why so much ferocity, hate or anger against the germans? what did they did to you guys? True, technically austro-hungarian empire started WW1 but dont forget i was a serbian terrorist attack and political murder that triggered the austro-hungarian rage, and WW1 shoudn't have been so, if not by these stupid traties (britain, france, russia, serbia on one side and the austria-hungary, italy, germany on the other) it would have been only a 2 country war and not a global one. Also don't forget that after the WW1 only germany was held responsible for all that happened and was imposed with an almost imposible economical sanction of repaying a debt for all the damage done against an almost economically ruined germany among others santions like losing 25 to 30% of their national territory. And they knew germany cound not pay and then belgium and france started to steal german coal from the demilitarized rhineland. Don't forget that those things happened with the blessing of the US (who got invloved in a war that wasn't theirs at all). Of course the germans were pissed off cause that was a legalized act of revenge not a peace treaty. There is always a moral duty from the winner towards the defeated, ALWAYS!!! a sense of JUSTICE!!! which did not apply here. Also they draw the new map of europe as they saw fit, with no consideration for the defeated (Austria-hungary dissapeard from the map forever) and germany was sliced and diced. Now i agree with the creation of poland, for they were not russians nor germans but cut germany in two to give poland a sea board? i don't think so... it's true that the german province of "Posen" was populated mostly by poles but i think there was no real need to cut germany from "east prussia" or "Ostpreußen". The winners fertilized the ground for the national-socialists (Nazis) to rise, with there atheism and extreme hatred, ultranationalism, extreme racism, regain of every lost territory, extreme anti-religiousness, imperialism, expansionism (to the east) and so on... Because many germans feeled they lost the war cause they fought fair during WW1, cause their christian moral standards abandoned them in the hour of need, like monstruos inflation, broken economy, monstruos unemployment, starving, cold winters, french and belgians stealing there coal (that could have warmed them during these winters), many who managed to profit from this situation, the rise of marxism in germany and the whle of the left wing (many knew what and how Lenin controled the newly soviet union, what stalin was doing after he gaind power), etc. created the unhappyness, fear and hatred towards the winners (france and great britain) and soviet marxism in germany (don't forget that the KDP Kommunistisches Partei Deutschlands = german communist party were lackeys of stalin and followed his orders to the letter and some commies separatists tried to establish a communist republic in bavaria called the soviet republic of bavaria = Bayerische Räterrepublik independent from the rest of germany). So yeah, the germans were pissed off and very angry. All this malcontent found sanctuary in the newly formed NSDAP National-Sozialistische Deutsche Arbeiter Partei = national-socialist german workers party. But that was not everything. Hitler managed to imbue the NSDAP doctrine (already full of general miscontent and hatred) with his personal racial points of view, totalitarism and megalomania and narcissism. The brits, the yanks and frenchs brought WW2 not just on them selves, but all europe and most of the world. They with their vengefull traties against germany ended up unleashing an unknown hellish demon over europe and the rest of the world. It's true, almost all nazis were germans and austrians, but not even 1/3 of germans and austrians were nazis. I'm not sure if half the german population were supporters either cause with the nazis and marxists, you either love'em or hate'em. There's no middle ground. Maybe markus will clarify my numbers. But also do you think the russian commies were ANY BETTER than the german nazis???? have you, TRFjr and katzgard forgot what lenin, stalin, kruschev, brezhnev, andropov, chernenko and maybe gorbachov did???? you forget the crimes, war crimes and crimes agaisnt humanity marxism has done???? you think that the "cheka" later "NKVD" later "KGB" and now "FSB", were and are any better than the nazi SS = SchutzStaffel?????? Hitler was evil, the nazis were evil, but so are the marxists. The nazis lasted only 12 years, and by action or omision, directly, indirectly, nazism cost the lives of 50 to 60 million people. The marxists have lasted more than 97 years, and by action or omision, directly or indirectly, marxisms has cost the lives of undetrmined hundreds of millions of people all around the world. Marxism has murderd, tortured, mutilated, disppeard at least 5 times more people than nazism, Soviet Union, China, North Korea, Vietnam, Cambodia, East Germany, Hungary, Chechoslovakia, Cuba... you name it. Germany should intervene in foreign nations if the reasons are