How WWI changed soldiers and the world...

I hate to to disappoint you if you were looking for an explanation, but that's actually what I'm looking for. I've seen a lot of specific examples of how individuals were so radically shaped by the war, and it isn't difficult to see some big picture changes (fall of monarchies, rapid rise of socialism, communism, etc.), but I'm looking more for direct connections that might explain it on some big picture bit. To what degree did the experience change those who fought in it and, by extension, the countries they returned to?

If anyone knows of any particular good sources on this, that'd be superb.

 

IMO WWI was the moment when the world became global. Prior to that, we were a collection of sovereign, mostly separate nation states. In the war, people from all corners of the British Empire went to fight the Germans. Significant portions of their population in many cases. The turn of the century already got people thinking that they could reform the world through theft and welfare, WWI made them militantly dedicated to this cause.

The League of Nations is a decent example: people were willing to avoid a repeat of the war at all costs - including through a global government. That project thankfully failed, but was resurrected in the UN, and US global hegemony in the late 20th century.

[hr][/hr]

WWI started the move toward global government.

 

The world was global before WW1. In fact, the world being global was what lead people to believe in the years prior to WW1 that there would never be a large war again.

 

IMO, war changes young men into adults early. Without war, men mature in their 40's. From the men that committed atrocities during the rape of Nanking to the young men fighting Nazi's, they all came back to become upstanding citizens that advanced their own cultures.

 

If becoming alcoholics and wife beaters is being mature, sure.

 

You mistake those that enter service with problems to begin with to those that don't. Maybe you had a problem with your father. I don't know.

 

You're the one claiming that all soldiers come back as upstanding members of society.

 

Plenty of examples. Maybe you are blind to them.

 

So all of them, even the ones who come back completely destroyed by their experiences, who turn to drink and drugs, who beat their wives and children, who live on the streets because they're unable to hold down a job, etc, etc, etc? ALL OF THEM?

 

Please relate your personal experience.

 

Has what to do with the topic at hand?

 

But back then (WWl ) they drafted older men, those in their mid and late 20's and even in their 30's. Same was true during WW ll, they started with the older men and worked their way down to the 19 year old by mid or late 1944. Vietnam was the first war America fought with teenagers. The draft laws were changed during the early or mid 60's.

 

Your claims. I am sure you can back them up with personal experience, right?

 

Even then, I know lot's of Vietnam vets, including myself, that go on to be very productive members of society. What I find is that those that entered the military with problems, exit the military with problems.

 

WW l ended the era of aristocracy societies in Europe and brought an end to many monarchies.

But WW ll was just a continuation of WW l. All the blame lays on the frogs.

 

You're making the claim that ALL soldiers come back as upstanding members of society. This is a bull(*)(*)(*)(*) claim and you know it.

- - - Updated - - -

And people who use their own personal experiences of something and try to apply it to a whole are usually wrong.

 

His claim is broad - meaning that not "all soldiers come back as upstanding citizens" but that those who go to war mature earlier and "are more likely than they otherwise would have been to be upstanding citizens."

Clarified as such, do you still disagree with that statement? You of course don't have to, but I am hoping for more than a simple negation but rather a counter view with support. A simple negation isn't helpful to me.

 

My mistake, 'all' was a generality.

 

It was just another liberal lie that Vietnam vets became druggies, losers, criminals and homeless.

Most Vietnam vets after their tour of duty went on living normal lives, many earning a college degree, getting married, having kids and paying more than their fare share in taxes.

Just about every Vietnam vet I went to school with and most that I personally know have college degrees and the majority are making six figures a year and are very successful. Can't think of one who resorted to crime or ended up in prison or was ever homeless. The vast majority were raised in a Democrat family but the majority are Republicans today.

Makes sense, why would someone vote for the political party who sent you to war and then back stabbed you while you were still on the battlefield in Vietnam ?

 

My childhood friend wanted to go to Vietnam but ended up in Leavenworth. Why did he want to go to Vietnam? Because that is where the drugs were. He went on to hold a job and have a family but his early choices were what formed his later less than successful life.

 

Levenworth !!! Did he get a Big Chicken Dinner ?

Your and my experiences may differ some compared to those who fought during WW l or those who fought in WW ll between 1941 -43, these were mostly grown men in their mid 20 to their late 30's. The teenagers didn't start showing up in big numbers until 1944.

The Vietnam War was different, I think the average age of an American who served in-country was 19 or 20. One matures really quick in combat when you are young. First thing you learn, Hollywood are a bunch of liars and you ask, why didn't my father who served during WW ll tell me ?

One thing I noticed, you just don't mature quickly but down the road you prematurely start graying. A buddy of mine was just coming in-country when I was leaving in 1970. By the time he was 36, he was mostly gray. I only had a few gray hairs showing around the temple. Then one day I woke up in the morning and looked in the mirror and said, (*)(*)(*)(*), I'm mostly have gray and I'm only 42 years old !

So I started paying more attention to the other Vietnam vets, they also were prematurely graying unlike those who didn't serve.

 

I was just thinking, Leavenworth back then was a "red line" military prison. Military red line stockades and red line brigs turned losers into some of the most productive law abiding people in society. But if they couldn't change you in a red line stockade or red line brig, your life will probably be a total cluster (*)(*)(*)(*).

During the late 1970's liberals labeled red line military prisons to be politically incorrect. You know how the left thinks, if it works, it must be obsolete and politically incorrect.

 

Returned soldiers are known for having quite a lot of trouble fitting back into society.

 

Yup, but that's really a non answer. It's true but doesn't answer the question in any meaningful way. Do you believe that soldiers typically are less mature when they come back than they would have been if they were never in? Do you think they are less likely to be productive members of society than they otherwise would have been?

 

That's just another liberal lie that they try to push on society.

Have you ever heard of Gen. "Mad Dog" Jim Mattis ? He was considered the best combat general in the entire U.S. military and Valerie Jarrett had Obama fire him for political reasons so they say.