How did Herman Cain get stage IV cancer?

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Inphormer, Sep 23, 2011.

  1. Inphormer

    Inphormer Banned

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    I was shocked by Herman Cain's irresponsible comment that he would have died if the president's health care plan was implemented. This is just the latest example of a Republican presidential candidate attacking science.

    The elephant in the room that I haven't seen anyone address is how exactly is it that a sixty+ year old with a six figure income living in America is diagnosed with stage IV cancer as an initial diagnosis. As another poster pointed out stage IV cancer is very advanced disease. It takes years to develop and there are good screening tests available. My point is I have never seen anyone who is consistently following the recommended screening regimen present with stage IV cancer as an initial diagnosis.

    You want to know one of the reason health care costs are so high in America? Lack of basic preventative care. We are all marveling at the expensive chemo and wonderful technically perfect surgery that has help Cain, apparently, beat cancer. What many fail to realize a far cheaper simple screening regimen perhaps could have saved his life and allowed him to keep his entire colon for a tiny fraction of the price.

    Now let me say this, I don't know with 100% certitude what kind of preventative care Cain was getting. All I know is that if he was following the guidelines it is very unusual for someone to get stage IV colon cancer at least as an initial diagnosis. Furthermore if I were Cain I would have been very meticulous about colon cancer screening. Let's see who is most likely to get colon cancer...

    [​IMG]

    Remind you of anyone? An African American sixty+ year old Pizza executive (deep dish indeed!)... you think he might wanna get screened instead of making stuff up about Obama? I think so. Herman Cain is a walking example of what is wrong with American health care. I don't want anyone that doesn't understand the power and cost effectiveness of government encouraged screening programs running my government. If Cuba can do it I'm pretty sure we can do it. I believe in America.

    And don't get me started on the vaccine truthers.
     
  2. Margot

    Margot Account closed, not banned

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    Evidently Cain couldn't afford to go to the doctor for routine check ups like so many other Americans..
     
  3. HB Surfer

    HB Surfer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Wow... how pathetic.

    May I ask where you got your degree in medicine and when did you examine Mr. Cain?
     
  4. Margot

    Margot Account closed, not banned

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    Men with insurance begin having colonoscopies every two or three years between the ages of 45- 50. The docs remove polyps.. it doesn't get to stage 4.. Cain is an idiot..
     
  5. HB Surfer

    HB Surfer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You liberals need to tell us where you all got your medical degrees.

    Tony Snow had regular check ups... and died.

    There is no guarantee.
     
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  6. submarinepainter

    submarinepainter Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I am sure he gets a check up every year ! I do and I do not want government run Healthcare as it is written right now . We need a much better plan without so many loopholes preferably not run the Government
     
  7. Margot

    Margot Account closed, not banned

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    Why don't you detail what sort of physician examined Snow and how..
     
  8. Lethal

    Lethal New Member

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    Preventative care is so bad because insurance companies wont pay for it. Why? Because odds are you will not be using them at some point in your life (IE, you will change companies). They will take your money as a client for much of your life. When you make the change, it is some other companies burden to pay for your cancer bills.

    In other words, preventative medicine costs the insurance companies money instead of saves them money like some would argue (their argument being that if they prevented the disease they wouldn't have to pay for the hefty cost of caring for that disease).
     
  9. HB Surfer

    HB Surfer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I don't have to. Snow spoke of it often. Sorry you are ignorant on the matter.
     
  10. Margot

    Margot Account closed, not banned

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    Read his story.. It was advanced in 2005 when it was first discovered.....
     
  11. Inphormer

    Inphormer Banned

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    Maybe now that he's had feet of his colon removed. Prior to that the evidence would seem to indicate otherwise.

    Besides not all "check ups" are colon cancer screening. I would be very curious to see what type of colon cancer screening regimen he was undergoing that turned up an initial diagnosis of stage IV cancer.
     
  12. HB Surfer

    HB Surfer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    His story... you are full of crap... again.

    So again... where did you get your medical degree?
     
  13. Inphormer

    Inphormer Banned

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    I am not really familiar with Tony Snow's cancer diagnosis or his views on health reform. Which is why I didn't comment on him.

    You have to realize not all cancers are the same. There are certain heritable diseases that cause the early onset of particularly aggressive cancers. Simple screening is far less effective against those cancers. In fact its such a problem they prophylactically remove people's colons in their 30's or even 20's in some cases! Even without a cancer diagnosis. The exception does not disprove the rule. There is no indication that Herman Cain suffers from ulcerative colitis or familial adenomatous polyposis or any other such malady. All indications are he is a sixty something African American with a terrible high fat diet nothing more, nothing less. Unless you know something we don't. And I don't mean that sarcastically. If there is something you know about Herman Cain's cancer diagnosis that would explain why his initial presentation was stage IV other than a lax adherence to a relatively cheap screening regimen I would love to hear it. Seriously I am really scratching my head on this one.

