Stolen valor = prison

Discussion in 'Warfare / Military' started by waltky, Mar 16, 2013.

  1. waltky

    waltky Well-Known Member

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    Stolen valor lands man in prison...
    :clapping:
    Fake war hero sentenced to year in prison
    March 15, 2013 — He claimed he was a war hero injured in Iraq and bilked the Veterans Administration for thousands of dollars in medical care. He even persuaded the organization Vacations for Veterans to give him a free trip to Hawaii.
     
  2. waltky

    waltky Well-Known Member

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    Granny says lock `em up an' throw away the key...
    :cool:
    House passes bill on lying about military medals
    May 21, 2013 WASHINGTON - People who falsely claim they have received a military medal in order to obtain money or government benefits could face up to a year in jail under legislation that easily passed the House on Monday.
     
  3. Herkdriver

    Herkdriver New Member

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    There is a section on discharge papers..form DD-214:
    Decorations, Medals, Badges, Citations, and Campaign Awards

    It's easy enough to verify anyone's claims with a FOIA request. Although the form itself is not FOIA eligible...
    Examples of the type of information that may be available to the public from this request are as follows:

    Name
    Service Number
    Dates of Service
    Branch of Service
    Rank and Date of Rank
    Salary
    Assignments and Geographical Locations
    Source of Commission
    Military Education
    Promotion Sequence Number
    Awards and decorations (Eligibility only, not actual medals)
    Duty Status
    Photograph
    Transcript of Court-Martial Trial
    Place of entrance and separation

    Complete the Standard Form 180 and check "other" in Section II to request this information to verify someone's service record claims. Many medals, ribbons and decorations can be bought at surplus stores...just because someone has one, does not mean they earned it.

    Trust but verify, in terms of any veteran who is using their service record for a tangible benefit.
     
  4. nom de plume

    nom de plume New Member

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    That was House that passed the Stolen Valor Bill. The Senate always shoots down everything proposed or passed by the House. The House is an impotent, silly bunch of clowns which temporarily slows down the good and meaningful work of the Democratic-run Senate.

    Pfft!
     
  5. Questerr

    Questerr Banned

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    We don't need a separate law for this. Try these people for fraud and send them to prison.

    However, so long as a person isn't getting monetary gain from it, it should not be illegal to claim to be a veteran. The 1st amendment protections of freedom of speech, protect lying as well.
     
  6. der wüstenfuchs

    der wüstenfuchs Member

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    I agree. Fraud is fraud regardless of what you are lying about to benefit from. I don't believe someone should lie about being a war hero to benefit, but I still believe in free speech so I don't think there should be a law against it. Lying about your service record should be like card counting at a casino. It's not illegal it's just frowned upon.
     
  7. waltky

    waltky Well-Known Member

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    der wursten wrote: Lying about your service record should be like card counting at a casino. It's not illegal it's just frowned upon.

    True...

    ... but it can also get yer kneecaps busted.
     
  8. der wüstenfuchs

    der wüstenfuchs Member

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    If you lie about being a war hero that killed fiddy men and some veterans find out and you have an "accidental fall" off a curb I won't have much pity.
     
  9. waltky

    waltky Well-Known Member

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    IRS says veterans posts should be able to prove their members are veterans...
    :confusion:
    IRS rule could cause problems for veterans
    September 2, 2013 — An Internal Revenue Service policy mandating nonprofit veteran’s organizations keep documents proving members served in the military isn’t going to be easy for the Dalton American Legion to follow, according to its commander.
     
  10. Mushroom

    Mushroom Well-Known Member

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    Has the IRS not learned anything in the debacle over the Tea Party groups? Sorry, but I see this as nothing but an attack on Veterans Groups, period. I mean, think about it. Does it demand that the NAACP show that all of it's members are "Colored", or that everybody in the United Negro College Fund is a "negro"?

    And sorry, it is not mandated that everybody in the American Legion is a Veteran. My wife is an associate member and has full membership rights herself (as well as in the VFW) because she is my spouse.

    This stupid type of attack on "Conservative" and "Veterans" groups has got to stop.
     