right (That's why NATO was founded for in the first place). And also i think maybe Germany should intervene in Ukraine militarly and increasingly more and more harsh economical sanctions against russia. Don't forget what putin is trying to do, what he's done already, what do you TRFjr and katzgard say about THAT???? You guys hate the germans cause they were nazis 68 years ago, ok, but do you hate the russians, the chinese, the north koreans, the cubans for being marxist dictatorships back then????? do you hate them because they are still marxists TODAY???? you guys say that it's wrong for the germans to rearm themselfs and intervene elsewhere, but do you feel the same that putin is trying to rebuild the soviet union???? that north korea constantly makes trouble against south korea and japan???? that the chinese are causing a lot of trouble against south korea, japan, taiwan, philippines, vietnam???? Another thing, germany has paid a terrible price for what they did and I think its been long enough for that. Did the russians paid for what they did against themselves and eastern europe and germany during and after WW2???? I belive the germans have learned most of their hard lesson, cause if they really would have learnd the full hard lesson, they would be already fighting against dictatorships and tyrnats around the world. They know better than anyone in the world what dictatorships and tyrants mean after 12 years of Nazism they where split in 2 and the eastern part ruled by Marxists tyrants. Besides the Germans of today are quite diffrent from the germans from 68 years ago. Just so you know guys... Peace ;D
First I've heard of it It doesn't really matter who started it. Germany was effectively the war leader. And it wasn't Germany that shouldered the full burden anyway. Hungary got it's independence after centuries of being tied to Austria and they did commit appalling atrocities in the Balkans. No they didn't. Germany did deliberately kill civilians in WWI and they were the first to use gas. I know. I had two German girlfriends and some of my best friends are also German.
Except when you play them in football - Which if we pause to think about it, is exactly how it should be
I would recommend you review the peace treaty and repatriation process that Germany imposed on Russia during the same war
Has the OP actually seen or experienced hate from Americans? If so, who and where? I'm 3rd generation American born German descendant and I've never one time experienced hate of Germans and I've lived all over the US. And my last name is German. I'm willing to bet there are far more people globally who hate Americans than hate Germans.
Haven't experienced any serious animosity either... except from the occasional real life troll or joker who thought it would be funny to give me the right arm salute when they realized where I was from. Nothing to take serious. Soccer rivalries are part of the game and don't count. Neither do the usual stereotypes, every country has them. And I've been around quite a bit, although not yet in the US. To the OP: you should really use some paragraphs. That is virtually unreadable.
No-one truly sane on his mind owe any grudge to germany or german in europe. Now, we need as nations to be allow to reclaim our culture and claim its natural lead in our lands. We shouldn't not allow our culture and language be remplaced by immigrants simply because there was a war 60 years ago. If some germans are reading this topic. I have been to germany, Berlin to be more accurate. I was looking for the spirit of Germania the proud and unbent spirit of the german people. But i didn't found her, as people seems to be worried, and still refusing to look at the past, fearing that they may face shame. No-one low citizen or soldier was responsable for WW2, and now the shame of your past need to be fade away so you can be proud to be german one of the oldest nation of the world, and live as german. A friendly french. Loving german, british and european culture.
It's often said that Germany has made peace with its neighbours by coming terms with its wartime past and the nation is now in good standing in the international community. But Japan has always been accused of historical revisionism by the anti-Japanese coalition of Asian nations (i.e. China, South Korea). Political activists from those Asian nations often make exaggerated claims on war crimes committed by Imperial Japan and the Korean American community is especially active in this regard. Anti-German sentiment still exists in some quarters in Britain but it's not comparable to the virulence of anti-Japanese racism in Asia and overseas Chinese and Korean communities.
it's the oriental culture of "face"-appearance/honor/respect/ego...the japanese cant admit their war crimes becacause it would be a dishonorable loss of face, the same reason china cannot admit to the tianimin sq massacre ...so as long the Japanese can't fully recognize and apologize for its war crimes relationships with the agrieved nations can never fully recover...
