Is Racial Segregation really a human rights Violation?

Discussion in 'Human Rights' started by Anders Hoveland, Dec 29, 2011.

  1. Shiva_TD

    Shiva_TD Progressive Libertarian Past Donor

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    Forced racial discrimination established by segregation, whether by law or the actions of the People, is a violation of the inalienable Right of Liberty of the Individual.

    No it is not possible for forced segregation to be either desirable or justifiable because it violates the inalienable Rights of the Individual. Only racists would support the position that it is desirable because they don't care about the inalienable Rights of All People.

    End of discussion.......
     
  2. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think in terms of white Nationalism politics which is the only way such a system could possibly try to reinvent itself, your dad would be seen as a 'race traitor' one of the worst crimes and likely executed, so no you would not see him.
     
  3. Libhater

    Libhater Well-Known Member

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    It may be the end of the discussion for you but it isn't the end for people who choose to segregate peacefully so as to live with their own kind, i.e. with those they feel more comfortable and safer with. You see, no one is showing or telling me just how wonderful it is to live in this multi culturalized integrated society with racial tension, heightened crime and poverty being some of their classic attributes. For example, if you were to take a survey comparing the intelligence of (IQ), the safer living conditions of, the employed factor of, a more cohesive family unit and the happiness of people living in a gated or segregated community to that of people living in a multiculturaled urban setting, which of the two scenarios do you suppose would be the most favorable?
     
  4. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    yes they are. The US is at last getting it's act together.

    http://www.thegrio.com/news/interracial-marriages-in-us-rise-to-all-time-high-pew-study-finds.php

    All studies show that racial or ethnic tension is less in mixed communities. It is the separation, the not mixing, the not knowing the other which creates racial tension - in other words ignorance.

    Heightened crime and poverty do often go together. Sort out the poverty. However, it seems to me that the biggest crime is caused by those far more near the top. Let's say the 0.1%. Maybe sort that out and the opportunity of a decent life will be for all.


    ...a survey of the intelligence, what are you talking about. In reality a recent UK study found that children from the poorest families and those with the least educated parents were 8 months behind by the time they were three. This had though nothing to do with race, rather to do with families not having the education and wealth to create the stimulating learning experiences, not having the education and wealth to give their children the best diet, which is essential for later development and so on. If you don't give children an equal chance in the first few years you cannot judge them after.

    I doubt anyone would deny they would like to live in better conditions with less crime but there is no reason to equate those with culture. It is clearly to do with opportunities for social mobility. The US is the third worst country in the developed world for social mobility - after Portugal and the UK. If you want to give people of all races and ethnicities the opportunity to reach their potential, then the place to start is equal opportunities for social mobility.
     
  5. JohnConstantine

    JohnConstantine Active Member

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    Right so now you're not foreal are you. There's a fourth option to carry on integrating in the spirit of America (not that I live in America). Yes there's problems with multiculturalism, largely down to racism. People regardless of race are gangsterized because of disenfranchizement. And really "setting up your own province" happens all the time, they're called black neighbourhoods. The argument seems to be some sort of whiney little girl talk about not being able to afford to live in the suburbs, well like I said if you're that scared of black people then go and live in a trailer park. I've dealt with why segregation is stupid... I'm not repeating myself.

    Why is it always up to WHITEY as you put it? Well, it isn't. But there is a stark contradiction in what you're suggesting. You are saying "I... Whitey hereby declare that all other ethnicities do exactly what I say and > insert three options <. Then you have the gall to say, nay complain with "Why is it always up to me, the white man what you do?"

    Ha you idiot.

    But this is all an act right?
     
  6. Libhater

    Libhater Well-Known Member

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    Tell me just how are these ghetto dwellers disenfranchised? Until you can tell me how and why these people choose to remain disenfranchised as you say, its hard for me to discourse this subject with you any further. Just remember, I've given you my solutions to bettering their ultimate demise, so the natural order for you would be to accept one or all of them or concede the fact that these people will remain impoverished, crime-ridden and totally lost in our ever evolving and growth oriented society.
     
  7. JohnConstantine

    JohnConstantine Active Member

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    You can't be seriously asking me why black Americans have been disenfranchised. 1865 is when slavery was abolished, now they say around 12 million slaves were taken from Africa, and you must know how brutal this process was and it spanned over several-hundred years (yes I know it wasn't you/us that started it). Those wounds don't heal right away, and neither do the prejudices - as you are so magnificently displaying as we speak. So out of the abolition of slavery you have a people run down, beat down, raped, abused, unconfident, illiterate... this reverberates down through the generations. But that's not the end is it, of course once slavery had been abolished black people had to struggle for their rights for another hundred years resulting in the civil rights movement in which many black people were beaten, killed, raped, and of course the Champion Martin Luther King was shot at the height of it. But eventually they managed to defeat segregation. AND STILL TODAY, IN 2012, THEY ARE FIGHTING AGAINST RACIST IDIOTS LIKE YOU HARKING BACK TO THOSE DAYS!

