Is college really necessary in this age?

When what you could learn from professors is readily available online, or a book at Barnes and Noble?

Self-Education quite arguably, is the most powerful form of education there is, much more than any Masters or Doctorate would prove. How so? Anyone can enroll at a college, get in a car and sit through a one-hour lecture, but not everyone has the ability to carry out the discipline and the dedication necessary to self-educate themselves in business, music, or a combination of subjects. What is saved in obscene tuition costs, can be used in attaining the same books, and then some, at a retailer like B&N, not to mention most likely the price cut, over the premium charged at a college bookstore. If I wanted to learn the music business for example, there's no reason why I would have to enroll at UCLA, Full Sail University, or of the like.

I can learn myself verbatim what a professor would be teaching me, same literature, same everything on contracts, publishing, and distribution. Same thing for if I wanted to learn how to run a business. All done myself. We hear about college costs being too obscene, and in all honesty they are, but is college or a university really necessary at all, when 99.9% of it can be done from home, the resources are there, and the tuition isn't a problem.

Discuss.

 

It is not necessary depending on one's field of work, but if you are self-taught with no meaningful work experience, you might as well say "high school drop-out" as far as the seriousness I would give your application. Work experience matters more than formal education either way.

 

try practicing medicine without a degree.... for some things a degree is needed

that said, I do not have a degree and did just fine... but I made sure both of my children had degrees as it definitely gives a child a better chance to succeed in life

 

I have two degrees and never really benefited from having them. The cost and sacrifices made to get both was too much. If I had children I would advise them to avoid college.

 

Necessary? No, but it makes life easier. Look, I can learn xyz and be really good at it, but business wants to KNOW that I know. So just show them? No, thay takes time, esp. To fully test. Then consider the company is so big that the only way someone at the top can really know is by a piece of paper.

It's just how it is. Dude, I could intern with a lawyer and learn on the fly, but would you really prefer a lawyer who didn't go to law school?

 

Hard to answer this one, given the level of idiocy we are seeing on our campuses lately. Between idiot parents and progressive faculty indoctrination, a college degree doesn't mean very much as a measure of knowledge or common sense. They could all become community organizers...? Yes/no? Or maybe start a company that specializes in qualifying things as offensive. They all seem quite good at that.

 

Every day people are brain washed into thinking that college makes you more marketable. But the reality is that wealthy elites profit from bank loans so they make believe all that wasted time and money will pay off in the end. Colleges also own stock in the military industrial complex and refuse to divest themselves of war profits. They are part of the elite right wing establishment that profits from war and treason.


The richest people I have known in my long life never entered a college campus and that was the smartest thing they ever did.

 

I think a college degree is necessary for STEM subjects. Probably OJT is good enough for most of the others. Since college is an investment both of time and money, you need to weigh it against doing something else for that period of time.

 

I do have to ask, how did people learn before there were educational institutions dating back to the early 19th century? Maybe some had apprenticeships, or maybe some took the route of learning themselves. I would argue that work ethic can be demonstrated away or in college. Work ethic and discipline go hand-on-hand, and both are equally valuable. What seems shallow, however, is not the quality of the information one attains, but that employers will not take one seriously unless that knowledge is documented by some institution, and this is sad. Employers should be valuing the knowledge, not a piece of laminated paper with a couple of copy-and-pasted signatures. You may not always want to put in the time to learn the knowledge you're attaining, this discipline can apply whether or not you are self-taught or taught by a professor. It also demonstrates good time management. It is the knowledge employers should be desiring, not proof of a establishment backing that knowledge.

After all, where do the professors get their knowledge, more than likely the same place someone on their own can learn.

For example, if you are learning about the record business, you don't need to waste time taking English or History courses. That will not matter when it comes to negotiating a deal with a artist, or determining their royalties. A good chunk of the electives in college (e.g. calculus) are not necessary, nor pertain to the subject you are learning anyway, so saving yourself the time to focus more on the subjects that will deal directly with the subject at hand. So it can be argued that leaning yourself shows a equal amount of work ethic, discipline, and responsibility that one would have if they were going to an actual educational establishment.

 

I interpret a college degree differently. It merely shows that the kid had good fortune and a chance to obtain a degree. Any dolt with a fair playing field can do college.

Now, if the high school grad had military experience, I'd take him over the pampered college boy any day.

 

You're a pilot correct? Trigonometry as examples the Sine, Cosine and Tangent rules are important for navigation.

SOH-CAH-TOA.

sin = opposite / hypotenuse
cos= adjacent / hypotenuse
tan = opposite / adjacent

The 1 in 60 rule, if you're familiar with that, is useful for quickly determining how much your track is in error if there is drift off.

 

No wonder you can't get a job. You don't understand that English is important to learn--writing is a key to any job that I know of. A college education is more than just a set of direct skills. Knowledge of calculus shows that you understand numbers, and are a hard worker--you can't pass calculus without doing a lot of practice. Just like a musical instrument.

 

Simple math, no harder than division, is really all you need in day to day life. Unless you're an architect, you will rarely, if ever, need the simplest forms of algebra, let alone calculus or trig.

I agree you can't pass, as you used as your example, calculus, without practice. What I was getting at in this thread is discipline and dedication, two of the key aspects any college grad possesses, are both necessary and proven in self-education. You save yourself the premium of tuition, and you get access to the same information you would in a classroom lecture. The same books professors use to conduct their lessons, and their teaching, can be found as easily as at Barnes and Noble, and most likely much less than at a colleges bookstore.

