Trumps Wall Can we spend a few minutes to think about the details of Trumps impenetrable wall? When you read this, agree or not, please think about whether Trump has thought this through. He is a smart guy so he must have done so. I suggest that if he has, he is disqualified to on the basis of his morals. If he has not thought it through, he is disqualified on the basis of incompetence. · Two thousand miles of wall. Not fence. He says we really only need one thousand miles of wall but why would a partial wall make any sense at all? So we will use the full 2000 miles but if you would rather think about it as half or that, just reduce the costs below by 50%. · The current border fence which covers about 600 miles cost about $5.6 million per mile. If the wall could be built for the same cost as a fence, that would be $11.2 Billion. An actual wall which needs to be several stories tall is estimated to cost between three and seven hundred billion dollars. But Trump says he can build a beautiful wall 45 feet tall for much less. We can use his figure but it, like so much he says, is likely to be just off the top of his head. Trump at different times has said that the construction or it would cost 8, 10 or 16 Billion. Lets use the middle figure for now. · We need to think about whether the wall will be able to accomplish its goal. Since 40% of all illegal immigrants came into the country on valid visas and then stayed on past the expiration dates, only 60% might be subject to the walls impediment to travel. Some of those may have come over the northern borders or may have arrived on our shores via boats. Strangely, since the economy in Mexico was the most prevalent reason for Mexican citizens to come the the USA, the improving economy there (unless a trade war erases those gains) prompts fewer to attempt the trip now than at other times in the past. In fact, it appears that the net migration to the USA from Mexico and Central America is now negative. In other words, more are leaving this country than are coming in. Trump promises a big beautiful door so that outflow should not be impeded. Without offending or disappointing the throngs who hoot and howl every time he says We will build a wall, I wonder whether there is any purpose to the wall at all. We can put logic aside to go on with this analysis of costs. o The wall will need powerful lighting at night. The lights will illuminate hundreds of yards in to the south. Perhaps the power for the lighting and other functions will be generated by solar panels since the border area has an abundance of sunlight so we do not have to calculate a cost. o From space at night, this wall will be the most prominent man-made structure on the planet. While this would be a notable thing otherwise, will we point with pride to that fact given the dark events that will occur at this wall? That it separates the USA from a formerly peaceful ally will not make it more attractive. o While it will be the largest man made object on the planet, we are unlikely to attract tourists to see it. · The wall would require human staffing. These border guards will need perches upon which they can stand to observe activity on the approach to the wall. These perches may take the form of guard towers. They probably need to be closer but for now, lets assume that they are about one mile apart. The two thousand guard towers would require two guards per shift for three shifts per day. This works out to 12,000 guards. The numbers will expand to cover training status, vacation coverage, HR support, management etc. I round the total wall staffing to 15,000. Assuming that the cost for salaries and benefits in current dollars is about $60,000 each, that portion of the financial impact is $900 million per year. Over twenty years it is 18 billion in uninflated dollars. o Please consider now that you have a wall, what these guards will be doing. If people approach the wall at locations other than authorized checkpoints, will the guards merely warn them away with announcements on the PA system? It may be likely that they will have authority to repel these desperate invaders with the use of force. Form your own mental picture. The existence of a guarded wall implies that force will be used. (I cannot help but remember the images of East German Guards machine gunning East Germans trying to escape. ) · The wall would need to be constructed some distance from the actual border in order to accommodate the roads required for construction and daily body sweep up, the actual construction and the actual terrain in the area. In addition, the effectiveness of the wall requires a clear zone or no-mans land on the southern approach so that the guards and electronic equipment can see any attempt to reach the wall. That space would need to be several hundred yards wide. · The effort to build this wall cannot begin until the land required is under control if not ownership of the Federal government. Indeed, some of it may already be in Federal control but lets calculate based on the possibility that all of it must be obtained from somewhere else. So we have the need of at least 145,000 acres on the southern side and probably about half as much as much on the northern side. If we do not also have to acquire land from the edge of the no-mans land to the border, we must acquire rights to about 220, 000 acres. Note that since the land south of the no-mans land to the border will have no value, it too will need to be acquired. There will be years of effort to acquire the land rights since most of it is now in private hands. I have no idea of the value of the land but if it is an average of $25,000 per acre that is another $5.5 billion. Huge numbers of court actions will require legal expenses as well. We have no good estimate for this so we can use one thousand per acre as a place keeper. That is just another $220 million. No other Federal land acquisition of this size has occurred in modern times. It is likely to be much more expensive. · The cost for the actual wall is only a part of the cost. A road that can handle twenty ton trucks will need to be constructed for the project. Conservatively lets say that is just $50,000 per mile for an unpaved road. That is just $100 million more. · Maintenance per year will likely be in the one billion range. · Total costs o Staffing -20 years -$18,000,000,000 o Maintenance 20 years -$20,000,000,000 o Land Acquisition costs - $5,500,000,000 o Wall construction -$10,000,000,000 o Legal costs - $ 220,000,000 o Road Construction - $100,000,000 Total -$53,820,000,000 · By definition, nothing can get through to the other side of an impenetrable wall. Someone will need to decide about the environmental impact of that kind of wall. A project of this size and impact is unprecedented. I suspect that decades of court cases, studies and protests will occur. Of course we must shine a bit of light on the idea that no wall is really impenetrable. With proper motivation paths around, under and over will be found. Regardless of that truth, it will be significantly more difficult for people to get themselves and contraband into the United States with the wall in place. But we will surely give up on the continued existence of at least some species for the greater good.
