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View Poll Results: Should the West actively guide Russia's changes?
YES, i care what happens to their nukes! 5 83.33%
NO, let it go to hell! 1 16.67%
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Old 11-09-2007, 04:40 PM
mstislav mstislav is offline
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Default Russia to the West - is it a Threat or Hope?

wanted to share with you new article "Russia to the West - is it a Threat or Hope?" by Peter Khomyakov. I wonder if US and other western countries could benefit out of badly developed situation in Russia, or a "falling apart monster" could pull the rest of the world down to the hell?

The article itself is here - http://www.vdesyatku.com/RussiaToTheWest.html

Here's some quotes:
"The West is pretty much satisfied by the modern Russia 's role as just an oil & natural gas suppler for the well developed world economies. And the West understands that the Putin's Russia can not change this status quo by any political measures."

Then author briefly explains why Russia couldn't even hold such a role and concludes:
"So the simplest math allows us to make a statement that RF will either fail its gas export commitments already in the year 2010, or it will sufficiently cut the gas supply to the local consumers, which would lead to a social explosion and the regime collapse. Because of in Russia they could tolerate a hunger and social degradation, but not homes without heating."

Then he's asking "...Are there in Russia at least ideological factions (we even do not speak of the real forces) which stand for the full shape integration of Russia into the Western world?"

and answers "...such groups exist. But they are absolutely not known in the West. That's partly for the reasons of a political competition in the opposition field. But that's also partly because of not very professional job done by some of the analysts. "

And finally something for a dessert - "First. This movement sets a project of full integration of Russia into the Western world. But it denies such integration methods, which were used by the classic liberals in Russia in the 1990s...
Second. This ideological trend is ready to give a "green light" to the western capital for the access to the natural gas fields, which Russia could not develop on its own. And not just gas. Few people are aware that there are two new oil field regions in Russia, which are not being exploited yet simply because of lack of the capacity and know how...
Third. It is no secret that the ideological trend, being characterized here, has a sharp anti-Muslim vector. And in case of its political success it's ready to contribute actively to the West in solving the problems of Iraq and Afghanistan and so on...

Yes, these ideological formations are marginal. But the Bolsheviks (the communists) were marginal in the winter of 1916-1917. And through just 10 months they became the rulers of Russia . Perhaps then many in the West deeply regretted that they timely didn't pay attention to this marginal group. Who knows, the history of the twentieth century could take a different path then."

What do you think of all of that?
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2007, 05:02 PM
Maximillian Maximillian is offline
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Default we shouldn't loose Russia again

We lost Russia many times in the past. We shouldn't lose it again. Russia as an enemy is the threatening power. If we could do something to turnaround our history of relationship and bring Russia on our side as a friend, it would be lovely.
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Old 11-09-2007, 05:09 PM
mstislav mstislav is offline
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Default Losing Russia

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Originally Posted by Maximillian";p=&quot View Post
We lost Russia many times in the past. We shouldn't lose it again. Russia as an enemy is the threatening power. If we could do something to turnaround our history of relationship and bring Russia on our side as a friend, it would be lovely.
Well. All US analysts need to do is to support the right side inside Russia and stop giving a hand to losers.
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Old 11-09-2007, 11:12 PM
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MrHankey MrHankey is offline
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Default So...

i think Russia will became soon a new european and world "Zhandarm"policeman as it was 3 past ages.Russia have recurces and big territory with that country cant be tiny.If CIA noted that Russia will collapse in 2009 i think they meant Ukraine or Georgia,but not RF,because if people have good salary,home,cars,life and hope in further day what can crash such country?....just CIA or USA!!!....
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Old 11-10-2007, 05:35 AM
Maximillian Maximillian is offline
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Default Re: So...

You are right in almost everything. Except that Putin's Russia wouldn't become a wealthy country. All their current wealth growth has a simple reason - high oil and gas prices and intensified (really predatory) extraction and export of the energy carriers to Europe and China. This industry is close to its complete exhaustion. Another words, it's not a stable growth, but a last spurt before the collapse.

In such a situation, when the gas price would suddenly drop, all the wealth would go away as a mirage.

And speaking of wealth - I don't think that an ordinary Russian is really wealthy up there. Sure, they have lot of billionaires in RF, but the gap between those tycoons and rest of Russian people is huge, like in South America poor countries. So... you see if these people will be happy when all current illusions will go to hell!
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Old 11-10-2007, 06:18 AM
Maximillian Maximillian is offline
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Default Re: So...

You are right in almost everything. Except that Putin's Russia wouldn't become a wealthy country. All their current wealth growth has a simple reason - high oil and gas prices and intensified (really predatory) extraction and export of the energy carriers to Europe and China. This industry is close to its complete exhaustion. Another words, it's not a stable growth, but a last spurt before the collapse.

In such a situation, when the gas price would suddenly drop, all the wealth would go away as a mirage.

And speaking of wealth - I don't think that an ordinary Russian is really wealthy up there. Sure, they have lot of billionaires in RF, but the gap between those tycoons and rest of Russian people is huge, like in South America poor countries. So... you see if these people will be happy when all current illusions will go to hell!
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Old 11-10-2007, 06:18 AM
Maximillian Maximillian is offline
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Default Re: So...

You are right in almost everything. Except that Putin's Russia wouldn't become a wealthy country. All their current wealth growth has a simple reason - high oil and gas prices and intensified (really predatory) extraction and export of the energy carriers to Europe and China. This industry is close to its complete exhaustion. Another words, it's not a stable growth, but a last spurt before the collapse.

In such a situation, when the gas price would suddenly drop, all the wealth would go away as a mirage.

And speaking of wealth - I don't think that an ordinary Russian is really wealthy up there. Sure, they have lot of billionaires in RF, but the gap between those tycoons and rest of Russian people is huge, like in South America poor countries. So... you see if these people will be happy when all current illusions will go to hell!
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Old 11-11-2007, 10:36 PM
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MrHankey MrHankey is offline
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Default So...

So everage salary in RF is about 1.000 $ per a month,mine 3.700$ per a month.In Petersburg and Moscow its 2.000 $ per a month.BUT!!!...It can be much highyer,if power will use oil and gas,steel,gold $ in right way,but not in such which is now,a lot of mistakes done,i will not vote for Putins party,he is good guy,but party so so,but cos no body will vote for pro-american politics....
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Old 11-12-2007, 06:23 PM
mstislav mstislav is offline
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Default average salary in Russia

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Originally Posted by MrHankey";p=&quot View Post
So everage salary in RF is about 1.000 $ per a month,mine 3.700$ per a month.In Petersburg and Moscow its 2.000 $ per a month.BUT!!!...It can be much highyer,if power will use oil and gas,steel,gold $ in right way,but not in such which is now,a lot of mistakes done,i will not vote for Putins party,he is good guy,but party so so,but cos no body will vote for pro-american politics....
Wher did you get this information about average salary in Russia $1000 a month? Average salary in Russia is 200$ a month. People have to work on several jobs just to be able to buy food. I am not talking about raising children. It's simply catastrophe! Moscow is standing alone. If go out of Moscoe you will see dying villages and dying out people.
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Old 11-13-2007, 10:22 PM
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MrHankey MrHankey is offline
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Default So....

So i live in the city of Rostov-on-Don and here average salary is from 600-1000,just poorest people getting 200$ and its 20% by statistyc......average salary about 200$is just in Ukraine and Armenia,In Georgia lower 200$....Mstislav,you are not russian and better know me...if you are villagen from village Fartukovo in Kamchatka its not meant that your village is all russian cities....
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