  11. Strasser

    Strasser Banned

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    I don't know how the VA can be so screwed up. Maybe it's a regional thing; most vets I know using its services here are quite happy with them, ditto in the Kentucky/Tennessee region. On the other hand, the West Coast and Northeast give the impression they're run by mobsters and space alien shapeshifters. I recall an investigation in the the Pacific Northwest a while back that discovered less than half the patients using VA services there were actually veterans, most never in the military at all. How can that be possible?
     
  12. waltky

    waltky Well-Known Member

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    Granny says, "Dat's right - put dem rascals inna pokey...
    :grandma:
    Report: Court rules wearing unearned medals a crime
    October 30, 2014 ~ Lying about receiving a military medal is protected speech, but there’s no right to wear a combat decoration that hasn’t been earned, a federal appeals court said Wednesday.
     
  13. galant

    galant Banned

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    I think that such animals should be euthanized, myself. What complete scum they are.
     
  14. Texan

    Texan Well-Known Member

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    I can't argue with anybody in this thread.
     
  15. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

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    seems like there is a law against everything nowadays.

    yes, wearing medals you were never awarded in extremely bad taste and is probably deceptive

    but to throw people in prison for that? how long are they going to go to prison for that??
    Maybe instead they should be forced to wear a shirt with big letters saying "I got caught wearing a military medal that I did not earn, and am being shamed for it by having to wear this T-shirt."
     
  16. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

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    I don't think it should necessarily be against the law to wear decorations you didn't earn or claiming to be a war vet or anything. But there should also be a stipulation in the law grants immunity to any real veteran who finds out you are lying and decides to knock your teeth out.

    I actually ran into a poser in a bar a few years ago who was claiming he was some super Soldier with like 10 confirmed kills talking all this trash trying to impress some lady. It's not really hard to gather enough information to lie about when you live near an Army base full of Soldiers who hang around in all the local bars swapping war stories every weekend. It's also not hard for actual Soldiers to tell who is full of crap. Turns out the dummy made the mistake of claiming to be part of our own unit. My extremely large, disgruntled, and slightly intoxicated buddy stormed up to the guy and asked him if he was a new guy or something because nobody had ever seen him before. Trying to continue with the lie he said he was a Staff Sergeant in C company who had just gotten home from deployment (he made that up on the spot). Another mistake, C co was our sister Tank Company and all of us were at the bar celebrating because WE had just got home from deployment. I guess the dummy heard us talking and decided to say he was part of our unit to impress the girl.

    So my buddy says "oh ok cool, you must be the new guy, well its customary for the new guy to buy the rounds for the unit and we are all over there by the pool tables, nice to meet you." Not wanting to get exposed the guy hesitates then orders a good $100 in shots for all of us at the bar. We take the shots and tell him to order another round, after that one he says he's going to head on home now because hes tired. We say "Naw man this is our party, WE just got home remember? Plus you've been drinking and as good buddies we cannot let you survive a war then go off and drive drunk and kill yourself on YOUR first day back, we'll call you a cab in a few, in the meantime we are still thirsty, come on new guy pucker up".

    So he buys another round, then another, then another while waiting for a cab that was taking an awfully long time to arrive for some reason. All trying to keep up the lie in front of this lady and us because he thought we actually believed him. When we were done drinking we called our cabs and walked by the guy and said "Don't forget to pay the bill new guy, don't worry about it you have plenty of cash from that deployment you just came home from. Oh and your cab will be here in about 5 mins we just called again they were busy or something earlier I dunno, see ya".

    We never saw that guy in the bar again lol. Hopefully he actually hooked up with that lady at least. That's the least he could get after paying a $900 bar tab for being a lying piece of (*)(*)(*)(*).
     
  17. Herkdriver

    Herkdriver New Member

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    I think this applies more to military members wearing medals they didn't earn. Around 1996 if I remember it, the Navy's highest ranking officer, shot himself in the chest shortly after he was told of an impending magazine article suggesting that he wore two Vietnam War combat decorations that he had not earned.

    Considering the service gives away medals like candy these days, and merely showing up and fogging a mirror is enough to earn some of them...there are a few that must be actually earned and those who decide to wear them without having earned them is certainly conduct unbecoming a member of the armed forces. As far as civilians wearing them, well I have more pity than anythihg else if their own lives are so lacking they must lie about to impress people. As long as someone is not gaining financially from being a "pretender" and is not in the military...personally I don't care.
     
