Supporters of Israel/Supporters of Palestine

There is one major difference between supporters of Israel and supporters of Palestine.

Supporters of Israel, at least most of them, are more than happy to state that it is NEVER ok to target and kill civilians and other non-combatants, especially women and children. No matter the goal and the justness of the cause.

Supporters of Palestine however, always find reasons to justify, excuse, or at least "understand" the targeting of Israeli civilians.

This is the main difference.

 

When Israel denies the Palestinians water and destroys tens of thousands of ancient olive trees WHO are they targeting, Ron?

 

The overwhelming majority of the supporters of Israel are fine with a Palestinian state, as long as Israel remains on the map, secure, democratic and Jewish.


A very large percentage of the "pro-Palestinians" on the other hand would not accept Israel in any borders, their ultimate goal is to destroy Israel, whether it's militarily or demographically or politically does not matter much to them....nor do Palestinians matter to them, Palestinians are tools, not beneficiaries in anti-Israel mob's struggle against Israel

 

Can you provide any evidence that Palestinians think its OK to target civilians or kill children? They really don't have an army..

 

What are you talking about? I don't support Palestine but that being said what you're saying is simply isn't true.

 

Lots of projection going on...

Its like when some idiot claims that Jewish people put the blood of gentile babies in Matzo... but the only persons making that accusation are Jewish people who WANT to believe they are being accused.

 

Just so they can justify their policies towards their Christian neighbors.

 

Nonsense, a large swathe of Israelis have worked against a two state solution for a long time.

 

Rubbish. Palestinians understand that as long as Palestinian civilians are targetted by Israeli state power then acts of terrorism against Israeli citizens are understandable.

Neither state nor non-state terror is justified.

 

israel never targets non-combatant civilians.

 

What about the huge numbers of dead women and children???

 

Hamas should stop operating in densely populated areas, hospitals, schools, and UN civilian shelters.

If Hamas only operated in areas where civilians didn't live, no civilians would ever die.

 

Rubbish, state power is directed at the entire populace, whole communities suffer from blockade and settlements.

 

maybe Hamas should stop firing from people's neighborhoods and storing weapons in schools and hospitals.

 

So those 4 children playing football on the beach were combatants?


It's quiet obvious Israel targets civilians all the time. It's not just from the example I stated above. It's also when you read that Israel destroyed houses where they think people working for hamas live in. That is just an other way of saying the jewish apartheid state tried to kill the entire family of a person they suspect to be working for Hamas without knowing at all that their target was present.

That's how they make excuses how it is justified to massacre civillians.
And you're just parrotting what they say.


Care to explain to all of us, that it's not some racist collective punishement when the Jewish state destroyed the sewage plant of the Arabs?

Maybe the Israeli Jews should stop voting in a regime that ethnically cleanses the WB in their name.
Maybe the Israeli Jews should stop helping out the institude that does the ethnic cleansing.
Maybe the israeli Jews should stop supporting the above.
Maybe the israeli Jews should give back what they stole from people for being Arabs.

You aint innocent when you support, take part in, benefit from racist warcrimes.
You're rahter a valid target.

 

More anti-Israel lies. Does your hate make you feel good.

 

The Israelis destroyed 1400 homes.. Families were fleeing to shelters like mosques, schools and hospitals.. Think it thru.... and think it thru in terms of Jewish families fleeing the Nazis in any way they could manage.

 

see this :


http://www.politicalforum.com/middle-east/368597-another-israels-biggest-lies-exposed.html
and this :

Exposing the LIE About Hamas Using Palestinian Human Shields



“In several cases Israeli soldiers used [Palestinian] civilians, including children, as ‘human shields’.” ...when the Israeli Supreme Court ruled in 2005 that the Israeli military had to stop using Palestinian civilians as human shields, the Israeli “defense” establishment objected to the ruling...

This reveals two important things: the first is the moral hypocrisy and chutzpah on display when Israel ignores its own use of human shields as it accuses its enemies of using them. The second is Israel’s self-contradicting logic: If Palestinian militants had such disregard for Palestinian civilian lives, why was the Israeli military so invested in maintaining the ability to use Palestinians as shields? The fact that the Israeli army wants to use Palestinian human shields actually proves that they believe Palestinian militants prefer not to endanger their own civilians.