Well considering that illegals cost this nation roughly 100 billion per year and committ dozens of murders I'd say it's worth it. http://abcnews.go.com/Business/illegal-immigrants-cost-us-100-billion-year-group/story?id=10699317
Studies have shown that illegal immigrants pay between $90 billion and $140 billion in taxes. Studies have shown that illegal immigrants are less likely to commit crimes than native-born Americans.
Refer to what I cited earlier. on the whole they cost us 100 billion a year. So because native born citizens commit crimes we should just ignore the violent crimes that are committed by people who are here illegally? That's the logic you're going with?
so less than 3 billion per year? Sounds good to me. - - - Updated - - - I believe he is saying net cost, so that would be above and beyond any taxes they pay.
Anyone who says they'er willing to pay $54 billion for a wall that won't even work has no right complaining about the national debt. But there's another issue. Assuming Trump got elected and built a wall, just think of what a symbol of mistrust, xenophobia and immaturity that wall stands for. There are countries in Europe that have bordered many other countries for centuries and they celebrate their shared borders. No walls, no border patrol, just signs of friendship.
it does create a lot of jobs too. Also please post where immigration from mexico and central and south america is at net 0. All I see is the misleading stat by liberals saying net migration of mexico (alone). Which makes sense given that weve shipped so many factories there.
Yes nothing says trust us like Mexico allowing millions of people to sneak over our border from their nation, including drug smugglers. Oh and exactly how are the muslims immigrants in Sweden, UK and Germany showing their friendship? Oh year raping, attacking...... Get real. Non one believes the crap you're selling unless you're in a room full of other whacked out lefty SJWs.
His article does not mention net cost. It only mentions the cost of the various services that illegal immigrants use. You are assuming that it is a net figure. Your article does not support that assertion.
What the government spends building a wall, or pretty much anything that they build, and what an experienced commercial builder spend are vastly different sums, as the commercial builder is motivated by quality and profit which drives effeciency, and the govt. is motivated by mis-management, apathy and cronyism. So, It ain't going to cost but a fraction per mile what the government spent so far per mile. There are Natural barriers that people cannot cross and remain alive. It is a desert you know, so NO, those sections of wall will not need to be built. We have dams that interrupt the flow of natural waterways, yet we put in place fish ladders that allow the wildlife to navigate them with ease. Same problem, same type of fix for the wall, regarding wildlife. The trade imbalance with Mexico is going to be addressed, and that's where the money to build the wall comes from, regardless of Good 'Ol Vicente Fox says about it. Mexico is going to pay, one way or the other. We come from the border, we have family that still lives on the border, both Gringo and Latino, and we know what the problems are REALLY like. Perhaps you live far away, so your fantasy about the "Friendly Cartels" seems nice to you, but the reality is quite ugly down in the Rio Grande Valley. Frankly, if you don't live there, don't suffer from the problem, then kindly shut the frank up already.
Not true, insane people cause murders, and sometimes they use guns to do it. BTW, heard of Belgium lately? How many did they take out again, without guns???????? You might want to think about that before you offer uneducated, biased opinions on our 2nd. Amendment.
I Would prefer a fleet of drones with shoot to kill orders, patrols in armored troop carriers, fencing where feasible, border guards with dogs, sensor stations to detect movement, and land mines. No need for a wall, if Aztec and Mayan barbarians want to cross, well they will become partially Mexican.
You have a murder rate three times that of other nations and a firearm death rate 10 times that of other nations. The USA has more gun deaths per day than the UK has in a year You have more deaths from guns in a week than Paris and Brussels combined THAT is insane
Sorry to bring down the facts, but more Mexican nationals are leaving the US then entering the US. I guess you get your sources from Fox News. You know, the "no go zone" channel. Partisan hacks use the term "SJW".
Some guy guesses and that, for you, is authoritative? People commit crimes for any number of reasons. The reasons they don't commit crimes is because they're illegals.
Sorry dear but you're off by one zero. It's $11 billion, not $100 billion. http://www.itep.org/immigration/
You have more murder by beating and stabbing then we do. What's your point? Are you trying to score points on "it's more moral to stab you than shoot you" grounds? Anyway, the only people getting routinely shot in America are inner city Gang Bangers, and other such assorted trash. You know, it's in the interest of your nations policy makers to give you only a one-sided, distorted version of what our reality actually is over here. The greatest number of gun deaths are in Liberal controlled, supposedly gun free cities, most especially Chicago. So, how is it that in a place where guns are verboten, gun deaths are the highest? Do you think it is the honest, decent citizens that are doing this? No, it's just criminals doing what criminals do, breaking the law. Insane is leaving old folks and single mothers defenseless in the face of overwhelming crime statistics.
I misread my source. Regardless, economists agree that illegal immigration is a net positive for the U.S. economy. "Eighty-five percent of eminent economists surveyed have concluded that illegal immigrants have had a positive (seventy-four percent) or neutral (eleven percent) impact on the U.S. economy." Source
