Anti LGBT Mindset: Why are YOU against gay rights? READ MOD WARNING IN OP BEFORE POST

Mod edit: The personal attacks in this thread have gotten completely out of control. This is a general warning to everyone in the thread. From the time stamp on this edit going forward, any personal attacks will be subject to infraction without further warning, and banning from the thread.

There have been many threads on this forum about homosexuality and LGBT rights. Some might say too many, and therefore I always hesitate to start a new one. Whenever I have something to say I first see if there is an existing thread where it would be appropriate to post it. However, I’ve been thinking about the issue of why some people are so against allowing LGBT people have the same rights and there does not seem to be anything about that right now. Notice that I did not say homophobic or bigoted. Those are loaded words and I’m hoping that by not labeling people, we can set different and more civil tone, while possibly learning something about each other and even ourselves. I am truly curious- even fascinated by the lengths that people will go to, in order to justify inequality.

Those of you who know me, know that I am a strong advocate for gay rights. Many other straight people are loyal allies to the LGBT community so I am not unique, although I will admit that I am “very into” the issue. While I write about other political issues from a liberal perspective, I focus on gay LGBT issues because-in part- it is the issue that I am the surest about . I am more certain that I am right about equality for all people than I ever have been about anything in this life. Maybe it’s because I’ve been a progressive from the dawn of my political awareness and opposed oppression and discrimination long before LGBT issues were even on the radar-and can’t imagine being against equality for anyone. Maybe it’s because I’m envious of people are able to be more flexible and adventurous in their sexual lifestyle. For instance, think about the fact that bisexual people have twice as many prospects open to them as others-gay and straight-do. However, having come up in a time when homosexuality was absolutely taboo, my heterosexuality is all too well ingrained in me. Yes, as adamant as I am about gay rights, I really can’t see myself having sex with another man. Maybe my support of gay rights is because I’m naturally rebellious and always have gone against the grain on social and political issues. Maybe it’s all of the above.

Now that I’ve shared, I hope that others will also. I realize that those opposed to equality feel equally as strongly. What I don’t know or understand is why. Nor do I have a sense of the extent to which they have self-awareness of their reasons. I hope that those who are opposed to equality can help me understand where they are coming from. True, it’s highly unlikely that anyone will convince me that their opposition to equality has merit. At the same time, I don’t expect that I will change anyone’s mind either. However, by better understanding the aversion to homosexuality and LGBT rights, we can have a more civil and productive conversation about the issue.

To kick off the conversation, I thought that I would share this very interesting article that should provoke some thoughts on the subject. Please, let’s keep it civil and rational and try to honest. Does any of this ring true to you?

This is also from the article. I’m really interested in knowing which of these characteristics describes the folks here who are anti equality:

 

You know what you'll get from those "antipathetic to gay rights"?


"I'm not against gay rights...I'm against SPECIAL rights for gays."

("Special" rights meaning being treated like any heterosexual citizens. IOW, if gays accept second class status, the homophobes won't object to them being open or want to hang them or anything.)

 

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Accepting 2nd class citizenship won't shut up the homophobes either. The bigots want the gays to disappear. I just thought that I would experiment with this in the hope that someone would be reasonable and honest. Oh well

 

Consider this from the OP:

 

How come it's always rights and not lefts?

 

I would really like to get your reaction to this other discussion Progressive Patriot?

Do you already know who Rabbi Yonassan Gershom is?

http://rooster613.blogspot.ca/2012/08/vote-romney-ryan-and-kill-planet.html

"Vote Romney-Ryan and Kill the Planet!"


http://www.politicalforum.com/gay-lesbian-rights/380595-g-ds-agenda-gay-community.html

G-d's Agenda for the Gay Community?!



Assuming the accuracy of the following two paragraphs...… what specifically would G-d/ HaShem/ YHWH/ The G-d of Abraham be planning to do through the Gay Community?


http://www.near-death.com/andreason.html#a11

Obviously..... one of the things that our Creator wishes to do through the Gay Community..... is to create a whole new world in which there....."would never be one single wisecrack or hurtful remark made ever again"... is expanded and expanded and expanded to all groups and communities on earth?!

I think?!

 

Tram Law.... what do you personally think of Americans printing up local currencies and using them to partly finance documentary and reality film projects aimed partly at addressing some of the problems that Americans are facing?

I believe that the community of Ithaca, New York have given us an example of how much can be accomplished through local currencies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ithaca_Hours

 

Ask the Founders why they didn't refer to the first 10 Amendments as the "Bill of Wrongs"?

