How would you fight the Islamic State?

Discussion in 'Terrorism' started by Clausewitz, Feb 25, 2015.

  1. Clausewitz

    Clausewitz Active Member

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    I advocate we adopt a strategy of clear, transition, deter.

    The US can deploy expeditionary forces to clear areas held by IS, such as Mosul, and immediately transition it to the nearest ally/any force not part of the salafi/takhfiri jihadist umbrella or Iran's proxies. The final step is to deter future attacks by never showing reluctance to clear and transition additional areas, even if it is the same location over and over again. The idea is to fight the long war in a more sustainable way that is both demoralizing to the enemy, while removing an additional reason for the insurgency to grow (ie occupying force here to stay).

    What would you do?
     
  2. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Impeach and convict Barack Obama and put a competent CnC in the White House.

    Reinstate Gen. Mattis and some other flag officers who actually know how to fight a war who were purged by Obama and put them in charge of dealing with ISIS.

    Fight the war "smart." High technology weapons platforms are to expensive and it's unsunstainable, spending a trillion dollars to fight two low intensity wars (Iraq and Afghanistan) was stupid.

    Hellfire missiles, Tomahawk cruise missiles, etc. have little phycological affect on demoralizing the enemy.

    PORK, use pork as a weapon against ISIS, Al Qaeda and all radical Islamist. American soldiers and Marines used bacon against the Muslim Moros during the Philippine Insurrection successfully. You grab any Muslim by the balls, his hearts and minds will follow. The only thing Islam respects is the sword, brute force.

    Keep lawyers off the battlefield and no PC rules of engagement that favors the enemy and causes American troops to bleed and die on the battlefield like Obama did in Afghanistan with his PC rules of engagement.
     
  3. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    I actually came up with an alternate plan last September when I realized that the President was just going to stall until he gets out of office.

    Patching up Obama’s ISIS War Plans
     
  4. Strasser

    Strasser Banned

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    Bush W. failed to realize the lessons of WW II, and the success we had over Japan and Germany; we stayed there for generations, not a few years, and we fundamentally changed their entire political culture and institutions. To do that with Islamic countries, you have to eliminate Islam from their culture, totally; Islam is a political cult, like Nazism, and has to be dealt with like Nazism was dealt with. Nobody has the stomach for that, or the long-term will, so you're left with fear and certain destruction as a motivator. If they don't fear you, they will screw you over and kill you.

    George H. Bush also failed to learn the lessons of WW II, when he backed off from demanding total and unconditional surrender from Saddam Hussein's govt. and military forces.We even force this mistake on allies, like the Israelis and their wars with Egypt and other Arab countries. And all there is to show for it is a rise in violence and gangsterism, not only in the ME but all over the place. Eithe be a real hegemon or get out of the business and let the rest of the planet reduce itself to retrograde warlord states and medeival stagnation, and be prepared to use your military even more than it otherwise would be necessary. Hegemony is cheaper in the long run.
     
  5. axialturban

    axialturban Well-Known Member

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    Set up a base in the middle of it, let them come at me, and crush any who try. When they stop, just pack up and bugger off... bring back the concept of the 'Fort'. So then the Navy's job becomes standoff reinforcement, USMC sets up, operates from while Army rotates through as well, while AF does what it does from wherever it does it as usual.
     
  6. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    part of me says we should do NOTHING about them, as our stupid invasion of Iraq caused the whole mess in the first place.

    maybe we need to let the Middle East sort itself out.
     
  7. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    It's startling to me that this thread gets so many who think we can do stuff like change their religion, carry out mass relocations of civilians and the other nonsense.

    We need to recognize that our anti terrorism machinery was created to fight terrorism. And, while ISIS uses terrorism, they are not pure terrorists. They have government structure, are administering the needs of people in the areas they hold, are able to raise funds by taxation, by selling oil, etc.

    We're not going to have a solution unless we figure out a future for the 20M Sunnis in Iraq and those in Syria - a future that Sunnis find to be worth fighting for.

    When we support the Iraqi government all we're doing is attempting to subjugate the 20 million Sunnis to the Shiite militias, the Iraqi military that has been killing Sunnis since 2005, and a government where Sunni representation is not allowed.


    So, I think your idea is better than all the rest on this thread, and is undoubtedly better than what we're doing right now, too.
     
  8. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    we created the conditions for ISIS to emerge.

    maybe its time for us to leave the Middle East alone.

    its not like ISIS is much worse than the Saudis.
     
  9. cane cutter

    cane cutter New Member

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    We employ maximum violence and destroy them so terribly that, "jihad", becomes a dirty word within the Muslim Community. The same way, "zeig heil", became a dirty word in post-war Germany

    - - - Updated - - -

    ISIS originated in Syria, not Iraq.
     
  10. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    wrong, again:

    The group originated as Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad in 1999, which was renamed Tanzim Qaidat al-Jihad fi Bilad al-Rafidayn—commonly known as al-Qaeda in Iraq (AQI)—when the group pledged allegiance to al-Qaeda in 2004

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISIS
     
  11. william walker

    william walker New Member

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    I am seeing much whining, but not much geostrategy on this thread.

    Three nations matter in this Turkey, Iran and US. So the US strategy must be to draw Iran and Turkey into the Northern corridor and balance each other out in the region. With the US manipulating and supporting both sides. This would be the ideal outcome from the US, ISIL being destroyed by Turkey and Iran. However there is a difference in Turkey and Iran. Iran wants to the US gone from the region, where as Turkey wants to the US more involved so Turkey doesn't have a conflict with Iran. Things have been good for Turkey with economic growth, peace deal with the PKK, infrastructure projects being planned, a strong presidential role, military technology improvements, Russia weak, Iran contained, Europe in economic crisis. Now however things are starting to move with Russia being more assertive, Iran and the US working together in Iraq, Europe's crisis has became a depression in the Mediterranean, growth has slowed, civil protest's, infrastructure plan's scaled back, Kurdish fighting ISIL and gaining greater independence in Syria and Iraq.

