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Thread: Jihad in Islam — Muslim leaders define Jihad to suit…

  1. #1

    Default Jihad in Islam — Muslim leaders define Jihad to suit…

    “In the language of the Divine Law, this word (jihad) is used specifically for the war that is waged solely in the name of God against those who perpetrate oppression as enemies of Islam. This supreme sacrifice is the responsibility of all Muslims.” Sayyid Abul A’La Maududi, author of “Jihad in Islam” and “Towards Understanding Islam”.

    More controversial Muslim books for sale

    I have met two outspoken and profound Canadian Muslims, Tarek Fatah and Salim Mansur, who are denigrated by clerics and believers of Islam. They are likely considered apostates, non-believers or converts, for speaking and writing about reform and modernity. Often, I read their articles and comments in the Toronto Sun or other periodicals and online sites.

    There are many egregious incidents that have been perpetrated by Muslims and their jihad, which Muslim leaders and clerics define as more peaceful rather than holy war. War happens when they are attacked or feel oppressed.

    First Casualty of War: Truth – Tarek Fatah, Toronto Sun (to be linked)

    The following I read in Tarek Fatah's piece in the Saturday Sun:

    Syed Qutb, another Egyptian stalwart of the Islamist movement and the Muslim Brotherhood, in his book Milestones writes the following.

    "Any place where Islamic shariah is not enforced and where Islam is not dominant becomes the Home of Hostility (Dar-ul-harb)... A Muslim will remain prepared to fight against it., whether it be his birthplace or a place where his property or any other material interests are located."

    A prime example of spinning the truth is the horrible murders by jihadist Mohamed Merah of Toulouse, France. Jihadists are influenced at early ages, regardless where they come from or are born, because it is “written” and taught, continuously. It doesn’t matter if they are predators for a jihad – perhaps, it’s even better, that the young jihadists are lone wolves, since the Islamists, and Islamic organizations condemn them as insane or against Islam and the Koran. However, they are reluctant to condemn tribes and nations, such as Iran, that promote holy war, or nations that harbor jihadists, such as Pakistan.

    Pakistan must be held accountable – Salim Mansur

    "It should be obvious that travelling to Pakistan from Europe, or anywhere else, by a non-Pakistani requires arranging for a Pakistani visa.

    It is also obvious that young men like Merah required visas to head out for Pakistan, and for them to readily acquire visas means there is in place arrangements within some of the Pakistani consular offices abroad to assist foreign jihadis in their mission." Salim Mansur

    There are times I feel sad for progressive and educated Muslims, who have emigrated to democracies or were born in democratic nations, and truly desire peace and a better life. But, the medieval doctrine, the ideology of submission and jihad, is promulgated and proselytized. Converts, sometimes, can be worse.
    Last edited by Onward James; Mar 31 2012 at 08:26 AM.

  2. Question

    Military not in step with 'no war against Islam'...

    Why was the US military teaching 'total war' on Islam?
    10 May 2012 - Martin Dempsey has ordered an investigation into how the class was approved for teaching
    America's top military officer has condemned a course taught about Islam at one of America's top military schools as "totally objectionable". It is not surprising. The story, first broken by Wired, is fairly astonishing, and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Martin Dempsey, must be furious.

    The course taught officers there was no such thing as moderate Islam and that they should consider the religion their enemy. It advocated "total war" against all the world's Muslims, including possible nuclear attacks on the holy cities of Mecca and Medina and the wiping out civilian populations. The Pentagon has confirmed the course material found on their website is authentic.

    'Something weird'

    As far as I can see this is not intended in any sense as a rather sick academic exercise in stretching the bounds of what could be thought. It is actually what the officer teaching it believes. In other words: completely nutty stuff that would disgrace the wilder fringes of the blogosphere. So, not surprisingly, Gen Dempsey has ordered a full investigation into what other US military schools might be teaching about the religion. The voluntary course aimed at senior officers was taught at the Joint Forces Staff College in Norfolk, Virginia, for a year. It was stopped last month after one student complained.

    Gen Dempsey described the course as "counter to our values of appreciation for religious freedom and cultural awareness" and "just objectionable, academically irresponsible". It came to light when one of the officers on the course complained. There is now an investigation into how the course was approved and why it was part of the curriculum. A lieutenant colonel has been suspended from teaching, but for the moment keeps his job. The Pentagon hopes a full report will be out by the end of the month. What does seem rather surprising is that all those commanders, captains and colonels must have sat through the course and not felt the need to tell someone that something rather weird was going on.

