Russians fleeing their homeland .

Discussion in 'Russia & Eastern Europe' started by raymondo, Mar 16, 2012.

  1. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    Never has one man been so unsuited to the real needs of his people than Mister Vladimir Putrid .A man world renowned for understanding sod all about Economics and Foreign Policy
    The countries problems are many and severe -- fast contracting population , huge Heroin and Cocaine addiction levels , chronic levels of Alcoholism , TB and failing infrastructure with zero industrial opportunities outside business in Natural Resources -- even here infrastructure is often old and in disrepair .
    Ironically third world poverty levels amid corruption and violence are commonplace in this state , mistakenly seen as one of the BRIICK countries .imo
    To add to all of this , capital outflow continues at an unacceptably high level -- directly attributable to the way in which Russia attacked and invaded Georgia in 2008 and then later held Ukraine to ransom over Gas prices .Nobody trusts them .
    Frankly it is doubtful whether Russia should have been allowed to join the World Trade Organisation as its economy runs the risk of implosion if ways of reversing matters are not quickly found .
    Perhaps the most concerning feature of capital outflow is that it is Russians who have made money are the very ones who are transferring it outside and leaving .
    Almost a sense of Rats fleeing the sinking ship .

    See report from Russian Profile
    Russian Profile.org
    From article by Andrew Roth on March 15th
    The Topic also appears in the World News Section but as I only see Colonel Litwin there occasionally , I thought it worth repeating for your convenience .



    Russia’s Central Bank announced Wednesday that more than $9 billion in capital had fled Russia in February, and close to $13.5 billion left Russia in January, a considerable increase from a previous estimate of $11.5 billion. The numbers are some of Russia’s highest since the financial crisis of 2008, and if capital outflows of close to $10 billion per month hold, Russia could surpass last year’s total of $84.2 billion in capital flight.

    Moreover, the money leaving Russia is not being pulled by foreign investors retrieving their capital, which makes the trend “particularly worrisome,” said Trust National Bank Chief Economist Yevgeny Nadorshin. “The biggest problem is that these are not foreigners who are taking their money out of Russia. These are residents who are taking money they earned here and moving it abroad. That makes the situation particularly uncomfortable,” he added.


    It is argued that politics played an important but limited part in determining levels of capital flight. “In my opinion, capital outflow doesn’t depend that much on the man in power,” he said. Rhetoric about economic stability under a Putin administration would not have a strong effect on capital outflows, he continued. “Stability is probably not the most important word for the economy right now,” he said. “Stability is needed not in the general economic situation, but in terms of economic infrastructure. For proper economic development, you need the economic structure to be stable, institutions to be stable, and not the case like now, where the government proposes different taxes every year.”

    “My sense is that this capital outflow is a structural trend, so it has increased with political unrest and the European banking crisis over the last year, but it still remains close to ten billion dollars. I think this is reflecting the overall lack of investment opportunities in Russia,” said Natalia Orlova, the chief economist at Alfa Bank.

    Russian capital flight eclipses that of other BRIC countries. In 2011, China didn’t see any net capital outflows until the fourth quarter, and ultimately experienced $186.7 billion in capital inflows for the year. Meanwhile, India’s capital outflow was measured in the millions, and not billions, of dollars in 2011.

    Uncertainty remains a key issue for both foreign and domestic investors in Russia. Competition with international businesses and an uncertain regulation climate significantly sour the Russian investment climate. Meanwhile, the fact that households are increasing their investments in foreign real estate is also an “alarming” indicator that many Russians may be moving their financial assets and themselves abroad permanently, he added.
     
  2. Ostap Bender

    Ostap Bender Well-Known Member

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    Only extremely idiots can still stay in Russia, those who have even small brain move away from Putin's "Paradise". The country has no one chance to survive twelfth new years of Putin.
     
  3. Diuretic

    Diuretic Well-Known Member

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    Putin will be removed by those who hold the real power, as soon as his incompetence is a threat to their wellbeing. In the meantime though this new (Ras)Putin still has a hypnotic hold on sufficient numbers of people (along with ballot rigging) to remain in power and continue to do damage.

