The Abortion Debate...there is NOTHING like it!

Discussion in 'Abortion' started by tecoyah, May 10, 2015.

  1. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Tilting at the SCOTUS windmill crashed and burned so now the next target is the general election?

    If the current front runners end up as the candidates this latest crusade will be over by the end of the primary season.
     
  2. CurtisNeeley

    CurtisNeeley New Member

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    WoW! Thank you for educating me.
     
  3. CurtisNeeley

    CurtisNeeley New Member

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    My next "windmill" is this entire dishonorable nation trend. I refuse to participate in this FRAUDULENT democracy in ANY way unless Trum-phoey runs. Then I will vote for Clinton or whoever else despite abortion anytime before age-12 beliefs. This nation is an irreversible, human, self-rule failure and is usually immoral. The American corporate FRAUD is my "windmill".
    This crusade will not end for me, based on an average U.S. life-expectancy, till 2046 though I may finish dying before then?
    My belief this new "abortion of gestation law" would be the new U.S. law very soon was apparently a TBI delusion.
    I will attempt to write a book about the legal failure(s) of America and make visual art and substitute teach HS. I hope to NEVER again seek anything in American courts.
     
  4. JoakimFlorence

    JoakimFlorence Banned

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    Judges do not always uphold the law; rather they use the law to justify the ruling they want to make.
    Many times judges are actually lazy, so lawyers are trained to write their briefs in a manner that the judge could easily just take out and use to write their opinion; they want to make it easy for the judge to rule in their favor. Reality is all too often judges have a shortage of critical thinking, that's the less than ideal reality.
     
  5. AboveAlpha

    AboveAlpha Well-Known Member

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    Your welcome.

    That article was from back in 2006.

    We are capable of turning any living Human Cell into a Stem Cell now.

    ANY cell at all.

    We also no longer need a Female Reproductive System to develop a Fetus as this can be done in an artificial uterus and womb if one likes to call it so.

    Thing is we do not even need cells of both sexes....we can take cells from just a MAN and turn them into Stem Cells...then turn them into an egg and sperm cell...fertilize the egg and implant the fertilized egg cell in an artificial Uterine Wall and grow a Fetus and birth a Baby.

    We can do the same using ONLY cells from a woman.

    We no longer need both Human sexes for reproduction.

    AboveAlpha
     
  6. talksalot

    talksalot New Member

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    Facts not exaggerations:
    Abortion is a living human fetus, developing in the womb being cut to pieces and suctioned from the womb
    Abortion ends more than a million lives each year just here in the U.S.
    Nearly half of women who have an abortion have a second abortion
    Abortion ends more lives each day than car accidents, cancer or heart disease
    Dehumanization is used to promote abortion
    Abortion is legal and people are comfortable with snuffing out over a million human lives each year



    An appeal to the hearts and minds of women and men is the only way to stop the killing and obviously, it's not easy to make that appeal. So many are irresponsible, sex obsessed, hard-hearted, selfish and immoral. Creating and killing your own children is encouraged by the pervasive culture of death that is so enthusiastically championed here on this board.

    Deciding to kill an innocent is immoral, and it's not just my morals, but universal...... and the decision to kill your unborn child should involve emotion....and if it doesn't there's something wrong with you.
     
  7. Fugazi

    Fugazi New Member Past Donor

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    Let me know when you have some facts and are not exaggerating.

    Much better, didn't have to wade through all the emotional hyperbole of your previous post . .so much easier.

    In the majority of abortions there is no " being cut to pieces", 63.1% of abortions occur before 9 weeks, far to small to be cut up, so that little factiod isn't quite correct.

    and?

    I'm surprised it isn't more considering the fact that a woman has 360 separate occasions she can become pregnant during her reproductive life, and that is only assuming she has sexual intercourse once a month for 30 years. Two abortions in a 30 year period.

    Again, and?

    Pure BS. I am quite content to state here and now that a fetus is human, and that I have no problem at all with the law deciding a fetus to be a person from conception as neither of them have any effect on legal abortion.

    I am as comfortable with abortion as I am with killing in self-defence as they both achieve the same result .. stopping non-consented injuries to another person.