    The question is does the US facilitate Turkey and give in to some of what Turkey wants so Turkey moves sooner or does the US wait and allow Turkey to take its time.

    So on the question of the threat I would give Turkey some of what they want, I would give tacit support for the creation of a buffer in Northern Syria while saying it is a poor idea, I wouldn't block it. Then I would allow Iran to do more in Iraq and support Iran in this. I would cut down the US military operations over time forcing Turkey to increase its capabilities to make up for it. Turkey will likely in the end use ISIL against Iran and keep Assad in power. Iran will have power in the Shia area's of Iraq and be able to threaten Saudi Arabia. Then you have in between the Turkish and Iranian parts an ungoverned area with tribes and terrorist groups going about their business. In time Iran and Turkey will be forced into a conflict for this area in which I would expect the US to arm both sides and use its navy to take limited actions, plus protect world trade.

    So to sum up ISIL no longer an issue, US out of the Northern corridor, with Iran and Turkey balancing each others power in the region.

    I must also add that this area Iraq, Syria and Lebanon can not be ruled by a nation states, it must be part of a greater empire to work. The Persian Empire, the Caliphate or the Ottoman Empire.
     
  12. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    In other words, a return to the 18th, maybe 19th, ( I am really woefully uninformed on the Persians in the 1800s) centuries.

    One problem is that the Arab nations are not about to welcome the return of Turkish masters. I don't think either the West or the Arabs really want a caliphate but Nasser's idea, a pan-Arab Union of secular but Arab states, (unified and kept culturally Arab by Islam) might work

    Why are you against the idea of smaller nations, one for each ethnicity? In the West we have had a standard opposition against "Balkanization" since WWI, that is true, But few historians today accept the simplistic notion that this process was what really started the Great War and, strangely, what now seems a viable solution to the small states shatter zone conundrum is, in fact, the Balkans themselves.

    My god no. The Balkans can be seen as a success story of multiculturalism or they might be viewed as a congeries of small states that are kept from tearing each other apart by US troops sitting on them. Could it be that George Bush's vision of Iraq's role as a Western policeman in the area was right after all? :eekeyes: Please, tell me there is an alternative I'm not seeing.
     
  13. Pregnar Kraps

    Pregnar Kraps New Member Past Donor

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    Whatever I did I would also explain to the world's free peoples that Terrorism is like the tip of the iceberg you can most easily see.

    But the danger of the iceberg which lays below the surface of the ocean, just as in this case, Stealth Jihad goes on beneath the radar of the media, is part and parcel of the over all threat of icebergs and of Islam.

    And perhaps Stealth Jihad is even MORE dangerous than terrorism because it is largely unseen and thus less protected against.
     
  14. cane cutter

    cane cutter New Member

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  15. MTV

    MTV Banned at Members Request

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    You dont need to do anything extra to destroy ISIS, just do not fund them.
     
  16. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  17. cane cutter

    cane cutter New Member

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    They invaded Iraq from Syria. IOW, they weren't IN Iraq. Why is that so hard to understand?
     
  18. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    they came from Iraq. they started in Iraq.

    why is that soo hard to grasp?
     
  19. william walker

    william walker New Member

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    Who is going to run the Pan-Arab state? Where is its economic core? Pan-Arabism has always been an American dream with no basis in reality. That reality being the two main powers in the Muslim world are Iran and Turkey. The only way something like that could work is within an Empire. Be it the Arab Caliphate, Ottoman Empire or Persian Empire.

    The Balkans is an mountainous area caught between Turkey, Italy, Austria and Russia. It just isn't the same a the desert of Iraq and Syria.
     
  20. J0NAH

    J0NAH Banned

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    turkey would be the economic core and expansion from there, its a good base and very fertile ground around, moving on up to the slavs and balkan states, ukraine and also down to syria and parts of Iraq. these places need Islam especially the european ones, they have no significance in the world atm, these balkan and slav states.
     
  21. Pax Aeon

    Pax Aeon Well-Known Member

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  22. axialturban

    axialturban Well-Known Member

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    Formed versus founded. They become what they are today in Syria, but their roots were from Iraq. The IS formed in the vacuum created within the Syrian Civil War, and has nothing to do with the US involvement in Iraq beyond being a franchise of Jihad which happened to emerge within Iraq initially - but that is not where the IS 'formed' so you cannot blame the US for anything except its lack of commitment to Syria. Obama let the ball down badly on Syria when he should have learnt his lesson from letting the ball down in Libya. He is so bad at being President, he treats it like a press club.
     
  23. cane cutter

    cane cutter New Member

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    Right! They weren't in Iraq anymore. They got their asses kicked out of Iraq.
     
  24. tkolter

    tkolter Well-Known Member

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    1. Get a UN status they are a terror state and guilty of crimes against humanity.

    2. Ask CHINA as a fellow superpower to commit to the attack with us and our allies likely England and France.

    3. Hit them with a massive combined force handing to China any prisoners of interrogation value.

    4. Split up Iraq into an independent KURDISTAN and two religious parts keep Baghdad as a free city with a permanent US/CHINA/ALLIED presence.

    5. Syria once ISIL is eliminated leave when the government stabilizes with a joint task force there until withdrawal is sensible.

    We can ask China in and get them IF we make it a case of humanitarian crimes like they suffered in WW2 and as a peer power. And combined we could deploy a devastating force and show the world we are united as one moral force for good.
     
  25. DarkDaimon

    DarkDaimon Well-Known Member

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    "I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure." - Ripley

    I've always wanted to use that quote! :D
     

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