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Thread: Ju liar Gillard ruins our health system - worst PM EVER

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    Quote Originally Posted by axialturban View Post
    LOL, I explain the reason why the rebate was introduced and it confuses you.
    The rebate was introduced to buy votes for Howard. Nothing more. Nothing less.
    Quote Originally Posted by axialturban View Post
    The rebate was introduced to get people out of the public system, so the public system could better cope with the people who could not afford private care - pretty simple isnt it?
    But it didn't do that:

    Whether the rebate has eased pressure on the public system has been contested, as this recent Parliamentary Library Flagpost notes.[34] The Flagpost observes that if the rebate had been effective in reducing pressure on public hospitals, it would follow that the use of public hospitals would have declined while use of private hospitals would have increased, as people switched from the public to the private sector. Private hospital utilisation rates have indeed increased significantly since the introduction of the rebate. But a decline in public hospital use has not occurred. Utilisation of public hospitals has also increased along with a lengthening of waiting times for elective surgery.
    http://www.aph.gov.au/library/pubs/b...12/12bd020.htm


    When the private health insurance rebate was first introduced, it was argued that it would ease pressure on the public system. This has not occurred; demand for public hospital services has continued to grow and waiting times in public hospitals have lengthened.
    http://parliamentflagpost.blogspot.c...insurance.html


    Quote Originally Posted by axialturban View Post
    The ALP action puts pressure on the middle class to move back to the public system meaning longer delays for 'everyone' in the public health system.
    Sorry - but facts trump the lies of 2UE shock-jocks. You should try to remember that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by axialturban View Post
    It is silly. The rich pay way more tax then the poor and so its completely acceptable to use rebates to shape the uptake of private healthcare to improve the quality and capability of the public health system to better support the poor.

    Whats funny is how the ALP so desperatly needs to save money from their sinking ship that they have to screw the poor by making the middle class considering slipping back away from private healthcare.
    Those who see the world through envy coloured glasses, overtinted by greed and laziness, can`t be expected to see some of these things. With such a handicap, all they are capable of saying is, "look someone`s working hard, let`s suck the blood out of them!".

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    Quote Originally Posted by bugalugs View Post
    The rebate was introduced to buy votes for Howard. Nothing more. Nothing less.

    But it didn't do that:

    Whether the rebate has eased pressure on the public system has been contested, as this recent Parliamentary Library Flagpost notes.[34] The Flagpost observes that if the rebate had been effective in reducing pressure on public hospitals, it would follow that the use of public hospitals would have declined while use of private hospitals would have increased, as people switched from the public to the private sector. Private hospital utilisation rates have indeed increased significantly since the introduction of the rebate. But a decline in public hospital use has not occurred. Utilisation of public hospitals has also increased along with a lengthening of waiting times for elective surgery.
    http://www.aph.gov.au/library/pubs/b...12/12bd020.htm


    When the private health insurance rebate was first introduced, it was argued that it would ease pressure on the public system. This has not occurred; demand for public hospital services has continued to grow and waiting times in public hospitals have lengthened.
    http://parliamentflagpost.blogspot.c...insurance.html




    Sorry - but facts trump the lies of 2UE shock-jocks. You should try to remember that.
    Your argument is that the demand for public hospitals has continued? Thats no argument unless private hospital use didnt increase - which it did. All your quotes mean is that the public system is under even more stress then expected and the last thing it needs is more people from the middle class joining it.

    You ALP folk really gotta stop accusing anyone with an oppossing view as being mouthpieces of Bolt or Jones until you actually have a good point. When I call ALP folk out for being mouthpieces of spin its because their arguments are so obviously flawed that its obvious they don't understand what they are talking about. I've never listened to Alan Jones, Im not in Sydney, though I think Bolty is usually hilarious. If you didnt realise the Bolt Report is a (*)(*)(*)(*) take on the lefty TV media over the last 6 years, but it turns out its full of good stuff most of the time (though I havent been able to catch it yet this year).

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by dumbanddumber View Post
    I must admit when i first heard about it i thought it was acceptable.

    That is that the people on good incomes dont recieve rebates on private health cover.

    But after lsitening to the pros and cons i think its yet another Julia Gillard plan that will,

    1. Suck money out of the tax payers
    2. Overload our public health system.

    By taking away the rebate she will force many of the people that had private health insurance to down grade or onto medicare, this will overstress the system.

    With people coming of the private health scheme or down grading this will cause private health cover to rise.

    She will also incerease the medicare levy surcharge on people with good incomes to force them on private health cover.

    I tell you what these bloody politicians will pass the bill because it doesn't affect them.