    Now Tony Snow is a whole nother matter...

    [​IMG]


    Comparing Tony Snow to Herman Cain is totally inappropriate. Tony Snow had UC. Here is the "screening" for one type of UC patient...

    [​IMG]


    Now I don't think anyone is suggesting Cain should have strolled into his doctors office at 45 and asked for his entire colon to be removed without a cancer diagnosis. This move could have been entirely appropriate for Tony Snow. Depending on the length and severity of his UC.

    Furthermore even with his early onset and aggressive cancer Tony Snow still did not present initially with stage IV cancer, which makes Herman Cain's story even more fishy.

    [​IMG]

    Like I said an initial presentation of stage IV cancer in a man railing against greater access to healthcare should be sounding a klaxon on anyone's BS detector.

    These issues are complex and we have done an exceedingly poor job of educating the public about these issues in this country. You may want to refrain from telling people they are "full of crap" until you have all the facts.
     
  14. HB Surfer

    HB Surfer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Snow was diligent his whole life. You can throw all the dust into the air you want... but it does not change anything.

    Can you show us how Herman Cain neglected to have proper medical check up? If you cannot, all you are doing is speculating for arguments sake which makes you intellectually dishonest.
     
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  15. Inphormer

    Inphormer Banned

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    I never said Snow wasn't diligent. Snow had an entirely different disease process than Cain. You can't compare the screening procedures and results for a UC patient with a family history of early death from colon cancer and the general population. That is not how science is done.

    People who strictly adhere to the colon cancer screening guidelines generally do not have an initial presentation of stage IV cancer. This is a scientific FACT. In 2011 in the United States of America if someone without complicating circumstances arrives on a doctor's doorstep with an initial diagnosis of stage IV colon cancer you have to ask questions. It is unlikely this "expert" on Obama's health care plan was even doing the readily available basic cancer screening. Unless you know something I don't.
     
  16. Consmike

    Consmike New Member Past Donor

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    Cain is 100% correct. Don't slander the man. what a racist thing to say about him.
     
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  17. Surfer Joe

    Surfer Joe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It's not the government that we need to get out of healthcare, it is the insurance companies.
    The single payer system is ultimately cheaper and fairer.
     
  18. HB Surfer

    HB Surfer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What we fear is a liberal's / socialist's definition of "fair". When you boil it down to "fair" you destroy the American Dream.
     
  19. WertyFArmer

    WertyFArmer Well-Known Member

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    If it was discovered in 2005, that put's Mr. Cain at 60 years old when he went for his checkup. I know many men older than that who have not gotten a colonoscopy. They figure if there are no symptoms, they don't want a tube shoved up their butt.

    I got my first one at 35, because I was having some issues and they removed two polyps. I have insurance and was out of pocket may be $300 bucks. So I promise you Mr. Cain did not go because he felt it was too expensive, he more than likely did not get one done because he saw no need.

    Even if Obama Care made these screenings free, most of the older men I know would not get one. The procedure just sounds bad, and the night before is awful.
     
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  20. Inphormer

    Inphormer Banned

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    Well that is assuming it was a "checkup." It was probably Pizza three meals a day guy running to his doctor with abdominal pain, jaundice, and screaming there is blood coming out of my ass! This is stage IV we're talking about.

    That's true. That's a pretty common phenomenon. For better or for worse African American men certainly do have less of a predilection for allowing anything up their butts.

    [​IMG]


    Sound like anyone you know?

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    This is very true. Some people that advocate simply switching to Obama's plan or a socialized single payer system as a cure all are deluding themselves. Cuba has a socialized system but they are very aggressive about getting preventative care to patients and educating patients. I watched a documentary on PBS where a family practitioner routinely made house calls to make sure her patients were treated and screened. If she happened to find any children in the house when she arrived she checked them out too. It was very aggressive and very cost effective and believe it or not it did not involve ubiquitous robotic surgery. And the results speak for themselves.

    Herman Cain's cancer story has been touted as an example of the success of the US medical system. I think if we dig a little deeper we may discover it actually represents our systems abject failure.
     
  21. Consmike

    Consmike New Member Past Donor

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    The fact of the matter is, Cain, using private healthcare, overcame a dire situation.
     
  22. HB Surfer

    HB Surfer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Cain beat a 70% death rate with private health care.
     
  23. Montoya

    Montoya Banned

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    Would the man who makes no money have the same chance? No I doubt it. Private health insurance is an abomination.
     
  24. Consmike

    Consmike New Member Past Donor

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    Ever heard of medicaid?
     
  25. Grokmaster

    Grokmaster Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    We do? Says who?

    Have you ever lived as a man? Cain asleep is more brilliant than you on your best day....
     

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