    See also:

    Al Qaeda in Yemen has "whole outfit" devoted to attacking U.S.
    May 10th, 2012 - The Yemeni branch of al Qaeda now has "a whole outfit designated to target the U.S. homeland," according to a source closely working with U.S. intelligence agencies and the military.
    In addition, the U.S. now believes Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula (AQAP) is working on "several types of bombs" that could get past airport x-ray screening machines. The bomb technology is aimed at targeting the U.S., according to the source. Although the group has not yet succeeded in any of their bomb plots against the U.S., there are several bomb makers and a group of would-be suicide bombers inside the group, which operates out of rudimentary training camps in southern Yemen.

    "What I think is concerning to myself and other people is that it seems the talent of the organization is getting better, that is, they are much more capable of carrying out attacks. So when something fails like the Christmas Day plot in 2009 or again the cartridge plot in 2010, the organization is able to adapt, and the next time they come back, they present a better and more lethal threat. I think that's what has a lot of people in U.S. and Saudi intelligence quite concerned," says analyst Gregory Johnsen, a Near East Studies scholar.

    CNN has previously reported that AQAP master bomb maker Ibrahim al-Asiri has been involved in training both bombmakers and suicide bombers. The source added that al-Asiri is now not making all the components himself. This gives the group the extra security and advantage of having multiple manufacturing capability if al Asiri were to be killed. The source also confirmed that the latest device - turned over to the U.S. by a mole - had no metallic parts and an advanced detonation system to improve the chance the detonator would result in the entire bomb exploding. AQAP bomb designs are aimed at hiding explosives in clothing, camera lenses and animals according to the source.

    But it is also the fundamental growth in AQAP's ability to control territory that is making them increasingly thought to target since the 2009 incident. "AQAP at that time was about two to three hundred members and it controlled no territory in Yemen. Now, two and a half years later, the terror group has more than tripled in strength to over a thousand members and it controls a great amount of territory in southern Yemen," Johnsen said in an interview with CNN. He said the group controls towns, is running its own police department, and in certain places has established court systems. "It’s providing services – electricity and water to some of the citizens, and really it sees itself in parts of southern Yemen as a government," Johnsen said.

    Last edited by waltky; May 11 2012 at 12:33 AM.

  3. Icon17

    Granny says, "Dat's right - dat's Billy Graham's boy, Franklin - better lissen to him...

    Rev. Graham: Islam Is Not Compatible With American Values
    December 16, 2015 | Noting how Islamic law, sharia, contrasts with the U.S. Constitution and how women are treated under sharia, Rev. Franklin Graham said he did not believe that Islam is compatible with American values, and added that all immigration should halt “until we have a proper system to vet people.”
    On CNN’s Newsroom on Dec. 15, host Carol Costello asked Rev. Graham, “Is Islam compatible with American values?” Reverend Graham, son of world-renowned evangelist Billy Graham, said, “I don’t think so.” When Costello remarked that Muslims claim such “rhetoric” is “hurting them,” Graham responded, “Well, you asked me a question and I answered you. But I don’t go out and preach against Islam. I don’t go out and preach against Muslims. I don’t. And I certainly welcome them.” “But our Constitution certainly, the way we treat women, the way we treat all people – Islam doesn’t do that under sharia law,” he said.

    Costello then claimed one could say the same about “Catholicism,” and moved on to ask about Donald Trump’s proposal to monitor radical mosques in the United States. “Let me play Devil’s advocate just a little longer,” said Costello. “Donald Trump thinks that some mosques should be shut down. Do you agree with that?” Rev. Graham said, “Well, I don’t know, I haven’t heard what Donald Trump has said. I know that in France they have certainly shut down some mosques that were preaching hatred and violence against the people in France, so the French government has shut down some mosques. I don’t know how many it is, but I know they have done it there.”

    Costello then asked, “Does that mean we should do it here?” The reverend answered, “We might have to at some point. I don’t know. We need – our country’s broken right now, our borders are broken. We need to get it fixed. We need to get immigration fixed. We need to know who’s coming in to this country.” “We can’t just open up our arms and just say ‘everybody come,’ because there’s people out there that want to destroy our nation, and want to destroy you and our way of life,” said Rev. Graham. “We have a responsibility, our government, the president, our Congress has a responsibility to protect all Americans.”