 

I'm not against charity, but, there's one big huge problem with money in America today.

It's called FIAT money.

It's called that because it is not backed by gold or other precious gems and minerals.

So that means that the government through the Federal reserve, is printing completely useless money, except for that what put faith into.

And there's a huge problem with printing valueless money. there is actually a historical proof of that.

Before Germany became a Nazi controlled country, it was printing worthless money. That's what led to the economic depression it suffered and what allowed Hitler to draw upon.

 

I'm at a loss. Please explain what the demands are of these folks. I can't decipher the message they are sending

[video=youtube;_VjkElGhwxk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VjkElGhwxk[/video]

 

Can I just say DennisTate, that you are absolutely awesome? you are SPOT ON in your views on spiritualism. I can really relate to them. Spiritually, God, our universal process, recognises love and light... Gender is a human construct.

When God sees us loving one another, it sees us as swirling lights interacting together and shining stronger as one.

 

These people are the universe's response to the hatred that they've been subjected to... It's absolutely natural that those exposed to people who are intolerant of them will protest against it and shout their freedom from the rooftops. The very idea that people challenging the status quo outrages you is proof to them that they are justified in fighting the good fight.

The fact this annoys you justifies it's existence, because said annoyance is totally illogical.

 

you got all of that from the fairy wings?

 

I don't think people should be granted special rights and privileges simply because they claim to be "gay".

 

what special rights do you think gay people are asking for?

 

Marrying someone of the same gender is one example.

 

How is asking for the ability to marry the person they love a special right?

 

It wouldn't be special heterosexuals can marry somebody of the same sex too if they wanted.

 

"Claim to be gay" ? Seriously? Do you "claim to be heterosexual? What alternate universe do you reside in? Do you know nothing about sexual orientation ? Do you not know that numerous courts have ruled the issue is in fact equality? Equal protection under the law. Got that? The same right to marry the one of your choosing. Peace

 

It would appear from a subsequent post that you nailed it.

 

I don't think that people should get special rights and privileges simply by claiming to be gay, either.

However, your subsequent example has nothing to do with your original statement. Marrying someone of the same gender doesn't require any sort of claim about one's orientation. Same-sex couples aren't asking for any special rights and privileges. They're asking for the same rights and privileges as opposite-sex couples. Whether or not the parties involved identify as 'gay', 'bi', 'straight' or anything else should have no bearing on whom they're able to contract with in forming a marriage. Nor should the gender of the parties involved.

The reason we have bans on same-sex marriage are all about preserving special rights and privileges for opposite-sex couples. Those bans are all about preventing same-sex couples from enjoying any similar status for their relationships, and that comes straight from one of the author's of my state's amendment, which bans not only legal same-sex marriage, but civil unions, domestic partnerships, or any other agreement that is not marriage between one man/one woman. Clever wording of the amendments, and claims that it was about 'preserving' 'traditional marriage' don't fool those of us who have been the targets of anti-gay rhetoric since long before it extended into talking about banning us from marriage.

I don't want special rights for being gay. I want the equal rights I am due as an American citizen, including my right to contract with the person of my choosing in marriage, without the barriers erected in the law that have no rational basis and whose real purpose is to keep me marginalized, while preserving special rights for people who think they and their relationships are superior to mine.

 

MAR'RIAGE, n. [L.mas, maris.] The act of uniting a man and woman for life; wedlock; the legal union of a man and woman for life.

 

That's impossible.

It seems to me that you people like you don't even know what the meaning of the word "marriage". And if you do, you want to change the meaning.

Why should we corrupt our language simply because a tiny minority of people are disgusting perverts?

 

Try using a legal dictionary such as Black's



or Merriam Webster

Marriage - a (1) : the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law (2) : the state of being united to a person of the same sex in a relationship like that of a traditional marriage - http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/marriage?show=0&t=1417030124

or even look to the origins of the word marriage;

Marriage from Vulgar Latin *maritaticum (11c.), from Latin maritatus, past participle of maritatre "to wed, marry, give in marriage"

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there is no corruption, even the origins of the word marriage do not mention anything about one man and one woman .. do yourself a favor . .educate yourself.

 

No he got all that by what you posted!
It never ceases to amaze me how those who seek to discriminate think that the particular cause they wish to propagate is somehow different from all the other forms of discrimination in history. The same old arguments get wheeled out, I well remember pictures of aboriginal people carrying spears being shown with captions like "do you want this man living next to you?" When women were fighting for the right to vote the same sort of schoolboy tactic was used.



Remind anyone of an old avatar?