Israel's president reminds Ukrainians of genocide they committed

This is interesting. I'm sort of surprised that he confronted them directly on their own turf. Well done Reuven Rivlin. It appears that many Ukrainians still cannot face the truth.

Israel’s President Confronts Ukrainians With Their Past

https://www.yahoo.com/news/israel-president-confronts-ukrainians-past-153150883.html

In contrast to the anonymity of the victims, Rivlin was clear in identifying the guilty. Noting that about 1.5 million Jews were killed in Ukraine during the Second World War, he was unflinching in confronting his hosts with the full scope of the truth: “Many collaborators to the crimes were Ukrainians. And among them, the fighters of the OUN — who mocked the Jews, killed them, and in many cases handed them over to the Germans — particularly distinguished themselves.” It was his specific mention of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists (OUN) that prompted some of his listeners to later denounce Rivlin. Formed in 1929, the OUN was a nationalist group that sought to establish an independent Ukrainian state and often employed violence against its enemies, including Poles and supporters of the Soviet regime.

The role of the OUN in the Ukrainian national consciousness has increased as Ukraine has asserted its identity in the face of Russian aggression. The group is an integral part of the country’s history of struggle for independence from the Soviet Union, and is particularly resonant today as the Kremlin continues to delegitimize the Ukrainian state and assert its supremacy over its neighbor. This year, the Kiev city government voted to rename a major street after Stepan Bandera, the group’s leader. That’s why, though Ukrainian-Jewish relations have noticeably improved since the collapse of the Soviet Union (Volodymyr Hroysman became the country’s first Jewish Prime Minister in April), Rivlin’s speech hit such a raw nerve.

Bogdan Chervak, current leader of the OUN — which still exists as a political interest group — reacted sharply. “What the President of the State of Israel did in Parliament today can be unambiguously interpreted as a spit in the soul of Ukrainians,” he wrote on Facebook. “To accuse the OUN of [taking part in] the Holocaust, and during parliamentary hearings for the 75th anniversary of Babi Yar, no less, is to disrespect the Ukrainian nation.”

While it is undoubtedly false to say that every member of the OUN committed crimes against Jews during the Holocaust, it is simply untrue to claim they played no role at all. Involvement of certain units of the group in the murder of Jews is well documented, including units loyal to Bandera. In Ukraine’s struggle against Soviet colonialism, some nationalist rebels saw aligning with the Nazis as a matter of survival. Yet that choice often entailed participation in Nazi atrocities...

 

its a fact, one that the Russians love to highlight, that the Ukrainians helped out the Nazis a great deal when it came to exterminating the Jews.

 

Ukrainians mostly exterminated Polish in Wolyn Massacre.

 

That's funny Ronnie. Problems with reading comprehension again? Do you have a problem with Israel's president now? Was he lying?

 

um, I guess you didn't see the part where I agreed with him.

 

Ronnie supports German control of Gdansk, and Ukrainian control of Galicia.

He simply supports Germans, and Ukrainians over Polish.

Which is ironic considering that Polish had the highest number of Righteous Among the Nations who risked their lives against a Nazi death penalty to aid Holocaust Jews.

 

In every lie , every exaggeration there is that element of truth that in obscured with a lie or obstructed by a half lie.

I know the history of the OUN very well since my dad was a member of the OUN -B faction from hus later teens until he was " arrested" by the Germans and sent to a concentration camp then sent to a firced labor camp.

I know that there were individuals Ukrainians who had cooperated and in a few cases participated in the German genocide. What I also know us that the OUN didvnot partipicipate as an organization in genocide.

My dad said that one major political failure of Stefan Bandera who headed up the OUN -B was that he did not condemn the German genocide of the Jews in any strong official way.

BTW I noted that Bandera headed up the OUN -B faction of the OUN because that was the major largest faction. There was the OUN-M faction M standing for Melnyk which was the tiny faction and I will not defend them.