  18. ArmySoldier

    ArmySoldier Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It's not all because they are wearing the medal. It's the benefits they are trying to receive through claiming to be a war hero. That's what will land ya in jail.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Medals are only given out like candy to Officers. Officers will come home with the Bronze Star.
     
  19. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

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    Oh yeah...

    I'm sure you remember a time having been in formation rolling your eyes at the medals Officers got upon returning home from deployment. It's all politics man.

    I remember coming home from deployment and watching a Major and 2 Lt. Cols get Silver Stars for this particular engagement we got into. The way they fabricated the story was just hilarious. We're all standing tall in formation listening to the speech about how they personally led the brave troops into a fierce battle with the enemy and won etc. We're standing there laughing like yeah ok...

    Problem is that on that particular deployment I was the PSD. When the rockets and grenades starting falling in the FOB that day and the wall was about to get breached we ran to the Command and grabbed them all by the back of their collars and threw them into a MATV and had our drivers take off. When we fought off the attack and it was all clear we brought them back. No fault of their own they didn't want to go they were yelling and kicking as we were escorting them away, but it was our job to protect them.

    But they got Silver Stars for that particular engagement. We got "good job". LOL

    Oh well thats how it's always been. The troops do the work and the Officers get the credit for it lol.
     
  20. ArmySoldier

    ArmySoldier Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    UGH tell me about it! Here's an example too. My cousin who is currently still in (I ETSd) just returned home a few months ago. I attended his unit's yellow ribbon ceremony. They announced one of the platoon leader's bronze star and EVERY set of eyes from the soldiers began to roll.

    I was lucky enough to actually have really good officers. However with that said, they don't deserve a lot of the medals they got. It's the enlisted who carry out the orders.
     
  21. Herkdriver

    Herkdriver New Member

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    I got an Air Medal upon returning home to go along with the Southwest Asia Service medal, Saudi Arabian Medal for the Liberation of Kuwait and the Emirate of Kuwait Medal for the Liberation of Kuwait for participation in these campaigns:

    Defense of Saudi Arabia - August 2, 1990 January 16, 1991
    Liberation and Defense of Kuwait - January 17, 1991 April 11, 1991

    All I did was deliver the daily ATO (air tasking order), and while administrative and logistical flights between established airbases or secure areas are not considered qualifying as direct combat support sorties.The award of the Air Medal on a strike/flight basis requires 20 points. I had over 50 missions with 1 mission = .4 points.

    The Southwest Asia Service medal were awarded to members of the United States Armed Forces who participated in, or directly supported, military operations in Southwest Asia or in surrounding areas between 8/02/1990 – 11/30/1995. Basically if you were in the area you received this award.

    Nearly everyone gets the National Defense Service medal if you served during the time of the Persian Gulf war from 8/02/1990 – 11/30/1995, It is awarded to anyone who serves on active duty in the United States military during this time period. I got one of those as an Air Force Reservist also, serving during GWOT, basically from 9/11/2001 to the present day

    My Dad told me I looked like a Christmas tree, he asked if I won the war all by myself.

    Of course, I told him.
     
  22. ArmySoldier

    ArmySoldier Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Wow that's great. Air Force is so cool. My grandfather is a General who retired in 88. He has 6 male grandchildren. 5 of them are distinguished officers in the Army, Air Force, and one Marine.

    I enlisted as a grunt ;-)
     
  23. Casper

    Casper Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    Good, I have run across a few of them in my life time, had one claiming he was a Medal of Honor winner at one place I worked, me and a few other Vets outed him and he was despised by most after that, he was eventually fired over his job performance.
     
  24. Herkdriver

    Herkdriver New Member

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    My Dad was drafted into the U.S. Army in 1944 and served as a grunt in the infantry. He insisted that I do anything but the infantry.
     
  25. ArmySoldier

    ArmySoldier Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Your father is absolutely right. I originally wanted to go to Warrant Officer Flight Training and fly rotary winged. I kept having my packet pushed back time and time again, and finally I just said screw it and went 11bravo. Looking back, I wish I had been more patient.
     

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