    You are a fool to even ask me such a question.
     
  8. Shiva_TD

    Shiva_TD Progressive Libertarian Past Donor

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    Hitler had his chance at "white nationalism" and we witnessed the results.
     
  9. Shiva_TD

    Shiva_TD Progressive Libertarian Past Donor

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    I don't personally care where someone chooses to live but the moment that they attempt to prohibit anyone else from living where they choose to live, even if it's next door, then they've violated the inalienable Rights of that Individual. If it is based upon "race" then it is a crime in America and that is as it should be because the expressed purpose of the United States government is to protect the inalienable Rights of the People.

    There is no rational justification for forced racial segregation or discrimination because ultimately there is only one race and that is the Human Race.
     
  10. Libhater

    Libhater Well-Known Member

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    Again, you haven't been paying attention here. No one is subscribing forced racial segregation in any way. What I am saying is that people who are living in or subjected to abject poverty, police profiling, surrounded by crime, come from broken homes and are more often than not addicted to drugs, welfare, incarceration and the unemployment lines should be given a voice in creating their own segregated community or peacefully making a transformation into a mini culture if you will that would be self goverened by their own people. If they were to do that (as I outlined earlier) everyone wins and everyone gets satisfied. No more racial tension or police profiling in the black community and the WHITE community would save the taxpayers billions of $$ that was once spent on useless and financially burdensome welfare programs. Both communities would also win for there would be zero chance of racism ever raising its ugly head again. It seems to me that you would be comfortable by having these impoverished minority communities stay integrated in with the majority just so that you'll have the majority of WHITES to b*tch at and or to blame for every racist comment or side look that comes down the highway. The only way to free these people from Liberal White govt welfare shackles is to give them their own province. Look the native Indians live their lives peacefully on reservations where no white 'racists' bother them, so why can't the blacks have the same opportunity as we gave the Redman? If you say the black man doesn't want to live segregated like their brothers in Roxbury and Harlem have been doing for decades, then what you're saying is that the black man feels more comfortable living a cradle to grave welfare existence, more comfortable being racially profiled and more comfortable blaming WHITEY for being these horrible racists all the while living in this danger packed & mixed multiculturalized society..Just admit it....multiculturalism is a bust and you're quite content with having our society stay mired in failure.
     
  11. leftysergeant

    leftysergeant New Member

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    Where do you think they would get the capital?

    Been there. Done that. Doesn't work.

    Because we took away most of their resources, they still live in poverty unless they get off the reservation and find work elsewhere.

    Cow cookies. If you limit a man's movements, you limit his opportunities. It's that simple. Total fail.
     
  12. Libhater

    Libhater Well-Known Member

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    What are you saying here, that the black man is unable to work for and or to create his own capital? You don't have much faith in our black people, now do you?

    Been where? Done what? What doesn't work? You sound like a defeatist.

    You're kidding, right? Have you ever visited a casino on an Indian reservation? The Indians were given boo coo $$ so as to build casinos on their reservations. They got all the resources they'll ever need including $$.



    Who's limiting their movement? I'm willing to set aside the entire Northwest territory of America to give to the blacks for them to set up house. How many wide open acres of land would be enough to satisfy their limited movement? Oh, I see, blacks moving into their own enclave would limit their opportunity to find work in a non white wilderness under the auspices of a non white government. Gotcha, that could be a dilemma.
     
  13. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    Isn't that the same argument you have brought from Stormfront?
    I thought you were ridiculed so much that you would not repeat your strange idea .
    Multi- Culturism is as big as the number of different cultures involved .Have you forgotten already ?
     
  14. Libhater

    Libhater Well-Known Member

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    What are you talking about? I didn't bring anything from Stormfront, and I've yet to be ridiculed about anything since everything I say makes total sense. What's this about a bigness of multiculturalism? What does that mean, and what does that possibly have to do with anyhing?
     
  15. leftysergeant

    leftysergeant New Member

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    Making them move to accommodate your sociopathic ideation is a limit on their movements and on the movements of the people whose niche you want them to take.

    I aint moving to accomodate the dellusions of a white punk who feels threatened by people who do not recognize him as special.
     