    See also:

    Graham to Muslims: ‘Your Religion Is Not the Enemy’
    December 16, 2015 | At the GOP undercard presidential debate in Las Vegas on Tuesday, Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) addressed American Muslims, saying they are not the enemy and neither is their religion.
    “There are at least 3,500 American Muslims serving in the armed forces. Thank you for your service. You are not the enemy. Your religion is not the enemy,” said Graham. “Let me make this real to you. I was at the second presidential election in Afghanistan. The guy guarding me was an American Muslim sergeant in the Army who grew up in Kabul, left when he was -- graduated high school, joined the U.S. Army, went back to his high school where they were doing polling, people voting, he took me there and cried like a baby. I cried like a baby,” Graham said. “He is the solution to this problem, folks. He is not the problem. Leave the faith alone. Go after the radicals that kill us all,” Graham added.

    Earlier during the debate, Graham addressed GOP presidential candidate Donald Trump’s proposed temporary ban on Muslims entering the United States and those who support his comments, saying, “You may think this makes us safe, but it doesn't.” “The good news for everybody in this room is, after 36 trips to Iraq and Afghanistan, most people over there, Wolf, are not buying what ISIL's selling. This is a religious war between radical Islam and the rest of the world, and there's only one way you're going to win this war: help people in Islam who reject radical Islam to fight over there and destroy this ideology.

    “Donald Trump has done the one single thing you cannot do: declare war on Islam itself. ISIL would be dancing in the streets, they just don’t believe in dancing,” he said. “This is a coup for them, and to all of our Muslim friends throughout the world, like the king of Jordan and the president of Egypt, I am sorry. He does not represent us. “If I am president, we will work together. People in the faith to all over the world destroy this radical ideology. Declaring war on the religion only helps ISIL,” added Graham.


  4. Icon17

    Granny says, "Dat's right" - dat's why she keeps her Mossburg 12ga. locked an' loaded w/ rocksalt...

    'Front Line With ISIS Isn't Just in Iraq and Syria, It's in Kennedy Airport and the Rio Grande'
    December 16, 2015 | Tangling with rival Marco Rubio on immigration, Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Texas) said he stood for amnesty at the same time Rubio joined Democrats Barack Obama and Sen. Chuck Schumer in supporting a "massive amnesty plan."
    Cruz framed his immigration plan as a matter of national security: "And let me mention, this issue is actually directly connected to what we've been talking about (national security)," Cruz said at the CNN-hosted debate Tuesday night. "Because the front line with ISIS isn't just in Iraq and Syria, it's in Kennedy Airport and the Rio Grande. Border security is national security. "And, you know, one of the most troubling aspects of the Rubio-Schumer Gang of Eight Bill was that it gave President Obama blanket authority to admit refugees, including Syrian refugees without mandating any background checks whatsoever. Now we've seen what happened in San Bernardino. (To be clear, the gang of eight bill never passed.) "When you are letting people in, when the FBI can't vet them, it puts American citizens at risk," Cruz said. He promised to secure the border and "triple the border patrol." "We will build a wall that works, and I'll get Donald Trump to pay for it," Cruz joked. (The two were chummy on the stage.)

    In response, Rubio said there was no massive Syrian refugee crisis in 2013 like there is now. "Up until that point, a refugee meant someone fleeing oppression, fleeing Communism like it is in my (Cuba) community," Rubio said. "As far as Ted's record, I'm always puzzled by his attack on this issue. Ted, you support legalizing people who are in this country illegally. Ted Cruz supported a 500-percent increase in the number of H-1 visas, the guest workers that are allowed into this country, and Ted supports doubling the number of green cards. "So I think what's important for us to understand, and there is a way forward on this issue that we an bring our country together on...And it will begin by bringing illegal immigration under control."

    Cruz, in return, accused Rubio of trying to "raise confusion." "It is not accurate what he just said, that I supported legalization. Indeed, I led the fight against his legalization and amnesty. And you know, there was one commentator that put it this way that, for Marco to suggest our record's the same is like suggesting 'the fireman and the arsonist because they are both at the scene of the fire.' "He was fighting to grant amnesty and not to secure the border, I was fighting to secure the border..."

