Romney Lost The Debate. How Could You Say Differently?

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by woodystylez, Oct 5, 2012.

  1. woodystylez

    woodystylez Banned

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    The debate was good. Better than I thought it would be. What stood out are the best questions.

    Romney over and over said his tax cuts wouldn't cut revenue. Obama asked over and over, "How are you going to pay for the difference" Romney never answered.

    Also Romney showed he could not conform to rules by cutting off the president and the interviewer with no respect. Fox News applauded this later last night. And just like so many other things Republican, I think, "My kids just turned 3 and I teach them not to do things like this."

    To sum it up;

    Obama answered everything in detail.

    Romney stuck with avoiding detail.

    Obama wins round 1 hands down. Anyone who says differently is bias and blind. Facts beat fiction all day.
     
  2. woodystylez

    woodystylez Banned

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    I am not stupid. I know why Republicans are saying he won. Trying to gain attention from people who don't like politics to win votes, it's old news.

    Anyone who watched saw Romney trying to sell the worst car on the planet saying, "Boy, she's a beauty isn't she?!" With the slick hair and fake smile.

    Again, Facts over fiction. Obama won.
     
  3. caul

    caul New Member

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    The reason why Obama lost the debate was that he let Romney push him around and wasn't assertive enough to call Romney off on his bull(*)(*)(*)(*). Obama's main character flaw is that he's too nice. Romney's is that he's an insecure pathological liar with daddy issues. Traditionally, people with Romney's flaws tend to have an easier road to become president. To be honest though, Romney's facade did win me over a bit. If the Mitt Romney shown on the debate floor were running for president, there would be a good chance I would consider voting for him.
     
  4. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Not only are you a card carrying leftist you are apparently deaf and blind and you spin like a top. Obama's solution to every thing is tax the rich. Romneys plan is to reduce the marginal tax rate to a level sightly above the effective tax rate the rich already pay and get rid of all the deductions that reduce their effective level of taxation to below that point anyway.

    The effect of this will be to channel money away from unproductive but perfectly legal tax avoidance schemes and into things that are productive. It will also bring us to a tax code that is more about generating the necessary capital to run the government and less about micromanaging people's behavior meaning everyone is a bit freer.
     
  5. The Real American Thinker

    The Real American Thinker New Member

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    1) Even Democrats everywhere and left-wing pundits agree Obama lost.
    2) It was very obvious to anyone who doesn't have an agenda that Romney won. He may not have had the best answers but his performance was pretty (*)(*)(*)(*) spectacular, while Obama didn't even seem awake for most of it.
     
  6. The XL

    The XL Well-Known Member

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    It was painful to watch. Obama wants to spend, spend, spend, spend, per usual, and Romney is going to apparently balance the budget without substantially, if at all, touching Medicare and Medicaid, while also increasing the defense budget.

    It was such fail all around.
     
  7. keymanjim

    keymanjim New Member Past Donor

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    Well, you see, I watched the debate. And Romney won.
    Not just won, though. He beat obama like he was one of his beoches that owed him money. Yeah, it was that kind of smack down.
    I heard that the beat down obama received was so bad the the Dali Lama was praying to God for it stop. The mutherfuqer isn't even Catholic, it was that epic.

    Yeah, obama lost.
     
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  8. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Cnn's poll of the debate results was 67-27 in favor of romney winning. That was a record. And given the fact that CNN Samples more Dems than republicans by about 8 percent the beat down was probably worse than that. Even Bill Mahr and Mr. Tingly leg thought Obama lost and those two usually suck up to Obama so bad I'm suprised the draft they create doesn't move the jet stream a little further south.
     
  9. Marine1

    Marine1 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    WASHINGTON — President Barack Obama and Republican rival Mitt Romney spun one-sided stories in their first presidential debate, not necessarily bogus, but not the whole truth.

    Here's a look at some of their claims and how they stack up with the facts:

    OBAMA: "I've proposed a specific $4 trillion deficit reduction plan. ... The way we do it is $2.50 for every cut, we ask for $1 in additional revenue."

    THE FACTS: In promising $4 trillion, Obama is already banking more than $2 trillion from legislation enacted along with Republicans last year that cut agency operating budgets and capped them for 10 years. He also claims more than $800 billion in war savings that would occur anyway. And he uses creative bookkeeping to hide spending on Medicare reimbursements to doctors. Take those "cuts" away and Obama's $2.50/$1 ratio of spending cuts to tax increases shifts significantly more in the direction of tax increases.

    Obama's February budget offered proposals that would cut deficits over the coming decade by $2 trillion instead of $4 trillion. Of that deficit reduction, tax increases accounted for $1.6 trillion. He promises relatively small spending cuts of $597 billion from big federal benefit programs like Medicare and Medicaid. He also proposed higher spending on infrastructure projects.

    ___

    ROMNEY on cutting the deficit: "Obamacare's on my list. ... I'm going to stop the subsidy to PBS. ... I'll make government more efficient."

