Late-term Abortions and the REAL reasons they are performed

Discussion in 'Abortion' started by Anders Hoveland, Sep 17, 2012.

  1. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

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    One of the biggest lies coming from overly zealous supporters of abortion is that late-term abortions are only performed because of some physical defect with the fetus, or because of the woman's health. While there certainly are instances where this is indeed the case, these situations are actually very rare, and certainly not representative of the vast majority of late-term abortions.

    Over 18,000 elective late-term abortions are performed in the USA every year. This number only includes fetuses at least 19 weeks old.

    The vast majority of late-term abortions occur not because of any health problems, but because of delay in diagnosis of pregnancy.
    source: Cassing Hammond, “Recent Advances in Second Trimester Abortion: An Evidenced-based Review” American Journal of Obstetrics and Gynecology, 200 (April 2009): 347–356.


    For the actual reasons that late-term abortions are carried out, the most detailed information currently available is a very old 1988 Guttmacher survey of abortions taking place after 16 weeks, which listed these reasons for why an abortion was happening late in the gestational cycle:

    71% -- Woman didn't recognize she was pregnant or misjudged gestation

    48% -- Woman found it hard to make arrangements for abortion

    33% -- Woman was afraid to tell her partner or parents

    24% -- Woman took time to decide to have an abortion

    8% -- Woman waited for her relationship to change

    8% -- Someone pressured woman not to have abortion

    6% -- Something changed after woman became pregnant

    6% -- Woman didn't know timing is important

    5% -- Woman didn't know she could get an abortion

    2% -- A fetal problem was diagnosed late in pregnancy

    11% -- Other



    Here is the baby at 16 weeks:
    [​IMG]

    Remember that not all of those fetuses aborted in this survey were 16 weeks, many of them were older. Here is a picture of a fetus aborted in China, at the age of only 19 weeks:
    http://www.drabruzzi.com/images/fetus_aborted_at_19_weeks_2.gif

    This baby was prematurely born at 21 weeks, and actually survived (which is admittingly rare at such an early age) :
    [​IMG]



    Ron Fitzsimmons, executive director of the National Coalition of Abortion Providers, shocked the general public in 1997 when he admitted that the vast majority of partial-birth abortions were performed on healthy mothers and babies.


    For more information about why most late term abortions are performed:
    http://www.lifenews.com/2012/08/10/most-late-term-abortions-are-not-done-for-medical-reasons/


    The Mother's Health and Fetal Defects

    It sometimes claimed that serious health problems with the mother often necessitate abortions. Intentional abortion for maternal health, particularly after viability, is one of the great deceptions used to justify all abortion. The very fact that the baby of an ill mother is viable raises the question of why, indeed, it is necessary to perform an abortion to end the pregnancy. With any serious maternal health problem, termination of pregnancy can be accomplished by inducing labor or performing a caesarean section, saving both mother and baby. If a mother needs radiation or chemotherapy for cancer, the mother’s treatment can be postponed until viability, or regimens can be selected that will be better tolerated by the unborn baby. In modern neonatal intensive care units, 90 percent of babies at 28 weeks survive, as do a significant percentage of those at earlier gestations.

    T. Murphy Goodwin, M.D., a distinguished professor of maternal-fetal medicine at the University of Southern California, has written describing how women are told they need abortions for their own health when this is patently untrue. A major reason for unnecessary abortion referrals is ignorance, to put it bluntly, especially on the part of physicians in medical specialties inexperienced in treating women with high-risk pregnancies. According to Goodwin, there are only three very rare conditions that result in a maternal mortality greater than 20 percent in the setting of late pregnancy — these medical conditions are Marfan’s syndrome with aortic root involvement, complicated coarctation of the aorta, and possibly peripartum cardiomyopathy with residual dysfunction. Even in these three situations, there is the option to wait for fetal viability if the mother chooses to accept some increased risk.
    T. Murphy Goodwin. “Medicalizing Abortion Decisions.” First Things, 61 (March 1996): 33–36.

    Goodwin presents several cases in which pregnant women with cardiac conditions, cancer, or severe renal and autoimmune disease have been told plainly that they "needed" an abortion for their health or to save their life, despite being given incomplete information and not offered any other alternatives besides abortion.

