Late Term Abortion - lazy women or desperately sad

Discussion in 'Abortion' started by Bowerbird, Jan 18, 2013.

  1. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2009
    Messages:
    91,871
    Likes Received:
    73,626
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    So, the pro-life camp have run two successful campaigns to confuse people

    Firstly they have made people confused about late and early term abortions and implanted the idea that as soon as an egg is fertilised it looks like a baby

    Secondly the idea that a woman having a late term abortion is doing it for "convenience" to "look good in a bikini" (if that were even remotely true half of Hollywood elite would be lining up)

    But the truth is further than this - most are done because the parents do not want to see the baby suffer

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9141586
    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1471-0528.2006.01144.x/full
     
  2. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2011
    Messages:
    11,044
    Likes Received:
    138
    Trophy Points:
    0
    most, but not all...
    And it does depend quite a bit on how we define "late-term", because in many pregnancies that pro-choicers would not consider "late-term", the baby is still disturbingly developed. In some cases the babies have actually been born and survived before the pregnancy would be considered "late-term".

    In America 18000 elective late-term abortions are performed on healthy normal fetuses 19 weeks and older every year. If these perfectly healthy women aren't lazy, what is it? Indecisiveness until the last moment?

    http://www.politicalforum.com/abortion/266663-late-term-abortions-real-reasons-they-performed.html
     
  3. Fugazi

    Fugazi New Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2012
    Messages:
    17,057
    Likes Received:
    96
    Trophy Points:
    0
    when you provide "evidence" don't you think it would be better to provide it from un-biased sources and not ones that just adhere to your opinion.
     
  4. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2009
    Messages:
    91,871
    Likes Received:
    73,626
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    No late term is post viability
    as I have pointed out before that is a very old survey and a lot has changed in reproductive medicine since then
     
  5. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2011
    Messages:
    11,044
    Likes Received:
    138
    Trophy Points:
    0
    That's just not true. Choicers like to define "late-term" as 24 weeks, but we all know that sometimes babies can be born before then and survive.
    And just because it is not "late-term" does not mean it is not still "late" into the pregnancy. From my view, 19 weeks is already way too late into the pregnancy to be considering an elective abortion.
     
  6. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2009
    Messages:
    91,871
    Likes Received:
    73,626
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    And if that abortion is because of foetal non-viability?

    Although there have been RARE cases of viability before 24 weeks they are rare. Mostly because the organs are not mature enough
     
  7. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2011
    Messages:
    11,044
    Likes Received:
    138
    Trophy Points:
    0
    A fetus prematurely born at 23 weeks has a 17% chance of survival, and that's not even a late-term abortion according to some pro-aborts.
    Doesn't seem all that rare to me.
     
  8. Fugazi

    Fugazi New Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2012
    Messages:
    17,057
    Likes Received:
    96
    Trophy Points:
    0
    1 in 8 of all births in the US is deemed premature, that is around 500,000 per year of those 22% were found to have severe disabilities, 24% had moderate disabilities and 34% with mild disabilities. The total number of preterm births in the US accounts for 12% of the total births, in 2009 there were 4,131,019 live births in the USA, that is 495,722 premature live births of those nearly 75% of then termed extremely preterm (less than 28 weeks) died within a short time, that is 371,791.

    Also any woman who goes into labour before 24 weeks is having a threatened miscarriage and not a preterm labour, preterm labour is only such between weeks 24 and 37

    Source - http://www.baby2see.com/premature_labor.html


    Could you please link to this 17% figure you have or did you just pull it out of the sky.
     
  9. Unifier

    Unifier New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2010
    Messages:
    14,479
    Likes Received:
    531
    Trophy Points:
    0
    What difference does it make what it looks like? Do you realize that you're kind of unwittingly admitting here that your definition of "person" is based on appearance?
     
  10. Fugazi

    Fugazi New Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2012
    Messages:
    17,057
    Likes Received:
    96
    Trophy Points:
    0
    for me it makes no difference at all .. my definition of a person is an independent sentient person.

    Independent as in able to process its own air to oxygenate its blood, to be able to ingest food to fuel its own body and to dispose of its own waste

    Sentient as in able to process data through sight, touch, smell, sound and taste to make decisions based on those inputs and learned history - which even a newborn can do BTW - or if you wish I can give you the scientific meaning of sentient.
     