    I have said this many times before and i say it again.

    WE NEED MORE AVERAGE AUSTRALIANS IN PARLIMENT.

    FFS get rid of these doctors and laywers.

    I cant wait for this PM to be tossed out on her ear.

    Hail Gillard
    is there anything Julia Gillard is doing right fro you? It looks to me, that you are a Labor hater, might that assumption be right?
    I don't like her either, and prefer Rudd a thousand times over her, but at the end we are better off with Labor then with Mr. Spock alias Abbotts.
    A conservative government would throw us back in medieval times, and Tony is proof of that, over and over again.

  5. #25

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    Some of you people have some misconceptions about medicare and private health insurance.
    Firstly, everyone is covered by Medicare and everyone who has an income, above $18,839 for individuals and $31,789 (increasing $2,919 for each child) for families, pays the Medicare Levy/Tax. It was called a levy because the government of the day, Labor, didn't want to speak the word tax.
    Even people with private health insurance are still covered by Medicare. The Health insurance company claims the Medicare rebate back for the individuals they treat.
    Just because you have private health insurance doesn't necessarily mean you go to a private hospital. Most still go to public hospitals for two reasons, one, there are not enough private hospital beds by a long shot and two, generally speaking public hospitals offer better care.
    When a person with private health insurance goes to a public hospital, the public hospital bills the health insurance company. The health insurance company then claims back any Medicare rebate for the service and often bills the insurance holder for 'excess' costs as well.
    When a person without private health insurance goes to a public hospital, the hospital claims the 'standard fee' for the service from Medicare. This is a lot less than what they get from billing health insurance companies.
    Now we have two people needing hospital treatment for illness or injury that is not immediately life threatening. One has private health insurance - big bill to health insurance company, and one has no private health insurance - small bill to Medicare. Which one do you think is going to get treated first?
    Private health insurance does not take pressure of public hospitals, the only thing that would do that is the construction of more private hospitals.

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    OMGawd, really? Everyone I know definatly goes to a private hospital if they've got private cover. The quality of service and care is miles apart.

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by axialturban View Post
    OMGawd, really? Everyone I know definatly goes to a private hospital if they've got private cover. The quality of service and care is miles apart.
    Patients generally don't know what goes on behind the scenes. Don't mistake service for care. Private hospitals will do whatever is cheapest for them, they won't do tests or run procedures unless they have to. Public hospitals don't have a profit motive, they tend to go the other way and do too many tests and procedures.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adultmale View Post
    Patients generally don't know what goes on behind the scenes. Don't mistake service for care. Private hospitals will do whatever is cheapest for them, they won't do tests or run procedures unless they have to. Public hospitals don't have a profit motive, they tend to go the other way and do too many tests and procedures.
    Isnt that the doctors decision? Are you suggesting that the private health care providers are leaning on doctors to reduce service??

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    Quote Originally Posted by dumbanddumber View Post
    I must admit when i first heard about it i thought it was acceptable.

    That is that the people on good incomes dont recieve rebates on private health cover.

    But after lsitening to the pros and cons i think its yet another Julia Gillard plan that will,

    1. Suck money out of the tax payers
    2. Overload our public health system.

    Hail Gillard
    You are a credit to your species and live up to your screen name.
    1. It actually saves the taxpayer $2.5billion but let's not get bogged down with the facts.
    2. Are you really stupid enough to think that a millionaire is going to go onto a public hospital waiting list, have no selection of a doctor and lay in a four bed ward with the great unwashed.

    Keep coming up with this sort of rubbish because you are a credit to the mad monk.

  10. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AdrianW View Post
    You are a credit to your species and live up to your screen name.
    1. It actually saves the taxpayer $2.5billion but let's not get bogged down with the facts.
    2. Are you really stupid enough to think that a millionaire is going to go onto a public hospital waiting list, have no selection of a doctor and lay in a four bed ward with the great unwashed.

    Keep coming up with this sort of rubbish because you are a credit to the mad monk.
    I'm not talking about millionaires.

    These days acouple who both have a decent education and job would be getting into the 150k mark combined income or more.

    Not millionaires by a long shot.

    Hard working aussies in my books.
    Last edited by dumbanddumber; Feb 26 2012 at 01:24 AM.
    There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than the carbon tax. dumbanddumber

    "The cost, paid by big polluters, will be passed through to the prices of the goods you buy." Julia Gillard

    "Australian households will ultimately bear the full cost of the carbon price." Ross Garnaut

    "A carbon tax does not guarantee emissions reductions" Former Labor Climate Change Minister Penny Wong

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