Holy Bible Scriptures: Hard to understand or easy to understand?

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by 4Horsemen, Jul 25, 2012.

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Why are Biblical scripture treated as a vague text?

  1. Because it is what it is

    2 vote(s)
    10.0%
  2. Because people are comfortable making their own interpretations of scripture.

    8 vote(s)
    40.0%
  3. Because the Bible is a fairytale and fairytales are meant to be vague

    3 vote(s)
    15.0%
  4. Because it's the Bible and the truth must stay hidden

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. No vote but I will comment instead

    7 vote(s)
    35.0%
  1. 4Horsemen

    4Horsemen Banned

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    Why do people, in general, claim that Biblblical scripture is hard to understand and so vague that you have to put your own interpretation on it? When that couldn't be further from the truth?
     
  2. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    I say Because it is what it is, and by that, I mean each book of the Bible is a straightforward ancient text full of concepts often far removed from modern thinking, such as the flat earth, solid dome sky and the various characters such as Samson (Hercules?), King David (who had a Perseus moment), the talking serpent (who lost his legs in the garden as a kind of fairytale explanation for snakes not having legs - this stuff is truly on a par with Grimm's fairy tales), the Adversary (Satan) and then the various new testament characters and events. When people today try to interpret these ancient writings, they have a couple of different approaches available to them: An historical approach, using all available data from the times and places these texts were fashioned as a means for understanding in some detail what they're claiming, and a religious approach, which unfortunately seems to involve simply ignoring all of that devil-inspired historical data and finding any way the imagination can muster of avoiding the obvious meanings of these texts in favor of something that can still be true today, which of course means treating a bunch of it as "metaphorical" in meaning and otherwise misinterpreting many parts of it, especially when trying to reconcile the New Testament with the Old. It is only in the religious approach to the texts that the notions of their being "vague" and requiring interpretation (for you by the Holy Spirit, you sinner!) come into play; the texts are quite clear when taken at face value and coupled with the requisite background historical information.
     
  3. Wolverine

    Wolverine New Member Past Donor

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    It is hard to understand a work as infallible truth when that same work contradicts itself numerous times.
     
    Durandal and (deleted member) like this.
  4. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    Here's a good passage to analyze:

    Mark 6:31-33 (NKJV) = And He said to them, “Come aside by yourselves to a deserted place and rest a while.” For there were many coming and going, and they did not even have time to eat. So they departed to a deserted place in the boat by themselves. But the multitudes saw them departing, and many knew Him and ran there on foot from all the cities. They arrived before them and came together to Him.

    Now think about that for a second. Jesus and his pals got into a boat of some sort to go to a deserted place on the lake shore. The busybodies saw them leave and knew exactly where they were going. So the thousands of busybodies took off like Olympic long distance runners over the rocky hills and arrived at the deserted place before the boat.

    Is that a tall tale or what? It sure was a slow boat.

    http://fineartamerica.com/featured/the-sea-of-galilee-judy-shoemaker.html

    http://www.holylandphotos.org/browse.asp?s=1,2,5,14,49
     
  5. MisLed

    MisLed New Member

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    I used to think the bible was vague and i didn't understand it at all. It sounded like a bunch of nonsensically put together thees and thous and wherefores. I wasn't ready for it and i wasn't really all that interested in understanding.
    My lifestyle was in contrast to what it said.

    Then one day i was ready for the change. I wanted to read. All of a sudden it made sense. I think one needs to have that change of heart and not only be ready to read the bible but to actually hear what you read. It's been wonderful.
     
  6. 4Horsemen

    4Horsemen Banned

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    Great Point!

    Your mind has to be in "that place" to realy understand it, but when you do, it's not vague at all.
     
  7. MisLed

    MisLed New Member

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    It's like it speaks TO you.

    Plus, if something puzzles me of which i read or i am not quite sure of what to make of it....Not interpretation. There is no mulitiple interpretations. The only way for that to happen is if you
    DON"T like what it says. Man in those instances INTERPRETS to fit his own law. Anyway, back to my point...if something puzzles me, I write it down on a piece of paper and well within 48 hours the answer pops up. Sometimes with research and sometimes not.

    It's too bad that many young people (and old) are so intent on following their own way of living that they can't clear the noise to hear what the bible says about living their lives.

    I'm not saying i'm perfect. Far from it. I have my regrets. And i'm not always a good christian as many here will testify too. :wink: but my conscience bothers me when i don't do right.
     
  8. MAYTAG

    MAYTAG Active Member

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    I doubt that you and MisLed could make it one page discussing specific concepts from the Bible without finding a place where you disagree. And then you will have the answer to your question.
     
  9. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    Now put on your thinking cap and read the rest of the Bible..
     
  10. Sean Michael

    Sean Michael New Member

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    For one I would like to know why 4horsemen did not respond to wolverine's post.

    The second thing is if the bible is so straight forward as most Protestants claim, how come they do not agree on much of the meaning.

    Is baptism neccessary some say no, some say yes.
    Is infant baptism neccessary some say no, some say yes.
    Is there a need for Holy Communion some say no, some say yes.
    In the Holy Communion is Jesus really present, some say no some say yes.
    Can we lose salvation some say, no some say yes.
    Does salvation come from faith alone some say no, some say yes.
    Is our salvation continuous some say no, some say yes, etc, etc.

    So tell me your opinion on some of these subjects. I know whatever your opinion is there is some other Protestant who also says the Bible is easy to interpret and will have a different opinion from you.
     
  11. Wolverine

    Wolverine New Member Past Donor

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    I wouldn't be surprised if I am on his ignore list. I call his (*)(*)(*)(*) poor arguments in what seems to be every thread he makes.
     
