posted by CatholicCrusader

Sorry Charlie, its a fact.
Protestantism is a 500 year old invention of men.
The Catholic Churchh was founded by Christ.

Again, only words unsupported by scripture. Prove it by sighting chapter and verse that mentions the Catholic Church by name.

Catholic church founded by Christ?????.....now that is typical of the type of quote that one would expect from a roman catholic....ie ,ludirous and without foundation....Face the simple truth.....it is a criminal organisation ,guilty of protecting evil people from the courts of justice.....from child rapists to SS war criminals....the whole rotten ediface will come tumbling down eventually under the weight of their crimes,and we can all witness the cockroaches scuttle off to the nearest failed state with no extradition treaty ,clutching sacks of stolen gold and hard drives full of disgusting child pornography.....

Originally Posted by CatholicCrusader

Sorry Charlie, its a fact.
Protestantism is a 500 year old invention of men.
The Catholic Churchh was founded by Christ.

Originally Posted by BFSmith@764

Again, only words unsupported by scripture............

Wrong:
They are facts supported by history.

Originally Posted by dairyair

Woah woah woah, culture and civilzation of the whole world? Hardly the whole world is christian.

Everyone in the whole world who likes to be successfull follows the greek tradition that was recreated from Christians after the roman empire had destroyed its own roots.

I'd say a majority is not.
Ancient and current chinese culture is hardly christian nor were they ever, I don't believe.

China? I don't know what China is today - a land that had murdered the own people and traditions is recreating today a kind of Disneyland-China. Could be China is not China - perhaps China is only a kind of mirror of our own system breaks.

http://youtu.be/C2UZReQGNVI

Originally Posted by BFSmith@764

Again, only words unsupported by scripture.

One part of the scripture[s] is from Jews - you are hating Jews ; the other part is componed from Catholics - your are hating Catholics. So what are you really speaking about if you are speakign about the christian religion?

Prove it by sighting chapter and verse that mentions the Catholic Church by name.

http://youtu.be/ETjoi1E8TVE

Originally Posted by CatholicCrusader

Wrong:
They are facts supported by history.

Unsupported by scripture. Prove it by sighting chapter and verse that mentions the Catholic Church by name.

Originally Posted by dairyair

http://www.catholic.com/tracts/purgatory
A Catholic "Invention"?


Fundamentalists may be fond of saying the Catholic Church "invented" the doctrine of purgatory to make money, but they have difficulty saying just when. Most professional anti-Catholics—the ones who make their living attacking "Romanism"—seem to place the blame on Pope Gregory the Great, who reigned from A.D. 590–604.

But that hardly accounts for the request of Monica, mother of Augustine, who asked her son, in the fourth century, to remember her soul in his Masses. This would make no sense if she thought her soul would not benefit from prayers, as would be the case if she were in hell or in the full glory of heaven.

Nor does ascribing the doctrine to Gregory explain the graffiti in the catacombs, where Christians during the persecutions of the first three centuries recorded prayers for the dead. Indeed, some of the earliest Christian writings outside the New Testament, like the Acts of Paul and Thecla and the Martyrdom of Perpetua and Felicity (both written during the second century), refer to the Christian practice of praying for the dead. Such prayers would have been offered only if Christians believed in purgatory, even if they did not use that name for it. (See Catholic Answers’ Fathers Know Best tract The Existence of Purgatory for quotations from these and other early Christian sources.)

Maybe somewhere in this time frame. BTW - I don't believe hell to be as most christians say it is. I'll say at this time I beleive, hell = without God. Nothing more, nothing less.

Purgatory was widely accepted before then, things are only made doctrine normal after people attack or dispute the teaching. Things like the Holy Trinity, the divinity of Jesus, and the Immaculate conception etc, etc. All these things were already accepted as truths before they were made doctrine, it was not until after someone or people started questioning or disputing these things was the Churches position clarified and they were pronounced doctrine.
So who compiled the Bible was it before or after the Church strayed?.
Who had the authority to compile the Bible?.
Was the Church that Jesus said he would always be with allowed to teach error for over 1000 years until the time of the reformation?