Independence for Scotland

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by moon, Feb 5, 2012.

  1. moon

    moon Well-Known Member

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    :mrgreen:

    This is exactly the sort of idiocy that the Scots deserve to escape. Thinkaboudit. Foreigners could vote on Scottish independence whilst Scots could not.
    EVERY Scot should be permitted to participate in a referendum on Scottish independence- just as every Palestinian should participate in a referendum on Palestinian Statehood or every American on the future of the Union.

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    Why should Scotland be independent?
     
  3. moon

    moon Well-Known Member

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    So they can row it north to join Greenland.
     
  4. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Just how independent does Scotland want to be? I mean, do they just want to cut lose from the UK in order to move closer to the EU and adopt the Euro, or do they really want to go their own way?
     
  5. Marlowe

    Marlowe New Member

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    With respect Moon , the report sounds a bit ambigious. My understanding as stated by Alex Salmond, last week , was to exclude Scotsman not on the scottish electoral list.


    AFAIK - The eligibility of Palestinians voters was settled at their last election.


    -----

    I think Swinney is just trying to ensure that the same rules which applied to the last Scottish Parliament election would be used.


    The dispute continues .
     
  6. Marlowe

    Marlowe New Member

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    At this point in time , it sounds like they want the cake and eat it. i.e. they want to become Independent but continue whatever links they feel like keeping.


    .....
     
  7. moon

    moon Well-Known Member

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    The various factions can waffle indefinitely BUT..Scots are Scots, all of them, and each MUST have a say in the future of Scotland via a referendum. That's irrespective of how party sociological backroom boyos anticipate that ex-pats might vote.

    And no, the Palestinian refugee diaspora has not been consulted on Palestine's future. That must change- as Hamas has indicated it will.
     
  8. Marlowe

    Marlowe New Member

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    So , where would you draw a line . ? Include everyone with a Scottish grandparent ? Or only "Pure blooded - Scots " ?
    What abt the rights of recent immigrants (past 40-50yrs) non-Scottish minorities - Asians/Chinese (resturanteurs etc) Poles EU Nationals . who've settled in Scotland. ? Should they not be allowed to vote ?


    ----
     
  9. moon

    moon Well-Known Member

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    Well, what are the current criteria for determining who is Scottish ?
     
  10. free man

    free man Well-Known Member

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    Just like you apply on the Palestinians.
    Every body who had passed through Scotland some time in the past, or one of his parents has, or his before.

    Just like you claim Arafat the Egyptians is a Palestinian.
     
  11. Viv

    Viv Banned by Request

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    Last I heard, it was a Residents of Scotland only vote.

    Which is different from the last time, because we happened to be living in US when that took place and I remember my Dad voting by post/proxy. I suppose he might still have been regarded as a resident, I was too young to really notice the details.

    Anyway, that is what I understood this time, they want to limit it to residents of Scotland.

    I suspect if it goes against independence, there will be repercussions and the English will want to vote on it and severe relations anyway. It's not just about Scotland any more.
     
  12. Colonel K

    Colonel K Well-Known Member

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    Resident will include European and English residents too, but exclude native born expats.
     
  13. moon

    moon Well-Known Member

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    What a daft way to consult Scots.
     
  14. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    It is only in exceptional circumstances such as these ( they presently are like a mother in law who won't go home) that we let them chat among their selves .
    It's best to let them imagine they are making decisions but end up doing what we wanted them to do from the start .
    it will give us a big edge when they come whining for help in a generation or two .
    Giving them a good thrashing at Rugby yesterday also helped .
     
  15. Oddquine

    Oddquine Well-Known Member

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    UK election rules don't let Scotland do anything else...if you aren't registered you can't vote. :mrgreen:

    Palestine is in a different position..it is illegally occupied......not legally occupied and having to operate under rules dictated from another country......so they can decide on how they deal with their own vote.

    Many Palestinians are not outside Palestine through choice, while most Scots are...and I do have to say that I would be incandescent if my cousin, who has lived and worked in England all his life and hardly ever pokes his nose over the border was able to vote simply because he was born in Scotland seventy odd years ago.

    If you choose not to live here, you have forfeited the right to tell those of us who still choose to live here how we are to be governed...don't you think?

    All people furth of Scotland who still have postal or proxy votes in their home areas will get a vote though..but why the hell should people who have chosen to leave and make a life for themselves elsewhere have a vote in something which isn't going to concern their future?
     
  16. fredc

    fredc New Member

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    If someone is on the electoral role and are of voting age they should be eligible to vote.

    If someone isn't on the electoral role they shouldn't be eligible to vote.

    That is how democracy works, along geographical lines not racial.
     
  17. cenydd

    cenydd Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Precisely. The vote about the future of Scotland is for 'the people of Scotland', i.e. the current 'registered' population of Scotland, irrespective of where they originated. It is not for everyone who claims to be 'Scottish' in some way but doesn't live there - that would be a nonsense situation!
     
  18. moon

    moon Well-Known Member

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    Well, how is it decided who is eligible to represent Scottish national teams ? Must those Scots be resident north of Hadrian's Wall ?
     
  19. Iolo

    Iolo Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Some of 'England' is north of the Wall. The Wall was the frontier of Britannia.
     
  20. Oddquine

    Oddquine Well-Known Member

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    But the fact that they are expats will only exclude them if they are not registered to vote in Scotland. If they are, they will have organised postal or proxy votes.......and if they are not, they have chosen for themselves that the governance of Scotland has nothing to do with them any longer, as they have chosen to leave and make a life for themselves elsewhere.

    Heck......if you are going to take moon's Palestinian comparison to its logical conclusion, given the definition of Palestinian refugee.....the American born descendants of those forced out in the Clearances would be able to vote in a Scottish Independence referendum. :omg:
     
  21. fredc

    fredc New Member

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    Fortunately countries are run a little differently to football teams otherwise we'd all be owned by the Russian Mafia.
     
  22. Oddquine

    Oddquine Well-Known Member

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    The rules are those set down by FIFA....bar the one they allowed the UK Nations to change...as in FIFA has allowed the change from (d) "He has lived continuously on the territory of the relevant Association for at least two years". to (d) "He has engaged in a minimum of five years education under the age of 18 within the territory of the relevant association."

    But note......they actually have to have lived there continuously in the recent past.
     
  23. moon

    moon Well-Known Member

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    :mrgreen:
    Ah, but I didn't make a Palestinian comparison because there is no Scottish refugee diaspora. My point is that Palestinians are Palestinians- irrespective of where they live, forced exile or not- and that Scots are Scots whether they choose to live outside of their homeland or not. Many Scots have been forced south to work, for example- and the English Tories are not blameless in that- and should not be excluded from decisions involving their country's independence. So residence is a very poor criterion for deciding who is eligible to vote.
     
  24. moon

    moon Well-Known Member

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    So how did Zola Budd come to run for Britain ?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zola_Budd
    It states that her grandpappy was a Brit so she was whisked off to GB and given British nationality.


    So, what defines a Scot ?
     
  25. moon

    moon Well-Known Member

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    Maybe it's.......

    Haw, haw, haw ....haw. :mrgreen:
     

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