    While severe fetal problems are an appropriate reason for considering an abortion, ultrasound imaging is not always accurate for a few of these conditions. Pregnant women who have declined abortion for fetuses diagnosed by ultrasound with fatal birth defects such as Potter’s syndrome (kidney disease with no amniotic fluid) or thanatophoric dwarfism (a fatal form of skeletal disease), have sometimes ended up giving birth to normal babies. Other parents have resisted recommended abortions for serious anatomical problems such as prune belly syndrome, omphalocele, congenital absence of the diaphragm, and other severe birth defects and had their babies undergo surgical repair after birth. C. Everett Koop, M.D., the former surgeon general and renowned pediatric surgeon, was asked during the partial-birth abortion hearings if he had treated children "born with organs outside of their bodies" (omphalocele). Dr. Koop replied, "Oh, yes indeed. I’ve done that many times. The prognosis usually is good. … The first child I ever did, with a huge omphalocele much bigger than her head, went on to develop well and become the head nurse in my intensive care unit many years later."
     
  2. Pasithea

    Pasithea Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    omg Anders. Late term abortions are performed in the third trimester of pregnancy. That is what is considered late term.

    We are all well aware that there are some abortions that occur in the second trimester. The overwhelming majority however is during the first at a whopping 88%, which is within the first 12 weeks. According to Guttmacher about 10.4% happen within the second trimester which is between weeks 13-20. Anything after 21 weeks it seems they consider late term abortion which is at 1.5%.

    IB-induced-abortion-c2.gif

    http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_induced_abortion.html/

    Also abortion rates have been declining except among poor women where they have been increasing. http://www.guttmacher.org/media/nr/2011/05/23/ab.html

    That should be a sure sign of who needs the most help when it comes to giving birth to and raising a child. How are you going to help these women in need Anders? Or are you just going to expect them to give birth and live with their child in poverty with no aid from anyone? Because how could I forget, once it's born pro-lifers generally do not care about the child, they just like to ensure that a woman pays for the crime of having consensual sex!
     
  3. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

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    "I witnessed babies being born alive and left to die"

    [video=youtube;NVNjrATbA20]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVNjrATbA20&feature=related[/video]
     
  4. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

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    Baby moving around in the womb at 19 weeks, mother can feel him kicking:

    [video=youtube;svuracXqplk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svuracXqplk&feature=related[/video]

    Just imagine how mommy would feel if her baby was ... aborted. :chainsaw:
    And yet abortionists say its okay to abort if mommy doesn't want her perfectly normal healthy baby.
     
  5. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    And 19 weeks is far beyond the 16 weeks your research was discussing.

    It is uncommon for abortions to occur at 19 weeks but even at 19 weeks that is NOT a "LATE TERM ABORTION"

    I am well aware of the Pro-life attempts to embed the idea that all abortions are late term and are therefore killing babies. It is a psychological ploy to try and get around the fact that the vast majority of abortions occur within the first few weeks, and as we have developed things like "medical" abortions then that statistic is increasing

    The research from Guttmacher itself is old - and predates a lot of medical social and legal advances which have impacted on abortion
     
  6. churchmouse

    churchmouse New Member

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    The fact is the pro-abort crowd here...supports late term abortion...through nine months. Their position never wavers....the woman has the power of life and death. They don't care.....if its human...if its viable. Those are non-issues to them Anders.

    It should not matter the commonalities...different scenarios....abortion in all circumstances....is moral its ok for this crowd. They celebrate it, honor it, embrace it....this speaks to who these people really are.
     
  7. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    As I said - concerted effort to embed the idea that abortion = late term

    Pity anyone with even half a brain can see through it
     
  8. Sadanie

    Sadanie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That is the most revolting, disgusting video I have ever seen. . .because it is a DIRECT LIE that shows a FULL TERM (in fact, probably a 0ne to two weeks FULL TERM, HEALTHY baby and tries to pull on people heart string to make them believe that it is such children who are being "left to die!"

    Only complete hypocrites or complete ********s would look at the babies presented in this video and believe they are ABORTED fetus!

    IF you are so sure of your case, why don't you show a video with REAL late term aborted fetus. . .those who are totally deformed, those who can't breathe, those who weigh less than 1lb 1/2 and have NO CHANCE to survive. . . NO, you prefer to show "the Gerber baby," in order to manipulate the weak minds!

    Even the witness, the nurse stated that those babies only survive SOMETIME as long as a few minutes, to a maximum of 8 hours! So, although I believe an aborted fetus has the right to some respect, what should be change is NOT the regulation on late term abortions (which are already well defined and very stringent) but the treatment of the fetus IF (and it is rare) is still alive when it comes out of the birth canal. Gentle euthanasia or a stay in a separate corner of the nursery (if there is no risk of contagions due to viral infection and such) would be appropriate to remove the "isolated" stories of poor judgement that this nurse recalls.