Collective punishment or human shields? Israel’s military has no “moral superiority,” time for media to cover Gaza fairly!

The civilian death toll in Gaza is immoral and unacceptable -- and it's time to talk honestly about all of it!

Human Rights Watch, on Israel’s Conduct

After conducting an investigation, Human Rights Watch (HRW) issued a report on Wednesday accusing Israel of carrying out “unlawful” strikes in Gaza, ones that “either did not attack a legitimate military target or attacked despite the likelihood of civilian casualties being disproportionate to the military gain.” It noted that “Such attacks committed deliberately or recklessly constitute war crimes.” HRW Middle East Director Sarah Leah Whitson also added that Israel’s actions raise “serious questions as to whether these attacks are intended to target civilians or wantonly destroy civilian property.”



The report also said that “Human Rights Watch has documented numerous serious violations of the laws of war by Israeli forces in the past decade, particularly indiscriminate attacks on civilians,” and criticized Israel’s preposterously inadequate efforts at “warning” civilians of impending strikes. Now, which part of all that fits with “exemplary” efforts at avoiding killing civilians? Still, some may buy into Israel’s allegation that Hamas’s use of human shields is what’s responsible for the high civilian death toll. Let’s look at the evidence.

Human Shields

While human rights organizations haven’t yet addressed “human shields” allegations in the ongoing round of Israel-Gaza violence, they did after the 2009 round when Israel killed at least773 Palestinian civilians, compared to three Israeli civilian casualties (a ratio of 257:1), and used the same “human shields” argument to deflect responsibility for those deaths. When the dust settled, Amnesty International investigated the matter and concluded that there was “no evidence that [Palestinian] rockets were launched from residential houses or buildings while civilians were in these buildings.” More attention-worthy was the report’s note that,

Israel’s Use of Human Shields

By contrast, the same report found that “in several cases Israeli soldiers also used [Palestinian] civilians, including children, as ‘human shields’.” Going back in time just a little further to put this into context is important: when the Israeli Supreme Court ruled in 2005 that the Israeli military had to stop using Palestinian civilians as human shields, the Israeli “defense” establishment objected to the ruling. The appeal against the ruling failed, and the practice remains technically illegal, but Israel implicitly encourages it to continue by offering an “inadequate … slap on the wrist,” as Human Rights Watch put it, to Israeli soldiers caught using this reprehensible tactic.

This reveals two important things: the first is the moral hypocrisy and chutzpah on display when Israel ignores its own use of human shields as it accuses its enemies of using them. The second is Israel’s self-contradicting logic: If Palestinian militants had such disregard for Palestinian civilian lives, why was the Israeli military so invested in maintaining the ability to use Palestinians as shields? The fact that the Israeli army wants to use Palestinian human shields actually proves that they believe Palestinian militants prefer not to endanger their own civilians.


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I posted:

So those 4 children playing football on the beach were combatants?


It's quiet obvious Israel targets civilians all the time. It's not just from the example I stated above. It's also when you read that Israel destroyed houses where they think people working for hamas live in. That is just an other way of saying the jewish apartheid state tried to kill the entire family of a person they suspect to be working for Hamas without knowing at all that their target was present.

That's how they make excuses how it is justified to massacre civillians.
And you're just parrotting what they say.


Care to explain to all of us, that it's not some racist collective punishement when the Jewish state destroyed the sewage plant of the Arabs?



Maybe the Israeli Jews should stop voting in a regime that ethnically cleanses the WB in their name.
Maybe the Israeli Jews should stop helping out the institude that does the ethnic cleansing.
Maybe the israeli Jews should stop supporting the above.
Maybe the israeli Jews should give back what they stole from people for being Arabs.

You aint innocent when you support, take part in, benefit from racist warcrimes.
You're rahter a valid target.
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Care to explain what exactly is a lie in the above with an argument?

 

No but mistakes happen in war.

Actually they go out of their way to avoid it...........you are simply lying.