    The Russians could do worse than go back to a modernised form of Communism.
     
  4. Ostap Bender

    Ostap Bender Well-Known Member

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    Your post is too naive, almost all of those who possess the real power know that Putin is a wimp who lost almost everything except his private wealth. But he give all officials the possibility to steal, to kill, to rob, to make everything they want, therefore they will never tumble Putin. Their wellbeing is fine because their families and money are already in the Western countries.Also, Putin threats nothing, except probably mourned drunken people.
     
  5. Diuretic

    Diuretic Well-Known Member

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    Okay then, put it down to "I hope Putin falls on his arse".
     
  6. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    About a million to one shot .
    He centralised regional crime syndicates with his Family appointing their own bosses as Regional Governors .
    He has filled every Bank and resources Company with ex KGB and FSB cronies , and , as ex FSB number one , he has the loyalty of the State Security Forces .
    The Government is full also of ex KGB and FSB colleagues and people who came specially recommended . His inner circle is mainly made up of people who worked with him in St Petersburg in the first half of the nineties where billions were made , cementing working relationships for life .
    It is a near perfect example of vertical power .
    The only possible weakness is within the Military but there have been attempted uprisings which were smashed .
    Ostap reported it accurately .
    The system is constructed in relationships of interdependence .
    And if you try and break the rules like Litvinenko did , you will be hunted by the Family to the day they kill you .Have no illusions
    That is Russia as it really is .
     
  7. EvilAztec

    EvilAztec Banned

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    Another one logical nonsense of yours
    Like everything else that you have posted
     
  8. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    If you are part of the apparatus I can understand the difficult position this puts you in .You do not want to lose your job and be harassed , or even worse .
    The good news is that things will get better in your life time and at long last you will have a taste of real freedom .
     
  9. EvilAztec

    EvilAztec Banned

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    I do not lose my job anyway.
    Explain your statement "The system is constructed in relationships of interdependence ."
    What this means - relationships dependency of interdependencies
    with interdependence? Interesting behavior of interdependence feedback in this interdependences system?
     
  10. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    Russia is still the world's biggest country with the strongest military fire power. That's all that matters, and they know it. It is arrogant and equally machiavellistic to say that another round of mass starvation in Russia would matter more than it did in the 1920's.

    As per foreign policy, more East European nations are realizing now that Russia is the viable alternative to stand up against the divisive and exploitative policies of the EU.
     
  11. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    I admire your loyalty and may be that is what you are told .
    After Georgia exposed the weaknesses in the Russian army , General Makarov wrote a report, which is public , accepting that major work was required . Both Putin and Medvedev accepted the report .
    The main problem in actually starting to make huge changes was the Officer's revolt . This is the one group that don't lick Putin's boots and with 33% of them due for the chop , it is no wonder they were unhappy .
    Your conscript system is a joke and your President knows this .
    Why are you the only Russian who has no idea what is happening ?

    You obviously did not read the OP .
    Europe does not wish to invest in Russia . Period .
    Hardly anybody wants to take the risk . Russia is high risk and untrustworthy .
    Don't they tell you anything ?
     
  12. EvilAztec

    EvilAztec Banned

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    Another one strategist and a great expert on Russia :smile:
     
  13. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    Sorry to hear about the shortage of Dictionaries and Wikipedia in Russia .

    Let's give you a simple example of , Interdependence .
    You are being bribed by person X for help and/or favours, but you are also obliged to get his business , because , without it , your business will fail .
    That will upset other people whom you pay money to --like Government Officials , Crime syndicates or just old fashioned " Insurance" Companies .
    It means that you are joined at the Hip , as we say -- but in Russia ,it means joined at the pocket--- and there is nothing you can do about it without enormous troubles falling on you .
    And don't write and tell us that this is not how Russia works .You can see it in action within days of being there , and God help you if you want new premises or planning permission or anything involving Government officials . Bribery and Corruption is just the normal way of life . And nobody knows how to avoid it or stop it .
    Medvedev spent 4 years talking about it , so do not give us propaganda rubbish . Unfortunately Medvedev was not strong enough to make a difference
     