Now let,s talk more about truth. The NKVD which was Soviet Russia of the Gestopo and Nazi SS. The quirks of history led to the NKVD to be populated by Bolsheviks and by the late 1930's the sons of old Bolsheviks. The quirk of history led to having thecBolsheviks to have a higher percentage of Jewish members than their population.

Stalin used the NKVD as the shock troops to go into Eastern and Central Ukraine, remove foodstuffs by confiscation and that is what caused 6to 8 million Ukrainians to be killed by famine by Stalin and the NKVD.

THE NKVD was populated by a higher percentage of Jews than their population of Soviet Russia. This was as a result of the Bolsheviks being the cadre' of the NKVD. AsI I noted since Jews populated the Bolsheviks in higher than their population percent and Bolsheviks were the main population of the NKVD the quirk of history caused there to be a higher than normal population of Jews in the NKVD.

This fact was not lost on Ukrainians.

Result?

There were Ukrainians acting as individuals who did help the Germans in the genocide. Why? My guess is revenge fir the Great Famine

Is this justification ?

NO NO WAY , What it is , is an explanation.

In 1939 the Soviets invade Western Ukraine which between 1921 and 1939 was occupied by Poland.

Stalin sent in the NKVD to round up Ukrainian priests, businessmen, educators, military officers, Catholic nuns and the NKVD executed them and sent those not executed to Siberia. My grandfather , dad,s dad was among those.

Again there were Ukrainians who knew about the NKVD population and did blame Jews fir cooperating with the Russians.

Ironic isn,t it that the Israeli president points at Ukrainians for cooperation with the Germans but Ibask you Mr. president how about the cooperation that some Jews gave to the Russians in that genocide?

 

The area you mistakenly call Galicia is called Halych or Halychina. It was what now is Western Ukraine.
There were periods of Polish occupation of that region and it was part of the Duchy of Lithuania but it basically Ukrainian so you saying that Ronnie supports Ukrainians over Poles in Halychina makes nonsense since Halych is Ukrainian.

 

I think we should separate the Russian Ukrainians who lived in the Eastern and Southern part of Ukraine, and who were the victims of the Nazis, with the Galacian and Western Ukrainians who were a part of Poland, and are being supported today by Washington.

It's the ones we support that were aligned with the Nazis in the past, and who see Bandera today as their hero. They were the members of Oun and they are the ones who killed off the Jews and Poles in Galatia the way they're killing off the Russians today in the Donbas.

 

No they don't Ronstar, because they're not so stupid as to think one ethnic group should be mentioned when it was the Poles that suffered the most. MOD EDIT>>>FLAME BAIT<<<

 

There is no such thing as "Russian-Ukrainians" . There are Ukrainians and there live in all parts of Ukraine.

The Ukrainians in Eastern Ukraine had become whatvwe call " russianized" first by the oppressive Czarist regimes that banned thecUkrainian language and later by the SovietvRussian regimes that murdered 6 to 8 million Ukrainians in the Great Famine. Going back to the times of the Czars Russians have moved into Eastern and Southern Ukraine and infested the Ukrainian population with Russian and Russianisms.

Now the Western Ukrainians were occupied by Austria in the 19th century as were all if the Poles but Austria did not try to commit language genocide therefore there Ukrainian language survived.

The Ukrainians were never " aligned" with the NAZI,s , period. As I gave mentioned a million times both of my parents were sent to firced labor camps by the NAZIs so why would we " align with that ilk?

Both of of my grandfathers were sent go Siberia by the Russians so I view both thecRussianscand the NAZI,s as scum and filth.

Ukrainians from Western Ukraine want go be European and not under the boot of Asian-Mongol-Russian empire in Moskva thst us why Russia and you try to smear Ukrainians. Russia wants to control Ukraine and it cannot do that with Ukraine being part of Europe. So Russian pripaganda throws lies and filth at Ukrainians and you must be the propaganda arm of Russia on this forum.

 

I like the way the great famine is being used by the Galacians for their own political reasons when they didn't suffer under it. Besides how could Ukraine be a separate nation, when nations didn't exist. There were only empires, principalities and bishoprics. Galacia decided to remain with the Polish Empire and go under the Pope, when the other half rejoined the Russian empire and went under the original Kiev/Moscow Metropolitan.

