Atheist double standards. - Page 22

Andaras · #**211** (**permalink**) 05-03-2008, 03:57 AM

It would be good if people could please define between theism and deism, it's perfectly fine to be a deism as Jefferson and many Enlightened people of that age were, but to be a theist is much different. Deism believes in a 'cosmic order' or 'cosmic force' to explain nature etc, but deists do not believe in a personal God that interferes and cares about what humans do and behave. Theists, on the other hand, believe God has a plan for us and cares about things - for example he cares if we mutilate the genitalia of children, or what gender we have sex with, etc etc.

Theism is an impossibly grandiose claim because it's the claim that you know the mind of God (and they call religious people humble...), and you personally can therefore tell other people what God thinks. But given that religion is man-made the nature of 'revealed truth' is that it's always fallible, it's like Joseph Smith making up 'revelations' so he could sleep with any woman he wanted, and to grant himself absolute 'earthly' authority among his followers by claiming he has divine right.

I have no problem with deism, although believing it now with all the modern scientific advances is a little strange - but I'll accept it. But to an a theist in this day and age is almost beyond irrationality.

catzmeow · #**212** (**permalink**) 05-03-2008, 06:26 AM

I almost never bring up the subject of religion, especially in real life. The problem is, I cannot say the same for religious people. They constantly make comments that, for instance, people without faith are to blame for the disintegration of society. Or that, we are amoral hedonists.

When one is attacked in that way, one tends to reply. Especially when the religious people in question aren't even able to mount a good defense of why they believe what they believe, but then demand that others should, as well.

B L Zeebub · #**213** (**permalink**) 05-03-2008, 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akc814ilv

Yes some Atheists are militant, ignorant and are full of double standards.

I cant speak for them, all I can speak for is myself.

All that I want religious people to do, is keep their faith out of political issues.

That is all that bothers me about religious people is when they do that. I dont hate religious people, I dont look down on them for their beliefs, I simply dont want their religious beliefs and morals thrown into law because then in effect they are shoving them down MY throat.

I dont care if people pray in public, or pray in school for all I care. I dont care that it says God on our currency, or that God is in the national anthem. Heck im a big fan of Christmas and love Christmas trees. Put your naitivity scene in your front yard...I dont care!!... So lets not get rid of those either.

However when you try to tell me that something should be a law, and all you have is religion to back your political point of view up, then it is a problem because your taking something (religion) with NO PROOF or EVIDENCE to back it up, and you are trying to get it passes as law.

Every other type of law that gets passed in this nation requires that there be some proof of its validity before getting passed. However when it comes to "moral" issues, religion is allowed as "proof" and I cant stand that because from a historical and scientific stand point there is little to no proof to back up any organized religion.

Prove to me that God exists and that his morals match your own and ill take up your morals and allow you to put them into law. Until then there is no proof and it shouldnt be done.

Two things mate, the first is to say I donot want to be-little anything anyone says and I try my hardest, I also have never wished for any of my deeds good or bad to be open for debate.

My christmas if I was in the UK, I dont do Christmas, so it gets very boring.

So with friends of a similar ilk, we used to find a temporary homeless shelter and help, I am quite a skilled cook so I would cook whatever had been donated.

The hardest job was done by a young female chiropodist, some of these people had not taken there shoes of for a long time.

We also had to be quite tough, for obvious reasons alcohol was banned in all the shelters I helped in.

We would all feel the same, for three days your world stopped.

My big brother has three lovely daughter's he does not like christmas for the same reasons as me, but because of his wife and daughters would partake.

The girls from a young age were encouraged to cook christmas treats and then on christmas morning my brother and his family would visit a shelter and give these "presents" to the "inmates". I know my brother is an atheist, his wife and kids I dont know or care.

Thankfully these temp/shelters are not neede now, for selfish reasons I miss them!

Herkdriver · #**214** (**permalink**) 05-03-2008, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makedde

Can you prove it?

Me thinks no.

Can I prove what?

That morals are deteriorating?

Numbers don't lie.

More single parents than ever, more prescriptions for anti-depressants/anti-anxiety.

Addictions to pornography, drugs, alcohol, escapism through computer games, exra-marital affairs, chasing materialism by going into credit card debt, gambling.......
all coping mecahnisms to deal with the ultimate emptiness of life without God.

The atheist claims "I don't need God or Religion to cope" , but statistics do not bear this out young lady.

