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Thread: That abortion is morally acceptable.

  1. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by MegadethFan View Post
    Everything is in the OP. Is this what you are after specifically:

    My Contention;
    Life of any kind only acquires value where it has an interest in its existence. Because of this fact, killing a fetus is morally acceptable because the fetus has no interest in its own existence.
    I have one question. Why is it you assume that your belief that life of any kind only acquires value where it has an interest in its existance is fact? This isn't a fact. This is your opinion and not one shared by all. When you start off pretending opinions are facts, you can't help but come up with a flawed premise.

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    Killing a foetus is morally acceptable because it occupies the body of a woman who is a person with rights.

  4. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by diamond lil View Post
    Killing a foetus is morally acceptable because it occupies the body of a woman who is a person with rights.
    So if you get shoved into someone else you suddenly lose all rights as a human being? Interesting concept. I hadn't heard that one before.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patriot911 View Post
    I have one question. Why is it you assume that your belief that life of any kind only acquires value where it has an interest in its existance is fact? This isn't a fact. This is your opinion and not one shared by all. When you start off pretending opinions are facts, you can't help but come up with a flawed premise.
    What I argue is that in pursuing an interest we give it value ourselves. Since other beings may have the same interest, if we pursue our own we ought to help the other entity pursue it as well. So if we take the mother and the fetus, the mother has a desire to live and so she acts to fulfill that goal. The fetus does not have an interest in anything and does not act to do anything as a result. Consequently the mother need not protect the life of the fetus because it does not value its own life. Does this make sense? This is the "fact" we can derive from the detached analysis - that value can only be placed on certain action where we give them value ourselves. This is not an opinion - it is a readily observable fact we can deduce by thinking rationally.
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    I'm willing to change my position at any time on any issue. I have done so in the past. All you need is a logical, provable case, and I'm all in. The question is, have you got what it takes?
    Oh, and just so you're not confused, I'm an apatheist libertarian.

    "If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all." --Noam Chomsky

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    Quote Originally Posted by churchmouse View Post
    See…you say abortion is moral…but you just don't want to talk about how it affected you. LOL
    My personal life is exactly that - personal. What it entails has no bearing on my moral position.

    Quote Originally Posted by churchmouse View Post
    Which proves every point that I have made or going to make about abortion and why people just want to keep it hush…..its a murder we just don't want to face or talk about.
    How is it murder? Murder is a legal concept. In most places abortion is not murder. Furthermore I do not want people to be hush about it, I want people to seriously engage with such discussions - but that does not require they lay out their personal lives for everyone to poke at. That is not only pointless to the actual discussion if it is irrelevant to furthering it, but is often harmful.
    ---------------------------
    I'm willing to change my position at any time on any issue. I have done so in the past. All you need is a logical, provable case, and I'm all in. The question is, have you got what it takes?
    Oh, and just so you're not confused, I'm an apatheist libertarian.

    "If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all." --Noam Chomsky

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    Quote Originally Posted by MisLed View Post
    partial breakthrough here. It's dirty laundry. It's true then. Women who have had abortions do not want to share that information openly. Why is that? It's because of the pain and regret involved as Churchmouse has stated.
    No they just dont want people to know. Are you really that hung up about people's private lives? I would like it if people openly said 'I had an abortion and I'm proud I can freely say that.' But the real reason is probably that they are just naturaly prone to be cautious of letting others know perosnal details about their life.

    Quote Originally Posted by MisLed View Post
    You pro-death guys just don't want to admit that.
    If someone has a problem or not with their actions they have NO responsibility to let others no about it. I dont know why you feel it is so important to get people to talk about their sexual experiences, but they are irrelevant and I feel the only reason you do ask is so you can manipulate such details to emotionally hinder someone. Since you ask, I have never got a girl pregnant. There was one girl I slept with who was worried she might become pregnant, but she was fine. How do any of these details impact on what I have said?

    Quote Originally Posted by MisLed View Post
    I can't figure that out either. Is it misery loves company?
    If you have a problem with abortion, state it, because I dont see what it is.
    ---------------------------
    I'm willing to change my position at any time on any issue. I have done so in the past. All you need is a logical, provable case, and I'm all in. The question is, have you got what it takes?
    Oh, and just so you're not confused, I'm an apatheist libertarian.

    "If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all." --Noam Chomsky

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patriot911 View Post
    if you get shoved into someone else
    Yeah because that happens a lot
    ---------------------------
    I'm willing to change my position at any time on any issue. I have done so in the past. All you need is a logical, provable case, and I'm all in. The question is, have you got what it takes?
    Oh, and just so you're not confused, I'm an apatheist libertarian.

    "If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all." --Noam Chomsky

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    What women do with their bodies is none's business so who cares if it is moral ?
    Morals are social values while an abortion is a personal issue, why it is never discussed if it is moral for a man to pee sitting ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mutmekep View Post
    What women do with their bodies is none's business so who cares if it is moral ?
    That makes no sense. To say what women do with their bodies is only their business IS a moral judgment.

    Quote Originally Posted by mutmekep View Post
    Morals are social values while an abortion is a personal issue, why it is never discussed if it is moral for a man to pee sitting ?
    You clearly do not understand what is moral and what is not. You very much could discuss the morality of peeing sitting down, we've just judged that morally acceptable just as we have individual freedom. Morality should never be just "social values", though they do often bleed into ethical debates.
    ---------------------------
    I'm willing to change my position at any time on any issue. I have done so in the past. All you need is a logical, provable case, and I'm all in. The question is, have you got what it takes?
    Oh, and just so you're not confused, I'm an apatheist libertarian.

    "If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all." --Noam Chomsky

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    Quote Originally Posted by MegadethFan View Post
    That makes no sense. To say what women do with their bodies is only their business IS a moral judgment.
    No it isn't since i am not judging others for doing things that don't concern me , think of it like gay sex : if it isn't in your ass then why care?


    Quote Originally Posted by MegadethFan View Post
    You clearly do not understand what is moral and what is not. You very much could discuss the morality of peeing sitting down, we've just judged that morally acceptable just as we have individual freedom. Morality should never be just "social values", though they do often bleed into ethical debates.
    Every time you pee living cells are leaving your body and die , not to mention living bacteria so potentially it has the same effect with an abortion.
    I belong to a bdsm society and we often have group sex , it is perfectly moral for us to do so yet we function inside a society that will not tolerate even a glimpse of this activity . You see morals are multilevel themselves and they scale differently depending on who and how many you deal with , if flexibility is analogous to the complexity and the size of the group(s) we deal with then down to a personal level they should be absolutely stiff so what a woman does with her body is none's business.

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