Some subjects, like law or medicine, I'd argue you still need to attend a educational institution for. So educational institutions aren't necessarily on life support-yet. But, quite arguably, 90-95% of the subjects you would normally go to college for, like the sciences, you don't need to go to college for. Law and medicine are the few exceptions to the rule.

 

The problem is proving what you know. Unless your self-employed your going to have to show someone else what you know. Say your a professional cook and have an American Culinary Federation (ADF) certification as a Working Chef but were taught on the job the card you carry proves to anyplace you apply to you have a certain skill set and therefore can be a good worker in a role say a line chef working on meats at a good restaurant. If you learned on your own and had no such credential or did work before but failed to do so your going to have a hard time getting that good job references aside the certification matters its national and standardized and took efforts to get.

I would say perhaps rethinking this is important as in university studies if other options could give the same skills. You can in Germany apprentice in many careers where here a college degree would be normal and expected banking services, retail management and factory work (those modern factory high end job skill sets) all come to mind. University would be for high end professions a bank executive on the high end would need a degree for example not the low to middle career bank employee or manager the apprenticeship is enough. Certifications in skill sets are also an option. Or teaching careers in High School which used to be normal in the US and should be considered an option. I just think the university for all model is unrealistic and wouldn't benefit the majority of students who are not frankly likely going to do well unless its an applied two year degree or similar program.

 

I have a couple degrees but I always found classrooms to be tedious in the extreme. It seems as though the art of the lecture has been all but lost anyway, and most instructors break classes down into study groups where students "learn from each other". Who needs to pay thousands of dollars for that (*)(*)(*)(*)? Give me a good text book and manual and test me later, thank you very much.

 

How many jobs have you had? I don't think you are much of an authority about what people need in real jobs. I love it when ignorant people who haven't even worked in a McDonald's pontificate on what is or isn't needed in the workplace.

 

Q. Is college really necessary in this age?

A. depends on what you want to do

I'd ask the OP, what sort of career interests him.

 

I will tell you, from experience, what looks good on a resume that does not relate to a college education.

Eagle Scout

I abandoned scouting long before earning such a title, but in talking to employers, to college counselors and to ROTC leaders....

Being an Eagle Scout is well respected and communicates very succinctly...I will be a valuable asset at your company, school or ROTC detachment. I've never met one that didn't achieve a level of success in life. I'm sure there are exceptions, but if you are an Eagle Scout, by all means put it in on your resume or college application.

 

If all you want out of college is facts, buy the book and memorize it. Go "learn yourself" all you like.

College doesn't offer that anyway. Teaching is acting upon someone and causing them to know something. You can teach the ABC's, the multiplication tables, state capitals, you can even teach someone ice is cold and fire is hot. You can do it without their awareness, permission or participation (drop an ice cube down their shorts). College is what comes next.

Some knowledge cannot be taught. You cannot teach someone to appreciate Michelangelo, to understand Chicago, or to know organic synthesis. You cannot act on someone and cause them to know quantum mechanics by dropping it down their shorts. That type of understanding is not just facts, it must be experienced. That experience is gained more completely if you are are lead through that new and daunting terrain by someone more familiar with it who can warn you of the pitfalls and point out the remarkable as you make that journey. You get more out of the trip with an expert guide.

That's what a professor is, a guide through some remarkable and challenging bodies of knowledge that most folks cannot come to know as well on their own. He doesn't teach facts, he professes knowledge and helps you develop understanding by leading you through the story of atomic structure, product marketing, particle physics, animal respiration, constitutional law ... and no, the professor doesn't guarantee everyone will make it through to the end.

University offers an additional service. Along the personal voyage you chart, it offers you the opportunity to present what knowledge you have made your own. Your performance is analyzed by recognized experts in each field and offered a grade. Then those institutions stand behind you and not only certify that you completed your chosen journey but testify to the extent you have made each segment your own. That's what your degree and transcript represent. It's the most widely recognized and thorough letter of recommendation you can get.

You think you can come to know that new terrain without a guide, feel free. A college or university education is not required, many great men have acquired fantastic knowledge without one. Many have never asked for a letter of recommendation. It's just a harder trip and requires you to market your mastered understanding better, if you try and do it all by yourself.




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Unless you are working in mathematics, or as I said, a architect, tell me when you really need advanced math? Give me an example.

Music.

 

Most building requires some trigonometry and a lot of geometry (not just the architects). Many jobs require a working knowledge of statistics (which is math, in case you didn't know). I know farmers who use algebra to figure out fertilizer amounts, etc. Surveyors use a lot of math. Accountants, of course. I know a lot of pilots and flight crew members--a lot of trig and some algebra. Most medical professions--physicians, nurses, med techs, pharmacists--use advanced math--to determine dosages, rates, etc.


My guess is that you can't do math, and never learned it, and you have this fantasy about music as a career, even though you've never played for money in your 20's. Please don't act like an expert in what jobs require, as you've never had a job.

 

Many folks don't appreciate that math is a language. Or recognize the value of reducing a context to that representation. But almost every profession makes use of the fundamental logic of numbers. That when we represent the world with numbers, we can tap into the relationships between numbers that provide powerful, reliable predictions and clear, revealing explanations.

Martial artists use triangle theory, painters value the golden ratio, race car drivers understand friction limits, and I've never met a baseball player or fan who doesn't understand the value of statistics. There is a reason we call math the universal language... it's universal.




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