  16. Libhater

    Libhater Well-Known Member

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    How many times do I have to tell each of you that I'm not forcing or making anyone do anything. The art and the intellect of segregating races or cultures has to come from the varying factions of people themselves. Get it now? I can no longer attempt to discourse with people like you that come here totally close minded and ignorant.
     
  17. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I visit Stormfront from time to time and pretty much know the gist of the way they present to any non white so I was waiting to see what the response would be from two posters when John Constantine said that his dad was white and Mum was black. I would say for me in posts 47 http://www.politicalforum.com/human...-human-rights-violation-5.html#post1061156611

    and 49 http://www.politicalforum.com/human...-human-rights-violation-5.html#post1061156688 Libhhater confirmed to me that that he is a friend and probably poster at Stormfront. I know the attitude well.
     
  18. JohnConstantine

    JohnConstantine Active Member

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    Libhater, your posts are that of a buffoon. It "has to come from the varying factions of people" in that one statement you have shown the hole and the redundancy in your argument. If segregation was in any way desired you would see it, it would be an issue to be discussed. When was the last time you saw a pro-segregation protest that had more than say ten poorly evolved misanthropists in it? When did you last see a pro-segregation politician who wasn't a fat racists testimony to degradation and hate? When was the last time you were on a forum in which the majority of people agreed with you?

    Maybe take a second to consider that it is you who is closed minded and ignorant.
     
  19. Libhater

    Libhater Well-Known Member

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    You still don't get it, and that is sad indeed. Look, I'm not running for office here, and I'm not expecting even one person to agree with me on my segregation viewpoints. What I'm trying to do here through what I hoped would be reasonable discourse and debate is to get yours and others' feedback as to why you believe that accepting the status quo of the living conditions of urban blacks with the racial problems including racial profiling & race baiting, not to mention a bevy of social problems has to continue, when the logical remedy for such misery would be for them (the blacks) to find their own colony with their own self government far away from us white racists who are obviously making their lives unbearable. No one is talking about forcing them to anything, just trying to reach some sort of feasible plan to help out my black brothers in these times of racial discord. My love for humankind makes it difficult for me to do anything less.
     
  20. JohnConstantine

    JohnConstantine Active Member

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    Haha... I see, benevolence, of course. Well what a cringe-worthingly utopian sentiment. There are many problems with it Lib. I've mentioned just the divisive nature of the idea, the friends and families who are split, the attitude of "us" and "them" further permeated throughout the nation. The system would of course never allow it, down to centralisation of power. Washington is not going to let this proposed black state have sovereignty or self-determination. America's inherent psyche - built from years and years of policing the world - completely negates the idea that a black state could operate on its own accord. What countries can? The ones who have enough money and fire power, of which black people have little. So what's really going to happen? If racism is ingrained within the American system it must be tackled from the inside out, the solution is not to run and hide, it's like running in a monsoon in the fear of getting wet... if as you say the system is replete with white racists this black state would inevitably become a target of isolation, embargo, they would be forced to capitulate just like Latin Americans, it would be America's new play thing. And then you have to think about all the white people who would have to move... how would they react?

    However which way you spin it, whether you mean well or not, it's a stupid idea and it would never work. So, you and the black Panthers will have to find a way of getting along I'm afraid.

    Black people have come a long way, it's not like racism hasn't been mollified in the past few decades - the task is to carry on in that vein. The idea that America will never learn to be tolerant is pessimistic. You have a dream, Martin Luther King had a dream, which one do you think the people, black or white, would choose?

    It's nothing new Lib, don't pretend, you keep going on about genuine discourse as if this is a serious a viable plan.
     
  21. leftysergeant

    leftysergeant New Member

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    What closed mind? I just happen to know that most of the black people in this country don't want to be re-segregated and most white people with an IQ higher than room temperature think it's a dumb idea. We tried it. It didn't work. Why would anyone want to try it again and, to compound the stupidity, do it in a way that will totally (*)(*)(*)(*) off both parties to the land exchange that it would involve?
     
  22. Libhater

    Libhater Well-Known Member

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    When did we try segregation, and I mean total segregation that would have brought peace and harmonious living among the varying factions of people?
     
  23. Object227

    Object227 Well-Known Member

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    The term "segregation" conjures up images of policemen hosing down minorities in the south during Jim Crow. Is there really such a thing as voluntary segregation of the races? I can't believe that for a second.
     
  24. Libhater

    Libhater Well-Known Member

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    Yes there is such a thing as voluntary segregation, as I have done that myself choosing to live in a gated community far away and safely away from the racists and the racist tension.
     
  25. leftysergeant

    leftysergeant New Member

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    Problem solved, then. Stop bothering the rest of us. We have more important things to worry about.
     

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