For example, the number of casualties during the fall of Nanking was believed to be 300,000 as claimed by the Chinese government but new research by Rana Mitter, professor of Chinese history at Oxford, puts the figure at 50,000, of which 20,000 were civilians. We now know that there was the Nanking Safety Zone run by a German businessman who saved up to 200,000 lives by sheltering Chinese civilians at the time and the population of Nanking was 250,000 throughout the 1930s. John Rabe gave a series of lectures in Germany after he came back to Berlin in 1938, in which he said, "We Europeans put the number [of civilian casualties] at about 50,000 to 60,000." [video=youtube;2ud9k9beSCA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ud9k9beSCA[/video]
I was born during the second world war and harbor no animosities toward the Germans. I've admired their independence, industrial abilities, and technology. I visited Germany and had a wonderful time and met some great people. Heck, Texas has a load of Germans since the 1850's and earlier. They brought over good food, fantastic beer, and a super work ethic. I wish there were a lot more of them over here.
i accidently pushed the wrong button guys. instead of Reply to Thread, i pressed Post new Thread i just realized this. i was answering some other thread that was kind of poisonous against germany... sorry guys, my bad!!!! XD And yeah i think i know what treaty you talking about SMDBill, but i want to know if the germans after the defeat of russia in WW1 (no matter how hummiliating) could actually enforce this treaty. I think not, cause they were knee deep in the crap with the frenchies, brits and yanks. And in the end Germany lost the war. And the treaty was worth nothing. After all the bolshevik red army regaind every territory supposly lost to this treaty. but the frenchies and brits did enforce Versailles cause they won. oh btw, the thread can be found in "western europe/germany will use its army more in foreign conflicts" thread. Check it out i you want Peace and Love... ;D
I am a first generation descendant of a German POW, my mother is Welsh and apart from the few stupid children when I was growing up doing Nazi Goose steps and Hitler salutes (but thst is kids for you) I have NEVER been subjected to any form of abuse, be it physical or verbal due to my parentage .. now for my parents that was very different, my mother was disowned by her family for ten years after she married my dad. My father a semi-qualified agricultural engineer was forbidden to work in any other job apart from farm labor, for numerous years he had to turn up at the local police station and have his 'book' stamped, he could not move house without express permission from the home office. He was spat on, called a (*)(*)(*)(*)ing nazi (even though he had no option but to join up, it was a case of join and fight or go to a concentration camp), my mother was called a whore, a collaborator and actually had a brick thrown at her which fractured her arm when she raised it to defend her head. Admittedly all this came from people who only ever knew my dad was German and my mother was married to him, the people who worked with him on the land - when he was a POW - respected him and treated him as a human being. This whole OP is nothing but a fabrication.
Germany started both World Wars, and that's something we can't forget, especially when the 100th anniversary of the start of the First World War comes around on Monday.
I don´t think so. Germany begun the WW2 but not the WW1... It wasn´t Germany who killed the Archduke in Sarajevo... It wasn´t Germany who encouraged, funded and organized the Serbian terrorism in Bosnia, the Black Hand etc ... It wasn´t Germany who mobilized first... Of course, Germany was partly responsible, but not the main ... much more responsibility was... Russia ...and France because it didn´t want to dampen his Russian ally. And Serbia, a nest of terrrorism.
My suggestion: Read this, it'll prevent you (or at least some) from becoming armchair generals. Christopher Clarke: The Sleepwalkers: How Europe Went to War in 1914 (2012).
Indeed. I have a few relatives from around Fredricksburg that still speak German locally and over the dinner table. A bigger wave came over to avoid the draft under Bismarck in the 1880's as well.
Indeed. It's pretty much all Wilhelm II's show, re WW I. The path to WW I started when he sacked Bismarck. It's actually amazing it didn't kick off earlier. For an excellent book on the politics leading up to Wilhelm II's 'blank check', read David Stevenson's Cataclysm: World War I As Political Tragedy; it is the best book out there on the political and economic backgrounds to the war.
You might like this discussion on that book: http://www.amazon.com/review/R1R4C0US43JD41/ref=cm_cr_pr_viewpnt#R1R4C0US43JD41 I lean toward 'Reasonable Guy's' views on the topic, and I still think the Stevenson book is a better history of the politics, but it is a good discussion on the book and the topic.