    THE FACTS: Romney has promised to balance the budget in eight years to 10 years, but he hasn't offered a complete plan. Instead, he's promised a set of principles, some of which – like increasing Pentagon spending and restoring more than $700 billion in cuts that Democrats made in Medicare over the coming decade – work against his goal. He also has said he will not consider tax increases.

    He pledges to shrink the government to 20 percent of the size of the economy, as opposed to more than 23 percent of gross domestic product now, by the end of his first term. The Romney campaign estimates that would require cuts of $500 billion from the 2016 budget alone. He also has pledged to cut tax rates by 20 percent, paying for them by eliminating tax breaks for the wealthiest and through economic growth.




    To fulfill his promise, then, Romney would require cuts to other programs so deep – under one calculation requiring cutting many areas of the domestic budget by one-third within four years – that they could never get through Congress. Cuts to domestic agencies would have to be particularly deep.

    But he's offered only a few modest examples of government programs he'd be willing to squeeze, like subsidies to PBS and Amtrak. He does want to repeal Obama's big health care law, but that law is actually forecast to reduce the deficit.

    ___

    OBAMA: "Gov. Romney's central economic plan calls for a $5 trillion tax cut – on top of the extension of the Bush tax cuts, that's another trillion dollars – and $2 trillion in additional military spending that the military hasn't asked for. That's $8 trillion. How we pay for that, reduce the deficit, and make the investments that we need to make, without dumping those costs onto middle-class Americans, I think is one of the central questions of this campaign."

    THE FACTS: Obama's claim that Romney wants to cut taxes by $5 trillion doesn't add up. Presumably, Obama was talking about the effect of Romney's tax plan over 10 years, which is common in Washington. But Obama's math doesn't take into account Romney's entire plan.

    Romney proposes to reduce income tax rates by 20 percent and eliminate the estate tax and the alternative minimum tax. The Tax Policy Center, a Washington research group, says that would reduce federal tax revenues by $465 billion in 2015, which would add up to about $5 trillion over 10 years.

    However, Romney says he wants to pay for the tax cuts by reducing or eliminating tax credits, deductions and exemptions. The goal is a simpler tax code that raises the same amount of money as the current system but does it in a more efficient manner.

    The knock on Romney's plan, which Obama accurately cited, is that Romney has refused to say which tax breaks he would eliminate to pay for the lower rates.

    ___

    ROMNEY: Obama's health care plan "puts in place an unelected board that's going to tell people ultimately what kind of treatments they can have. I don't like that idea."

    THE FACTS: Romney is referring to the Independent Payment Advisory Board, a panel of experts that would have the power to force Medicare cuts if costs rise beyond certain levels and Congress fails to act. But Obama's health care law explicitly explicitly prohibits the board from rationing care, shifting costs to retirees, restricting benefits or raising the Medicare eligibility age. So the board doesn't have the power to dictate to doctors what treatments they can prescribe.

    Romney seems to be resurrecting the assertion that Obama's law would lead to rationing, made famous by former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin's widely debunked allegation that it would create "death panels."

    The board has yet to be named, and its members would ultimately have to be confirmed by the Senate. Health care inflation has been modest in the last few years, so cuts would be unlikely for most of the rest of this decade.

    ___

    OBAMA: It's important "that we take some of the money that we're saving as we wind down two wars to rebuild America."

    THE FACTS: This oft-repeated claim is based on a fiscal fiction. The wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were paid for mostly with borrowed money, so stopping them doesn't create a new pool of available cash that can be used for something else, like rebuilding America. It just slows down the government's borrowing.

    ___

    ROMNEY: "At the same time, gasoline prices have doubled under the president. Electric rates are up."

    THE FACTS: He's right that the average price has doubled, and a little more, since Obama was sworn in. But presidents have almost no influence on gasoline prices, and certainly not in the near term. Gasoline prices are set on financial exchanges around the world and are based on a host of factors, most importantly the price of crude oil used to make gasoline, the amount of finished gasoline ready to be shipped and the capacity of refiners to make enough to meet market demand.

    Retail electricity prices have risen since Obama took office – barely. They've grown by an average of less than 1 percent per year, less than the rate of inflation and slower than the historical growth in electricity prices. The unexpectedly modest rise in electricity prices is because of the plummeting cost of natural gas, which is used to generate electricity.

    ___

    OBAMA: "Independent studies looking at this said the only way to meet Gov. Romney's pledge of not ... adding to the deficit is by burdening middle-class families. The average middle-class family with children would pay about $2,000 more."

    THE FACTS: That's just one scenario. Obama's claim relies on a study by the Tax Policy Center, a Washington research group. The study, however, is more nuanced than Obama indicated.

    The study concludes it would be impossible for Romney to meet all of his stated goals without shifting some of the tax burden from people who make more than $200,000 to people who make less.

    In one scenario, the study says, Romney's proposal could result in a $2,000 tax increase for families who make less than $200,000 and have children.