You want proof?

Walk outside your door.

I NEED God in my life.

This is not weakness.

B L Zeebub · #**215** (**permalink**) 05-03-2008, 12:13 PM

I dont doubt your sincerity, but if you compare the number of active religious people in the UK against those in America, then extrapolate surely our soc should be many times worse than yours?

Herkdriver · #**216** (**permalink**) 05-03-2008, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B L Zeebub

I dont doubt your sincerity, but if you compare the number of active religious people in the UK against those in America, then extrapolate surely our soc should be many times worse than yours?

Well, sir I don't believe Christian morality can be, ultimatley anyway, quantified.

It is possible for an Atheist to lead a very moral, empathetic life. To devote a lifetime to charitable causes, to raise children in a loving home, etc.

By claiming oneself as Christian, as I am doing, does not mean I lead a moral life.

Christian is just a word afterall. What defines it is accepting Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. To accept that humanity is separated from God and the only path to a relationship with God is by following the teachngs of Jesus Christ.

So the Moral Atheist is still separated from God.

B L Zeebub · #**217** (**permalink**) 05-03-2008, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herkdriver

Well, sir I don't believe Christian morality can be, ultimatley anyway, quantified.

It is possible for an Atheist to lead a very moral, empathetic life. To devote a lifetime to charitable causes, to raise children in a loving home, etc.

By claiming oneself as Christian, as I am doing, does not mean I lead a moral life.

Christian is just a word afterall. What defines it is accepting Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. To accept that humanity is separated from God and the only path to a relationship with God is by following the teachngs of Jesus Christ.

So the Moral Atheist is still separated from God.

So therefore there is less moral decline in the uk because of atheist with morals, than the greater moral decline in america caused by more religious people with no morals? outside your door of course, sir

I think I prefer to be separated from god, so if you are listening god dont bother to knock on my door, I wont answer and just incase I will double lock and bolt it

Makedde · #**218** (**permalink**) 05-03-2008, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herkdriver

That morals are deteriorating?

Define moral.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herkdriver

More single parents than ever, more prescriptions for anti-depressants/anti-anxiety.

So Christians have never become single parents? So Christians don't suffer from depression? Are you trying to link a mental illness with a lack of belief in God?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herkdriver

Addictions to pornography, drugs, alcohol, escapism through computer games, exra-marital affairs, chasing materialism by going into credit card debt, gambling.......
all coping mecahnisms to deal with the ultimate emptiness of life without God.

Right, and everything would be all nice and rosy if we worshipped someone/something we don't even know exists?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herkdriver

The atheist claims "I don't need God or Religion to cope" , but statistics do not bear this out young lady.

The statistics have nothing to do with whether one believes in God or not - how many people in your 'statistics' are Christian? Do you even know? Of course not, you simply assume that those who have children out of wedlock are not Christian, you assume those who gamble are not Christian, you assume all these things about people who are not Christian, and you mean to say that Christians don't (*)(*)(*)(*) up?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herkdriver

I NEED God in my life.

I feel sorry for you. I could never let my life be dictated by a mythical being.

C-D-P · #**219** (**permalink**) 05-04-2008, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makedde

[font="Arial"]So Christians have never become single parents? So Christians don't suffer from depression? Are you trying to link a mental illness with a lack of belief in God?

Right, and everything would be all nice and rosy if we worshipped someone/something we don't even know exists?

The statistics have nothing to do with whether one believes in God or not - how many people in your 'statistics' are Christian? Do you even know? Of course not, you simply assume that those who have children out of wedlock are not Christian, you assume those who gamble are not Christian, you assume all these things about people who are not Christian, and you mean to say that Christians don't (*)(*)(*)(*) up?

I say again. There is a difference between claiming to be Christian and being Christian.

Quote:

I feel sorry for you. I could never let my life be dictated by a mythical being.

Don't fell sorry. Believe it or not, he is in your life and you need him too. You just refuse to acknowledge it.

B L Zeebub · #**220** (**permalink**) 05-04-2008, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C-D-P

I say again. There is a difference between claiming to be Christian and being Christian.

Don't fell sorry. Believe it or not, he is in your life and you need him too. You just refuse to acknowledge it.

How can you tell the difference?

Also is he in my life, I would like to say hello, so would you ask him when you contact him next to expose himself to me, now that does make the catholic christians easy to spot, so leave them out of the first question

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