  12. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    What is the most important idea that you got from the Bible that you had been unable to get from any other source?
     
  13. BFSmith@764

    BFSmith@764 Banned

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    The reason why they say that is because they put their own personal interpretations in the scriptures and when their interpretations contradicts the others scriptures they have to put their own interpretations on those as well so, that it does not seem to contradicts there previous interpretations. Most so-called Christians/Churches do not study the Bible to learn but to look for scriptures that seem to support what they already believed.
     
  14. BFSmith@764

    BFSmith@764 Banned

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    The thing is also that the Bible was not meant for the unconverted to understand. It is only when God begins to work with the individual's mind that they become receptive and begins to understand some of the things they had a problem with in the Bible. But it does not mean that they will understand everything all at once.....spiritual growth and understanding takes time.
     
  15. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    It takes time before people become completely insane.
     
  16. BFSmith@764

    BFSmith@764 Banned

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    Which person who has God working with their mind would refuse to get baptized, which is symbolic of dying and coming up a new creation? So it’s not if it is necessary or not. The New Covenant is less about being told to do this or that or else but more about being lead by the Spirit of God. It was never God's intention to dictate every step man's takes but that man should automatically know what is the right thing to do without having to be told.....God wants man to be like Him.

    There is no example in the Bible of infants being baptized…..what would an infant know about repentance?

    Again, about a desire to do what is right that the New Covenant is about. Communion as really about showing outward what one would be doing inward all the time. The partaking of the bread and wine is symbolic of partaking of Jesus daily. But one can partake of the Communion and still not be partaking of Jesus.....God see the heart (mind) and is not fooled by meaningless rituals.


    The question is who it is that have partaken of what God has given them and understood it would want to throw it all away? There is nothing that I could achieve in this life that would even be measurable in comparison to the glory that lies before me when I am given a new and glorified body, and all that will come with being a king in God's kingdom.

    Salvation is by grace through faith. For example, all human beings whether they are a Christians or not are saved because of Jesus' sacrifice but not all have accepted that sacrifice by faith. And as long as one continues to live by faith and do what Jesus says they have nothing to fear.

    All my response are supported in the Bible and not my opinion.
     
  17. BFSmith@764

    BFSmith@764 Banned

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    And when the fox was unable to get the juicy grapes it comfort itself by saying the grapes were sour anyway.
     
  18. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    Have you baptized all of your dead relatives? Better get busy if you haven't.
     
  19. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    --+
    Be nice to the zombies when they visit you. They're sure to be thirsty and hungry. You might want to stock up on some wine and food. Thet might get cranky if you aren't nice.
     
  20. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    According to Mark 16:16 a person has to jump into the water.

    Mark 16:16 (CEB) = Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever doesn’t believe will be condemned.
     
  21. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    Standing firm works.

    Mark 13:13 (CEB) = Everyone will hate you because of my name. But whoever stands firm until the end will be saved.
     
  22. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    If you have faith you're saved, unless you're a demon.

    Luke 7:50 (CEV) = But Jesus told the woman, “Because of your faith, you are now saved. May God give you peace!”

    James 2:19 (CEB) = It’s good that you believe that God is one. Ha! Even the demons believe this, and they tremble with fear.

    It's not what you do but who you know:

    Luke 19:9 (CEV) = Jesus said to Zacchaeus, “Today you and your family have been saved, because you are a true son of Abraham."

    Sucking up always works.

    Luke 21:19 (CEV) = You will be saved by being faithful to me.

    Don't forget Jesus' name. You can use it as Plan B.

    Acts 2:21 (NKJV) = And it shall come to pass That whoever calls on the name of the LORD Shall be saved.’

    Your daddy can save you. Let him do all of the work.

    Acts 16:31 (CEB) = They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved—you and your entire household.”

    If you're Jewish Paul used his connections to save you. So don't worry about it.

    Romans 10:1 (CEV) = Dear friends, my greatest wish and my prayer to God is for the people of Israel to be saved.

    Believing in the magic zombie might appeal to some.

    Romans 10:9 (NKJV) = that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

    Aw heck. Just yell "Jesus"!

    Romans 10:13 (CEB) = All who call on the Lord’s name will be saved.

    Quick, become a Jew and move to Israel. Once you get there you're good to go.

    Romans 11:26 (CEB) = In this way, all Israel will be saved, as it is written: The deliverer will come from Zion. He will remove ungodly behavior from Jacob.

    If you hang out with Satan it'll save your soul.

    1 Corinthians 5:5 (CEB) = At that time we need to hand this man over to Satan to destroy his human weakness so that his spirit might be saved on the day of the Lord.

    How's your sense of smell?

    2 Corinthians 2:16 (CEB) = We smell like a contagious dead person to those who are dying, but we smell like the fountain of life to those who are being saved. Who is qualified for this kind of ministry?
     
  23. BFSmith@764

    BFSmith@764 Banned

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    What in the world are you talking about? Do you think I'm Catholic or believe in the nonsense they teach?
     
  24. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    Heh, what was that you were saying about people putting their own personal interpretations in the scriptures? :D

    You mean that mental conditioning takes time. That's what "spiritual growth" is, at least in this context. The Bible is not hard to understand if you do not interpret it in a "spiritual" or otherwise biased fashion. It makes perfect sense when you look at it the same way you would look at any other ancient scripture, religious or otherwise. What you really need to understand it is knowledge of its historical context.
     
  25. BFSmith@764

    BFSmith@764 Banned

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    Who wrote the scriptures and who was it directed to? Can you answer that question?
     

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