    Romney says his plan wouldn't raise taxes on anyone, and his campaign points to several studies by conservative think tanks that dispute the Tax Policy Center's findings. Most of the conservative studies argue that Romney's tax plan would stimulate economic growth, generating additional tax revenue without shifting any of the tax burden to the middle class. Congress, however, doesn't use those kinds of projections when it estimates the effect of tax legislation.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/03/debate-fact-check_n_1937831.html
     
  10. Bluespade

    Bluespade Banned

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    Get a grip guy, even libs in the media are saying Obama lost.
     
  11. JamesVanArtevelde

    JamesVanArtevelde New Member

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    Denial is a powerful affliction.
     
  12. The DARK LORD

    The DARK LORD New Member

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    Besides the fact that what you said is fiction, and delusional thinking, you apparently dont understand what the debate is all about, and what it means to "win " it.
    It is about getting people to vote for you, and Romney kicked ass. Its a wonderful day for republicans and conservatives, especially to see the liberal media choke on it, even they had to admit obama got his ass kicked.
    Oh yea, there are a few, like the OP, who came up with some ridiculous explanation, like al gore, it was the altitude and lack of sleep. bwahahhahahahahhahahahh
    ROMNEY KICKED HIS ASS SIDEWAYS, UPSIDE DOWN AND FORWARD. IT showed that obama is an ignorant smooth talking con, but when called out on his crap, a man knowledgable about running a business, he gave up, he quit. Because the media has been doing nothing but playing softball with obama the whole time, this is the first time he has had to deal with someone who would confront his lies, and make him say more than "hope and change" and "forward".
     
  13. Zxereus

    Zxereus Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Too bad virtually no one agrees with you, Republican and Democrats.
     
  14. The Question

    The Question New Member

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    I think the reason of Obama's loss, and My mind, Obama was losing end of the debate.

    For several reasons that have happened in the first 90 minutes, and I quote:

    "But Romney came off as the more energized candidate overall by repeatedly attacking Obama on red-meat issues for Republicans such as health care reform and higher taxes, while the president began with lengthy explanations and only later focused more on what his opponent was saying. '"

    Obama focused on responding, in discussion. It's my opinion the main cause of Obama's loss.
     
  15. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Well not quite when George W. Bush announced an increase in oil exploration production from and on American soil world l prices plummeted. When Obama terminated that program they rose. So indeed presidents can have an impact on oil prices.

    By the way the second half of that factoid studiously ignored the fact that Obama and the Dems have loaded the deck against coal fired plants and that the Northeast uses this source almost exclusively expect a cold dark winter after the election in New England.
     
  16. peoplevsmedia

    peoplevsmedia Banned

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    If you know me, you know I dislike them all equally. and as a neutral source, I have to say this statement by you is a complete trolling: it was OBAMS who not only talked longer, but had the nerve to say "you can move on to the next subject" while continnuing to talk about the same subject - very hypocritical of him. both idiots are complete idiots, best leave it at that unless you want to play ball, but I guess that is what this forum is about - playing ball and you are on the left side; I, as a referee can only say you are full of it.
     
  17. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    CNN - If Obama were a Broadway play, it would have closed after that night.

    I don't see how anyone could think any differently. LOL

    Obama has not done that badly since he debated Clint Eastwood.
     
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  18. AceFrehley

    AceFrehley New Member

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    Hi, I'm Ace. Welcome to planet Earth.

    Clearly you are on the fringe. Even liberal pundits everywhere are conceding Obama lost. Feel free to have the last word, as I simply won't waste any additional time on someone so far removed from reality.
     
  19. REPUBLICRAT

    REPUBLICRAT Well-Known Member

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    Romney won the debate. However, the plan he chose for doing so will bite him in the a*s in a major way from here on out. Let's be honest, the man wouldn't have flip-flopped any more than he did if he had been tazed during the debate. The Obama campaign should completely focus on his flip-flops and lack of details on how he's going to do what he now says he will do. Of course, Romney could just explain how, but I highly doubt that will happen.
     
  20. The DARK LORD

    The DARK LORD New Member

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    Good points. While the prez cant just wave his magic wand, even though many that Obama could after all his promises they bought into, and make prices stable or go down.
    But many policies that he sets has great influence. For example, look whats happening in the middle east, that turmoil reduces oil supplies, and of course raises prices.
    .......Opening piplelines, our relationship with russia, our natural gas developement policies, basic epa policies,
     
  21. The DARK LORD

    The DARK LORD New Member

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    You might not like them, but they arent idiots, they are both much more succesful than you or I.
     
  22. The DARK LORD

    The DARK LORD New Member

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    You arent getting it. You bought into the AL sharpton kook aid, Romney showed LEADERSHIP along with an ability to get things done, and a good understanding of how business works.
     
  23. The DARK LORD

    The DARK LORD New Member

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    Now seriously, that made me laugh !!! thanks for that
     
  24. woodystylez

    woodystylez Banned

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    Maybe you are right. Maybe Romney was more assertive and had a better facade. Maybe this is why people think he won.

    When you are buying a car do you buy it because the car salesman is assertive and has a good facade? Or do you look at the car and see what it has to offer? :)

    To be honest, I prefer a nice car salesman than a pushy one that is FOS.
     
  25. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Considering we had a businessman against a USED car salesman, I pick the businessman.
     

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