Yes they destroy homes of people who support terrorists? Should they not go after them? If not why not?

Only if you are a bigoted anti-Jewish hate monger.

I haven't seen a massacre of civilians as you say, I see people dying because Hamas uses them a human shields. When fighters stand behind babies to shoot at people, babies may die and that is just that. Where is your outrage when Hamas targets civilians? Or in Syria?

wow really? All you have done is use Hamas buzz words. But please go on.

You understand there is a war going on. You know that Hamas hit a power station in Israel that PROVIDES POWER TO GAZA. Did you attack them.

Since that is not happening they are on it.

???????????????????

Maybe you should get a real education..........

You really are ignorant aren't you.

So if you vote in a terrorist organization that kills both Christians and Muslims under their control, fires rockets into Israel willy nilly hoping to kill children it is all good with you. But if you retaliate against that it is war crime.
Your lying anti-Jewish nonsense should be banned from this discussion but since it won't be I will continue to educate the masses that might think you know what you are talking about.

-----------------------

I just did and you of course will refuse to learn.

 

They bombed schools full with innocent refugees.... 7 times!... 7 times!
To claim they go out of their way to avoid it... is just lying.

Because that is how the Jewish apartheid state massacres innocent Arab civilians who just happen to live there.

When your Jewish apartheid state targets a building that is owned by somebody they want to kill, but got no clue if he is there, bombs it anyways, and so massacres entire innocent families,... than there is no human shield-crap going on. That is just a zionistic lie to sweettalk the massacring.

The Jewish Israeli population votes on political parties who got ethnic cleansing the WB bit by bit on their agenda. Hence the regime does what the population demands for the last decades. The Israeli Jewish population joins the institude that does the ethnic cleansing on a massive scale. The Israeli Jewis show to have no problem to exploit and own stolen property obtained by racist thieving and ethnic cleansing. To portrait those people as "innocent" is a total joke. It makes those people warcriminals, and a valid target to kill. The amount of Israeli Jews who are not part of that is simply negligible small. And if you deny that Israel / Israeli Jews are doing to the Arabs than it's just you showing that your exceptionally fanatic racist that sweettalks warcrimes, just like some nazi's who deny the holocaust took place.

To destroy a sewage plant is applying a policy of collective punishment.
That is making a warcrime during a war.

Nelson Mandela believes using violence to end racist oppression is totally valid. Nelson Mandela is held in absolute high regards. And I support his ideals, and believe the use of deadly force against anybody that is behind racist oppression is valid. And you would be totally with me, if the same group of Arabs in a country were thieving and ethnically cleansing Jews for 60 years. But no doubt you are rather picky, and change your opinion depending on what race makes the warcrimes.

 

The biggest hurdle is for those who love and support Israel is for them to look at the realities of the past 60 years and consider putting themselves in the Palestinians' shoes.. I think they must be afraid to do that. I would hope they would remember that they went to Palestine as desperate refugees seeking sanctuary when the rest of the world would not take them in.

Then we can address morality and justice ...

 

That is not hurdle, it is as good as an impossability. The roots are just way to deep in the culture and religion. As good as everybody can name numerous groups that lobby fanatically and with success that Israel can go forth with ethnic cleansing and thieving land that all countries agree all the time it is not Israeli. Them lobby groups are all over the place in western society, exceptionally vocal, financially powerful.

But asking to name a group of Jews that lobby that Israel must stop that thieving land that everybody agreed is not theirs.... and it becomes exceptionally silent. (they are some though)

That pattern won't change for decades to come.

To troll a bit off topic:
That random Jews anywhere, when confronted to even get attacked over what the only Jewish state on the planet does,... it seems that it never crosses their mind that the reason it happens,.. is because they never do openly and massively oppose the warcrimes committed by Israel ever, while the only absolute massive Jewish PR that is around, is a PR that Jews support those warcrimes,.. even to the point that billions of taxes flow towards Israel so they can do what they do.

What is a person to make of this, and that community?

 

Well.. they should look their morality and their religious beliefs right in the eye.

 

And hateful Arab mobs killed and beat us in Palestine, cause they too didn't want Jews.