  11. countryboy

    countryboy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    2,806
    Likes Received:
    88
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Can libs ever make a point without lying? Apparently not.

    Do late term aborted babies suffer? Hmmmmm......

    (*)(*)(*)(*)ing sanctimonious libs.
     
  12. Cady

    Cady Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2010
    Messages:
    8,661
    Likes Received:
    99
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Since late term abortions are only performed for the life/health of the mother, and fetuses with conditions incompatible with life, what is your solution? Let me guess...let the woman die so the fetus won't have to suffer?

    Grow up.
     
  13. countryboy

    countryboy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    2,806
    Likes Received:
    88
    Trophy Points:
    48
    If that were true, I wouldn't have a problem with it per se. Again, why do libs always have to lie to advance their agenda?
     
  14. Cady

    Cady Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2010
    Messages:
    8,661
    Likes Received:
    99
    Trophy Points:
    48
    What is the lie? Provide proof.
     
  15. countryboy

    countryboy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    2,806
    Likes Received:
    88
    Trophy Points:
    48
    You provide proof that late term abortions are only performed to save the life of the mother. Because this is EXTREMELY rare. The numbers do not add up.
     
  16. Cady

    Cady Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2010
    Messages:
    8,661
    Likes Received:
    99
    Trophy Points:
    48
    I said life/health of the mother and when the fetus has a condition incompatible with life. And yes, late term abortions are EXTREMELY rare, approximately one percent are performed after 21 weeks.
     
  17. countryboy

    countryboy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    2,806
    Likes Received:
    88
    Trophy Points:
    48
    As defined by whom?

    Oh, and I meant, it is extremely rare when childbirth actually threatens the life of the mother. ;)
     
  18. Cady

    Cady Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2010
    Messages:
    8,661
    Likes Received:
    99
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Her doctor. Some states require two doctors to approve late term abortions.
     
  19. WhatNow!?

    WhatNow!? New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2013
    Messages:
    2,540
    Likes Received:
    8
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Why do you keep saying somone is a liar when they're agreeing with you? That is weird....and so far YOU haven't provided any proof of anything...
     
  20. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2009
    Messages:
    91,871
    Likes Received:
    73,626
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    What part of that research is a lie?
     
  21. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2011
    Messages:
    11,044
    Likes Received:
    138
    Trophy Points:
    0
    A baby is meant to be nourished on breast milk. A baby can also not change its own diaper. I guess a baby that has already been born is not independent either.

    What about a prematurely born baby attached to an oxygen tank? Can it oxygenate its own blood?


    So a woman can keep shopping around until she finds two doctors that will sign off ?
    Probably would not even be that difficult to find two radical pro-choicer doctors that would approve of a partial birth abortion on a healthy baby, if she looked around enough.
     
  22. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2009
    Messages:
    91,871
    Likes Received:
    73,626
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    Yes but that is not what the research paper says - THIS is about abortion for foetal abnormality incompatible with life
     
  23. Fugazi

    Fugazi New Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2012
    Messages:
    17,057
    Likes Received:
    96
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Yep is is, but it doesn't have to be does it, it is not going to die if it is fed on an alternative milk is it .. no a baby can't change its own diaper, but anybody can change the diaper can't they, so again you are clutching at straws trying to make an argument that means nothing.

    Yes, it can because even though it is attached to an oxygen tank it is still using its lungs to process the oxygen, isn't it .. does it do that while in the womb? .. more straw clutching.
     
  24. countryboy

    countryboy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2011
    Messages:
    2,806
    Likes Received:
    88
    Trophy Points:
    48
    As defined by whom?
     
  25. Fugazi

    Fugazi New Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2012
    Messages:
    17,057
    Likes Received:
    96
    Trophy Points:
    0
    That really depends on what you mean by late term.

    According to the majority of scientists involved in the study of fetal pain the following applies;

    It has also been found that
    The known time when all the pathways are complete and the fetus may be able to feel pain is the 24th week, there are only eight states which have no time restriction on abortion, of those only three have clinics that ostensibly could legally perform a late-term elective abortion.

    Here some more info for you concerning late term abortions (ie after week 24)

    So the assertion that a woman can just ask for a late term abortion is the usual scaremongering tactics for the woman hating pro-lifers,
     

Share This Page