    Rubio asked Cruz if he would "rule out ever legalizing people that are in this country now?" "I have never supported legalization, and I do not intend to support legalization," Cruz responded. "What you do is you enforce the law." He directed people to the 11-page immigration plan on his website. "You enforce the law," Cruz repeated. "That means you stop the Obama administration's policy of releasing criminal illegal aliens. Do you know how many aliens Bill Clinton deported? 12 million. Do you know how many illegal aliens, George W. Bush deported? 10 million. "We can enforce the laws and if we secure the border, that solves the problem."

    See also:

    ‘Not All Muslims Are Jihadists’ But ‘All Jihadists Are Muslims’
    December 16, 2015 | In response to a question about Donald Trump’s proposal to halt the immigration of Muslims into America until they can be securely vetted, presidential contender Rick Santorum said it was a “legitimate issue,” and stressed that “not all Muslims are jihadists” but “all jihadists are Muslims.”
    At the GOP undercard debate on Tuesday in Las Vegas, moderator Wolf Blitzer asked former Senator Santorum, “you object to Mr. Trump's proposals on the grounds that it's unworkable. You've made religious liberty a hallmark of your career. Do you believe in religious liberty for Muslims as well as Christians?”

    Santorum said, “Of course I do. But what Donald Trump was saying was nothing against Muslims. His comment was against this administration who doesn't have a policy to properly vet people coming into this country.” “Let's just be honest about what's being talked about here,” said Santorum. “And I know people will pile on because it makes sense to pile on, maybe from the polls. But he [Trump] brings up a legitimate issue.”

    Santorum continued, “The fact of the matter is not all Muslims are Jihadists and no one, including I suspect, Donald Trump, would say that. But the reality is, all Jihadists are Muslims.” “That's a reality,” said Santorum. “And we have to stop worrying about offending some people and start defending all Americans. Because we're not, right now.”

    The GOP undercard debate was held among four candidates who have not scored high enough in the polls to merit a place with the other candidates. The undercard contenders included Santorum, former Gov. George Pataki, Gov. Bobby Jindal and Sen. Lindsey Graham.


  5. Icon15

    Granny says, "Dat's right, you tell `em Rev - if dey did worship the same God, dey'd call him Jehovah too...

    ‘Islam and Christianity Clearly Do Not Worship the Same God’
    January 27, 2016 | In reaction to a political science teacher at evangelical Wheaton College who decided to wear the hijab in solidarity with Muslims and suggested that, “Christians and Muslims worship the same God,” Rev. Franklin Graham said this “is no minor issue that should be debated,” because “Islam and Christianity clearly do not worship the same God.”
    The issue with associate professor Larycia Alaine Hawkins has become heated at Wheaton College because after her remarks, made on Facebook, became known, the college took steps to have her terminated from her job. However, members of the Faculty Council are pushing back and want the college to reverse its decision. Wheaton College, in Wheaton, Illinois, is a Christian liberal arts college “in the evangelical Protestant tradition” that strives to prepare its students “for a livelihood and a life dedicated to serving Christ and his Kingdom.”

    Pastor Billy Graham and his late wife, Ruth Bell Graham, are graduates of Wheaton College. “Both my father Billy Graham and my mother attended Wheaton College in Illinois -- in fact that's where they met,” said Rev. Franklin Graham in a post on Facebook. “I'm surprised and disappointed that the faculty council there is now recommending the college drop their plans to terminate a professor who published that she believed Islam and Christianity worship the same God in December.” “This is no minor issue that should be debated,” said Rev. Graham. “Islam denies that God has a Son. They deny that Jesus is God. They do not believe in a Triune God–the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.” “I can tell you -- Islam and Christianity clearly do not worship the same God,” said the reverend. “How the faculty council can now support this professor being allowed to teach students is deeply concerning.”

    Franklin Graham, 63, is the son of world-renowned preacher Billy Graham. He is married and has five children, and he oversees the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association and the international Christian relief group Samaritan’s Purse.


  6. Icon16

    Islam not welcome in Germany & France...

    Islam Under Fire in Europe’s Two Biggest Nations
    May 2, 2016 – A right-wing party in Germany that made gains in recent state elections has adopted a party manifesto declaring that “Islam is not part of Germany.”
    The policy embraced Sunday by thousands of members of the populist Alternative for Germany (AfD) party meeting in Stuttgart also called for a ban on the Islamic public call to prayer, minarets, and the wearing of headscarves in public schools. “Islam is not part of Germany” is a direct response to an assertion by German Chancellor Angela Merkel, voiced on various occasions including in a speech last January amid a series of anti-Islamization protests, that “Islam is part of Germany.” The development comes as a new opinion poll finds that large pluralities of respondents in both France (47 percent) and Germany (43 percent) view Islam as a threat – an increase of five and three percent respectively since 2010.

