Lost in the 70th anniversary of D-Day is that within a few days the US (more or less by itself) launched a big invasion on the island of Saipan. While it was not as big as D-Day, the USN did send from its base in Hawaii thousands of miles to the east (Britain was just a few miles from Normandy)three full strength divisions onto the beach in a single day. In a little over three weeks the US forces wiped out the Japanese, imposing a 7:1 kill ratio. Two months later the Marines and Army invaded Peleliu. Here the Japanese fought more skillfully and the kill ratio was only 5:1. Not a month later, the US (with some Australians) landed in the Philippines with a force bigger than in Morocco,Algeria/Tunisia, or Sicily or Italy, and over the next few months, delivered a world-class thrashing to the IJA resulting in complete destruction of IJA forces in the PI, a 24:1 kill ratio, and cutting the Formosa Straits to Japanese shipping isolating Japan from its oil resources in the erstwhile Dutch East Indies. Isolated single Japanese soldiers held out for decades for reasons only comprehensible to the Japanese. Before the Allies reached the Rhine, Japan was starving and burning. The IJA's myth of competence was utterly destroyed. The IJN was completely neutered. Im no fan of FDRs domestic policies, but you gotta give him this: His ruthlessness as a war leader was truly worthy of Andrew Jackson.
Thanks for posting this. It is a good reminder of the resources the U.S. was bringing to bear that it supported the D-Day invasions while at the same time mounting huge invasions in the Pacific. FDR wasn't perfect- but he may have been the best leader we could have asked for for WW2.
And not to forget launching a devastating operation in Italy. If the US commander at the time had followed orders an entire German army group could have been taken out of the war.
Which operation is that? I have to admit my memory of the history of the Italian campaign after Naples is rather vague.
Re: Post #3 Quite right. If the commander in Italy had turned east after the Anzio breakout and cut off the peninsula, all the Germans south of Rome would have been isolated and eliminated. Instead he chose to liberate Rome and be a glory-hog. The Germans got away to fight another day.
It was a balls to the wall break out at Anzio. The operation started late May, and they caputured Rome on something like June 4th or 5th. The force was more multi national than D Day, but the US did over represent especially in armor.
Taxcutter says: By no means am I quibbling with your post. It is 100% correct. The allies broke out of the Anzio pocket on May 25, 1944. Under the original plan , the Anzio force was to turn east into the Valmontone Gap and through to the Adriatic. By cutting all the north-south roads in this mountainous terrain, the Allies would have trapped the bulk of Kesselrings force south of the Valmontone Gap. Kesselring's force would have been reduced to a few worn-down kampfgruppen that were resting and refitting (slowly) north of Rome. Clark ordered Truscott to turn northwest and liberate Rome, which he did. Kesselring managed to get most of the forces south of Rome away on the (unblocked) roads along the Adriatic. Kesselring was able to dig in along the passes through the Appenines north of Tuscany and managed to hold this line until April 1945. If Clark had turned east and bagged Kesselrings's strength, the allies might have been in Vienna before September 1944. Major, major blunder.
Comparing D-Day to Saipan. On D-Day, the Allies threw seven divisions plus three airborne divisions about thirty miles. At Saipan, the Allies threw three divisions about 2,500 miles. A few weeks later at Peleliu the Allies threw two more divisions an additional 1,800 miles. A few weeks later the Allies threw five divisions an additional 1,200 miles to Leyte. In no case in the Pacific were the Allies more than locally and temporarily out of supply. They expended ammunition and fuel lavishly to destroy the Japanese. After D+2.the Normandy forces were virtually immobile until the port of Cherbourg was taken. In all four cases the allies enjoyed air dominance. Over Normandy the planes were based in the UK. Over the Pacific islands, every single plane in that air dominance came from the decks of US aircraft carriers. One can easily make the assertion that the Pacific invasions were a greater example of force projection.
I was more aiming my question at Moi621 who seemed to think I was re-writing history with my post. And to the guts of your post. Yes Kesselring was exactly the wrong person to offer such an opportunity to. Give one of the best defensive generals of the war mountainous terrain to play in and it is going to hurt a lot
Working on memory. Besides moving in the wrong direction, General Clark took too long after his landing to make his move. Any move. Seemingly timid, he acquired the handle, "Chicken General". Apparently, this feeling of that time has been expunged because I cannot find a reference to in on a "Search". I learned it decades and decades ago Now I am working on memory, be kind Moi r > g No
Okay I see the problem. You are talking about the initial landings in the Jan. I am talking about the breakout in late May. So I am not re-writing history. Just talking about different bits
Glad we are "both" right ! Now can anyone reference, "The Chicken General" ? I tried and can't. Moi r > g No
Dear Wizard and Taxcutter. I could not tell by the #1 upload if we were limited to WW2 "Forgotten Victories" - If Yes, then award one each to the survivors of Hitler's death camps. If, "No"; The Battle of San Jacinto. The Alamo is "Remembered" but Houston's wisdom of retreat to Buffalo Bayou was Washingtonian and his choice of battle turf Wellingtonian . The early march was obscured by a hill cresting from the view of Santa Anna and his men that hot afternoon at siesta time. Termed America's shortest, most decisive, one sided battle forgets these were Texicans, not Americans. Many were Mexican. The Johnny Come Lates who did not fight but came to settle were the bigots. The Battle of San Jacinto has always been a fav since learning about it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_San_Jacinto not the best link, too little about the "Twin Sisters" A history buff friend and I use to explore little corners of history together; and the Republic of Texas was one of them. We even had out copies of, THE RAVEN: A BIOGRAPHY OF SAM HOUSTON (1929) by Marquis James How's that ! [video=youtube;p1OHIiy9XzY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1OHIiy9XzY[/video] Moi r > g No
Anzio was a fail. There were no major Allied victories in Italy, except Sicily. Saipan was a great american victory but casualties is not a measure about fight spirit..or moral...Saipan was 7 to 1 caused by the japanese tactics to wait on the beach (very different in Okinawa or even Iwo Jima) and by the air and naval superiority.. in any case It was a great american victory. San Jacinto was a great victory of the self-proclaimed Republic of Texas. San Jacinto is a classic victory,a total victory, in proportion to casualties, one of the greater victories in history.. El Alamo is not a victory, not even It is a stturborn defence, 189 men against 1.800 is 1: 9,5 and the defence lasted 11 days...in Rorke's Drift 256 british soldiers fought against 4.000 zulues (proportion 1 to 15,6) for 2 days... or Baler 51 spaniards against 7.000 filipinos (1 to 140) and the defence lasted 337 days.... San Jacinto is the classic victory... Alamo is a honest defence but I don´t think "epic"... Wake Island was epic! (and forgotten)
My understanding of FDR and WW2 was that FDR knew that he wasn't a war leader and so was very hands off unlike Churchill or Hitler who fancied themselves as military geniuses and weren't.
On the other hand, is not the mark of a good leader knowing what you dont know. Then surrounding yourself with people who do know
Taxcutter says: FDR had to OK the Rules of Engagement. FDR ordered unrestricted submarine warfare against Japan BEFORE Congress declared war. FDR OK'd firebombing and carpet-bombing cities and blockading off foodstuff importation into Germany, Italy, and Japan. Pretty much anything Marshall, King, and Ike wanted to do was A-OK with FDR. That hasn't been true since.