    Appeal away, what I for one will not stand for is for people like you trying to force your moral viewpoint onto others by weight of law and by doing so deeming and lessening others, all this "irresponsible, sex obsessed, hard-hearted, selfish and immoral." hyperbole is purely your opinion and you have no right to force others to adhere to your opinion by using the law to enforce it, as to the added hyperbole of "Creating and killing your own children is encouraged by the pervasive culture of death that is so enthusiastically championed here on this board.", I have not seen a single pro-choice person championing death, we champion choice.

    A fetus is not innocent, it is not guilty either, it falls into the realm of mentally incompetent or lacking mens rea, and you should be aware that even a person who is mentally incompetent CANNOT injure others without consent, they cannot be prosecuted for injuries they cause .. but that does not stop the person they are injuring from defending themselves up to, and including deadly force.

    Absolute rubbish on the universal morals point, if, as you assert, it was universally immoral to kill the innocent (as you allege the unborn are) then there wouldn't be 1 million abortions in the US each year and abortion would not have been practised throughout recorded history.

    As far as the person making the choice whether to have an abortion or not there probably is a hell of a lot of emotion involved .. but when it comes to pro-lifers attempting to guilt trip these women with their own brand of hyperbole it becomes oppressive and irrelevant.
     
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  8. talksalot

    talksalot New Member

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    Medicaid will subsidize an IUD but not an abortion.
     
  9. Fugazi

    Fugazi New Member Past Donor

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    This has only been a reality in the last few years, and not all states do cover it. Medicaid does subsidize some abortions eg. rape, incest, or when the woman's life is in danger.

    so lets re-visit this in a few years time and see if the "free" IUD's etc have an impact on abortion, if the study done in St. Louis is anything to go by it will have a dramatic effect.

    In a study published Oct. 4 in the journal Obstetrics and Gynecology, researchers provided free methods of reversible, reliable contraception to more than 9,000 teens and women in the St. Louis area. They found that the program reduced the abortion rate among these women by 62 percent to 78 percent.

    "The impact of providing no-cost birth control was far greater than we expected in terms of unintended pregnancies," lead author Jeff Peipert, a professor of obstetrics and gynecology at the Washington University School of Medicine, said in a statement. "We think improving access to birth control, particularly IUDs [intrauterine devices] and [hormone] implants, coupled with education on the most effective methods, has the potential to significantly decrease the number of unintended pregnancies and abortions in this country."

    The findings have implications for public policy, especially given that President Obama's health-care plan requires employers to offer plans that include birth control coverage. This requirement has been a point of controversy in the lead-up to the 2012 election.

    Between 2006 and 2008, 49 percent of all pregnancies in America were unplanned, according to the CDC's National Survey of Family Growth. About 43 percent of these unintended pregnancies ended in abortion. Meanwhile, a 2011 study in the journal Contraception estimated that unintended births cost U.S. taxpayers about $11 billion a year.

    To see if access to free contraception could budge those numbers, Peipert and his colleagues recruited 9,256 women ages 14 to 45 living in the St. Louis area through flyers, doctors and word-of-mouth. They also recruited patients from the city's two abortion clinics. Participants were given the option of using any reversible birth control method, from the birth control pill to a hormonal birth control patch to a long-lasting IUD or hormonal implant.

    More than half of the women chose IUDs, 17 percent picked hormonal implants (tiny rods placed under the skin that release hormones), and the rest chose pills, patches and other hormonal methods. As a result, the researchers found, both teen births and overall abortion rates plummeted.

    Among women in the free contraceptive program, the teen birth rate was 6.3 per 1,000 women, a huge difference from the national teen birth rate of 34.3 per 1,000 women.

    Likewise, the abortion rate among women in the program was 4.4 to 7.5 per 1,000 between 2008 and 2010. Nationally, there are 19.6 abortions per every thousand women, a 62 percent to 78 percent difference. In the St. Louis area, the overall abortion rate in that time frame was between 13.4 and 17 abortions per 1,000 women.

    The study highlights the importance of long-acting contraception methods such as the IUD, researchers said. Birth control pills have a higher failure rate than these methods, because women have to remember to take a pill at the same time every day. But IUDs, which last about 10 years, can cost more than $800, the researchers said, putting them out of reach for many lower-income women who may not be able to come up with that kind of money in one lump sum.