  14. EvilAztec

    EvilAztec Banned

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    Song about Mishiko Saakashvili

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JMdAwawVL0"]Песенка про Мишико Саакашвили - YouTube[/ame]
     
  15. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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  16. EvilAztec

    EvilAztec Banned

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    Putin did demonise Muslims and Chechens? I think you are lost in threads.
    There was no any need unites people against the Chechen rioters in 99. You can come to Chechnya and Chechens ask.
    I think so... Here you are, Ray is a very intelligent, why don't you come to Russia. You'll tell us your idea, your idea of ​​how to raise Russia from its knees.
    About the Odessa assassination play . If you think that here is all believed in this, you're wrong.
     
  17. EvilAztec

    EvilAztec Banned

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    Saakashvili's dreams and reality.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_0J3OE8MAo"]Саакашвили сны и явь. Мульт о войне - YouTube[/ame]
     
  18. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    Thank you. Finally someone sees my knowledge about Russia. :) :lol:
     
  19. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    Yes, there may be deficiencies in the Russian military, but it is nothing compared to the deficiencies of the US or European militaries. If there was another European war with Russia, then all European armies would just grind down again like it was in the past, always.

    This is not a secret, so for all those nations that the EU has shafted, Russia is a very good potential partner.
     
  20. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    My God , educational standards have dropped so badly in Russia in the last few years .
    We have talked about the Russian Military in other threads and we all know how devastatingly bad the present position is for the Red Army . So lets tip toe past that embarrassing subject .
    The two sides will never meet as clashing ground force armies . Those days have gone forever . The most that Russia will ever use Ground Troops for in the West , is picking fights against very small ex Soviet territories like the Baltic States or even Russia .
    If it ever came to taking on NATO , there would be carnage , as Russia would be annihilated .
    But such scenarios are for the History book .
    Now wars are fought through Destabilisation , with , or , without proxy .
    Plus the use of the Internet and specialised Cyber weapons .
     
  21. EvilAztec

    EvilAztec Banned

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    Rotha East-there was a volunteer company, which included elderly people from Chechnya .They are terrifying for Georgians is not less than the Russian young soldiers .
     
  22. EvilAztec

    EvilAztec Banned

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    Always and everywhere,without Russia-Georgia is full of crap.
     
  23. Darketernal

    Darketernal Member

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    Compared to the other garbage that was in power i think Putin is the least of them, under him the economy returned to much better conditions and albeit a lot has to be done more in Russia, well .. Russia is big, . humongous actually, for one person to rule entire Russia in a decent manner is too much to ask, especially if you seen what kind of devastation their predecessors left , namely a ruined economy, with 75% of the people abusing wodka losing russian brain mass by the minute and drugs leaving many incapable of doing any work, just leeching and wasting their life away that's all.

    By going into a (and this is important (non war direction)) this because military only costs money you don't earn money from it) innovative direction in which the Russians are superior, now everyone knows that Russia has the best physics scientists or at least had, and by creating innovating products that involve physic revolutions, that can be sold on the world market at competitive prices, Russia could re-invent its own identity and create an investing climate in its own country and put itself economically on the world map again, as well as creating programs to get people back to work, and free work anti addiction clinics, that would help people get rid of their addictions and back to work again to give them some hope of a future again. Also anti-corruption programs need to be put in place, and let the people understand that corruption is not normal, and its not healthy because it undermines and makes the society crumble as a whole.

    As well as a strong mathematical foundation on how cities and structures are designed in order to become a modern, and capable society , and hopefully also united with the rest of the world v.s the bad anti against everything and everyone policy they still have as a result of the cold war. They definitely need to step over that, and delegate Russia into important political area's, because one man simply cannot do everything, whether he is called putin or not.
     
  24. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    Maybe, but also what you are proposing is subjugating Russia under the financial power groups that have cornered the entire world now.
     
  25. Mr_Truth

    Mr_Truth Well-Known Member

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    Putin heads the United Russia party which calls itself conservative. Perhaps people are fleeing its capitalist failings. Dunno for sure but clearly it is not communism they are fleeing.
     

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