    The survey (in French), conducted by the IFOP polling company for the French daily Le Figaro, also found that 63 percent of respondents in France and 48 percent in Germany regard Islam as too visible and too influential in their societies. Fifty-two percent of French and 49 percent of Germans respondents said they opposed the building of mosques, and opposition to the wearing of headscarves in public schools was measured at 88 percent in France and 75 percent in Germany. (Headscarves and other religious garb have been banned in French public schools and government offices since 2004.)

    Another finding in the poll: 67 percent of French and 60 percent of German respondents blamed a perceived failure by Muslims to integrate into society on a refusal to adapt to local customs and values. France and Germany have the largest Muslim populations in the European Union – 4.8 million in Germany comprising 5.8 percent of the total population, and 4.7 million in France, or 7.5 percent of the population, according to the Pew Research Center.


  7. #7


    Quote Originally Posted by waltky View Post
    Granny says, "Dat's right, you tell `em Rev - if dey did worship the same God, dey'd call him Jehovah too...

    ‘Islam and Christianity Clearly Do Not Worship the Same God’
    January 27, 2016 | In reaction to a political science teacher at evangelical Wheaton College who decided to wear the hijab in solidarity with Muslims and suggested that, “Christians and Muslims worship the same God,” Rev. Franklin Graham said this “is no minor issue that should be debated,” because “Islam and Christianity clearly do not worship the same God.”
    Sounds to me like Franklin Graham is an anti-Semite.

  8. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Margot2 View Post
    Sounds to me like Franklin Graham is an anti-Semite.
    How so? What makes him anti Semite?
    Scripture, science, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue.

    The same people you lock your doors to are the same people gun carriers carry.

    When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

    "If guns are the cause of crimes then aren't matches the cause of arson?" Don Boys

    "Why do you trust the government with machine guns but not honest citizens?" Don Boys

  9. Icon17

    Granny says, "Dat's right - don't sugar-coat it - call it what it is...

    'Why Is It So Hard' For Obama 'To Call Islamic Terrorism What It Is?'
    September 20, 2016 | Commenting on the radical Islamic terror attacks in Minnesota, New York City, and New Jersey, Reverend Franklin Graham asked, "Why is it so hard for our president and his administration to call Islamic terrorism what it is?"
    President Obama did not make a statement about the weekend attacks until Monday. In his remarks, Obama described the Saturday incident at a shopping mall in St. Cloud, Minn., where eight people were stabbed by a Somali-American yelling "Allahu akbar!" as a "potential act of terrorism." (ISIS has claimed credit for the attack.) As for the bombs in New York City and New Jersey, Obama described them as "explosions," not terrorism. "Why is it so hard for our president and his administration to call Islamic terrorism what it is?" said Rev. Graham in a Sept. 20 post on Facebook. "He identified the stabbing spree of a Somali man who yelled 'Allahu Akbar' as he injured eight people in a shopping mall just a 'potential act of terrorism.'" "Potential? The Islamic State already proudly claimed credit -- how much more 'potential' do you need?" said Rev. Graham.

    Obama "didn't call the New York and New Jersey bombings terrorism, just calling these deliberate attacks 'explosions,'" said Rev. Graham. "And yesterday his staffer, White House Press Secretary Josh Earnest described the terror threat as a 'narrative threat.'" "Tell that to the families of the over 5,000 U.S. service men and women who lost their lives fighting terror since 9/11," said the Christian evangelist. "And tell it to the victims of terror who suffer every day after having been shot, stabbed, burned horribly, or lost limbs." "My prayer is that the next president of the United States will not be ashamed to say the truth and identify Islamic terrorists for what they are," said Rev. Graham.

    Franklin Graham, 64, is the son of world-renowned pastor Billy Graham. Franklin Graham runs the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association (BGEA) and the international Chriistian relief group Samaritan's Purse. He is married, has five children, and lives in Boone, N.C. Franklin Graham regularly preaches in the United States and abroad, and frequently comments on current affairs on television and radio.


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