    "Unintended pregnancy remains a major health problem in the United States, with higher proportions among teenagers and women with less education and lower economic status," Peipert said. "The results of this study demonstrate that we can reduce the rate of unintended pregnancy and this is key to reducing abortions in this country."
    - http://www.livescience.com/23726-birth-control-abortion-rate.html

    Add in some decent comprehensive sex education and abortions will plummet.
     
  10. talksalot

    talksalot New Member

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    Abortion isn't an opinion; it's taking a life.
    I don't respect people who kill their own children.
     
  11. AboveAlpha

    AboveAlpha Well-Known Member

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    No one likes the idea of Abortion.

    But there are cases where Abortion id Morally Justifiable.

    And there are Millions of Cases where Pregnancy never should have been allowed to occur.

    WE can lower the total number of Abortions buy over 95% by EDUCATION ALONE!!!

    This is a FACT.

    Anyone apposed to this is just s responsible for Abortion as the person getting one!!

    AboveAlpha
     
  12. Zeffy

    Zeffy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I don't respect people who want to treat women like broodmares and force them to gestate and give birth against their will.
     
  13. Vegas giants

    Vegas giants Banned

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    Let's be clear. In every single case abortion is morally justifiable. Every single one
     
  14. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Only SCOTUS justice currently on the bench that fits that description is Clarence Thomas IMO. The one and only time he ever wrote an opinion that wasn't a cut and paste from all of the other conservative opinions he was outvoted 8 to 1 by every other justice on the bench.
     
  15. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Disingenuous drivel because it fallaciously assumes that women don't agonize over the decision to have an abortion.
     
  16. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    No one is respected who lies about "killing children" when nothing of the sort is happening.
     
  17. JoakimFlorence

    JoakimFlorence Banned

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    Even these cases?

    women who get abortions over and over again

    woman fakes cancer to get a late-term abortion

    Democratic Platform Supports PARTIAL BIRTH ABORTION

    live baby put in ziploc bag, police "not sure" if a crime was committed (it happened in an Abortion clinic)

    It's not a baby?


    Or what about this?
    Model Josie Cunningham wanted to abort pregnancy to be able to get cast on Big Brother

    She didn't actually end up aborting that pregnancy, but went on to get an abortion under even more despicable circumstances:
    "I got rid of my unborn baby for a nose job to pursue my dream of being a porn star"
     
  18. bclark

    bclark Well-Known Member

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    To me, "morally justifiable" also means having positive impact on society? Unfortunately, it is just the opposite. There is a fairly distinct correlation between abortion availability and increased fatherlessness, crime, and child poverty.
     
  19. diamond lil

    diamond lil Well-Known Member

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    Those women don't need your approval and nor should they.
     
  20. Fugazi

    Fugazi New Member Past Donor

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    Yes, just because they do not adhere to what you find morally acceptable is not a reason to assume they are not morally acceptable to the people involved.

    Why should you version of morality be any better or imposed onto others, after all morality is not absolute.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Great, then adhere to what you consider morally justifiable and allow others to do the same.
     
  21. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    All BS........no correlation at all.....and don't try to prove there is by using LIEsiteNews or any other anti-Woman website....
     
  22. Fugazi

    Fugazi New Member Past Donor

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    As far as what you want to do about abortion then yes it is an opinion . .an ill informed one at that.

    Yes it is, justifiably as per Self defence found under the 2nd Amendment, the equal protection clause of the 14th Amendment and current consent legislation.

    I doubt many people do, the problem you have is providing enough evidence to stand up in court, so far that has not happened. What ever your personal feelings are about abortion has zero relevance as to it's legal position.
     
  23. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Abortion is an opinion (choice) that takes a life. It does not however take a "Child's" life and your seriously over used appeal to emotions got old several decades ago. I child is what we call a born human baby until adulthood. A fetus is what we call an embryo after it begins to form basic human characteristics...before that it is a Zygote. Until you people learn the basics of human formation you will never be taken seriously.
     
  24. bclark

    bclark Well-Known Member

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    Why are you anti-woman if you don't like abortion. After all aren't girls far more likely to be aborted then boys?

    http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/14/opinion/littlejohn-gendercide-women/
     
  25. Zeffy

    Zeffy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You are anti woman if you want abortion to be banned. Not wanting to allow women to make their own choices regarding their pregnancies is NOT pro woman.
     

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