    The kind of people who would go to such extreme as to produce such MISLEADING video are exactly the type of people who would want our country to return to the draconian laws of making all abortions illegals. . .and this would lead without any doubt to the same kind of excess that have been in the news not so long ago in IRELAND.

    Is that really what you want for our Country's women? To die for NOTHING?
     
  9. Sadanie

    Sadanie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There is no "PRO ABORTION" crowd here or any place.

    What there is is a reasonable "PRO CHOICE" crowd. Get off your ridiculous sentimentality and your misleading statements.
     
  10. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

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  11. Pasithea

    Pasithea Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    That's from an episode of House M.D. The so-called doctor they show in the second frame there is the actor Hugh Laurie. Wow, the lengths you will go to and the BS propaganda you will show to push your agenda against women are astounding. You dirty little liar.

    [video=youtube;0DGWG3Tl7qQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DGWG3Tl7qQ[/video]

    I really loathe liars.
     
  12. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

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    I just used that clip because it was conveniently made into the form of an animated picture. But this video is real:

    [video=youtube;6vWbQEScq_A]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vWbQEScq_A[/video]

    Unfortunately, the baby in this video was sedated for the surgery (unlike in abortions), so you cannot see him moving around.
     
  13. Pasithea

    Pasithea Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    Oh yes, how convenient it is to lie to people isn't it? Speaking of convenience, I thought it was evil and wrong to do things out of convenience in your opinion? Certainly lying out of convenience is wrong too?

    Really now? And you have factual proof for this statement? Or are you just lying out your bum once more to us?
     
  14. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    And even more unfortunately it is not titled in English so we do not know WHAT it is really about

    Next time just tell us what you are trying to achieve because so far your achievements have been less than zero
     
  15. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

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    [video=youtube;bfWB7tcAdhw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfWB7tcAdhw&feature=related[/video]

    Doctors who do late-term abortions know what they are doing.
     
  16. Pasithea

    Pasithea Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    Yeah he admits to killing fetuses. So what? He also admits to helping pregnant girls as young as 8 to 9 years old. You really believe an 8 or 9 year old little girl should be forced to give birth to and raise a child?

    Dr. Boyd realizes that late term abortion is necessary to save the lives of women.

    In fact I found a nice little speech from him outlining some of the things he has seen come into his clinic. I feel it is necessary to post this because your little video here does not give the whole picture in the slightest.

    http://www.rhrealitycheck.org/blog/2011/05/23/work
     
  17. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Ummm Yes, well I am pretty sure they do not think they are doing dental extractions - and again your "evidence" is You tube - notorious for manipulation and lies
     
  18. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

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  19. Casper

    Casper Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    Please post where anyone is saying it should be done up to nine months or admit you are challenged by the truth. A month old fetus is not viable, no matter what you want to believe.
     
  20. OKgrannie

    OKgrannie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Not long ago, you were complaining that women made the decision without the input of the prospective father. Now you're complaining that prospective fathers have too much input. Many women are pressured by friends and family and even strangers to NOT abort. Please see clinic protesters. Regardless of the pressure put on a woman to abort or to not abort, it is still HER DECISION. Removing choice by the force of law is not a viable solution.
     
  21. Makedde

    Makedde New Member Past Donor

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  22. The XL

    The XL Well-Known Member

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    Late term abortion is pretty much murder. I support a womens right to an abortion, but that doesn't mean you should be able to wait until it's a fully functioning human. It's not much different than killing it immediately after birth at that point.

    I understand and support late term abortions if the mothers life is in danger, however.
     
  23. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    The overwhelming majority of late (third) term abortions are done for foetal abnormality incompatible with life - or cases like twoin to twin transfusion where the foetuses are again incompatible with life
     
  24. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

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    Here's my answer to that claim: http://forlifeandfamily.blogspot.com/2009/07/late-term-abortion-statistics-only-tip.html

    We don't really know whether these statistics collected by "family planning" centers are true. That would be like asking Hitler for an accurate estimate of how many jews died in concentration camps.
    http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/fo...-worker-planned-parenthood-lies-about-itself/
     
  25. Pasithea

    Pasithea Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    Uh oh, I see Godwin's law again!
     

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