This video shows a reburial of some former Nazis in Galatia. Now a question: Does the Pope know about it, and was he told that they were going to glorify 'Nazism' by wearing their ancestors uniforms? Nationalism is a major sin since it is self glorifying and prideful.

[video=youtube;5F1gI0GjLBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F1gI0GjLBE[/video]

 

There were indeed battles between Poles and Ukrainians in Volyn. Who us at fault? Several groups including Soviet " partisans" , NKVD, and other groups some calling themselves OUN.

The military arm of the OUN called the UPA- Ukrainian Insurgent Army. There was a group operating in Volyn called the Taras Bulba battalion named after the fictional Cossack hero in MykolaHohol,s book TARAS BULBA. The commander of this unit was not a nice guy in fact maybe even a criminal.He claimed to have been part of UPA which would be OUN but he was not. This TARAS BULBA battalion was the one who had done the majority of the fighting between the Poles and Ukrainians. The commander of the TARAS BUKBA batallion was eventually eliminated and the battalion was disbanded and the goid members eventually joined the UPA the true decent MILITARY arm of the OUN

 

Why don't you do what the Germans did and recognize your crimes and apologize for them, instead of making excuses and trying to present yourself as being more civilized than the people you kill. Obviously you're not. I find the barbarism on the same level or worse than the Turks and of the Japanese in the Rape of Nanking.

[video=youtube;ut3r_j9Uy0o]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ut3r_j9Uy0o[/video]

 

Russian politologist and historian Vladimir Kornilov on his page at Facebook has posted a lot of blueprints of newspapers of Ukrainian nationalist published during the Great Patriotic War 1941-1945. It's a huge amount of facts which incontestebly proove that the Ukrainian nationalist organizations, such as OUN UPA and so on, were Nazi collaborators and active participants of Holocaust in Ukraine.

It's a newspaper Ukrainske Slovo that was released by OUN in occupied Kiev in 1941.

They wrote: "Bright crusaders bring happiness to us, they sacrifice their lives for us... Remember, the Great Mother, the Germans who burnt in flames." Literature editor of this newspaper was Olena Teliga, one of the streets in Kiev today is named in her honor.
Reporters of Ukrainske Slovo wrote: "The city is being cleaned up, it gathers more culture." (At this moment more than 30.000 people had been killed in Babi Yar). "Day by day the life in Kiev improves. Our people go to happy life with new ways."

Maybe OUN reporters didn't know about 30.000 Jews killed in Kiev?

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Time to .put some TRUTH into your post

The military formation you erroneously refer to as NAZI,s was not a NAZI formation. The Division was called the Halych Division or just The Divsisiya by Ukrainians.

This Division was formed by the Germans to allow " foreign" nationals to serve in German uniform with German weapons. The Halych Division was populated by Ukrainians who wanted to lead n military tactics and get military training so that they could one day firm a Ukrainian national army to liberate Ukraine from Russia. The Germans signed documents with the Ukrainians that stated that the Halych Division would only fight against the Russians and never fight against the good allies -Americans orcBritish.

The Germans were good at documentation and the contract to fight only agsinst Russians survived in the German mylitary archives and saved a lot of Ukrainians soldier,s lives after the war.

The Germans being chauvinistic bastards decide the any foreign populated divisions in German uniform were to be Administratively under the WAFFEN SS. The divisions, Ukrainian, Georgian, and some Balts were set up as such. They were in the field with Wiermach divisions.
After the surrender of German forces the Halych Division members ended up in OIW camps first in Italy then England. The Brits at first did not know what to make of them. They were in German uniform but they said that they only fought and killed Russians.

It took a couple three years to investigate and read over the German documentation and interrogate German generals to determine that the Halych Division was no SS. ThecRussians were lying up a storm and demanded that the Brits turn over the Division POW ,s so that the Russians could execute them all. ThecRussuans lied just as they today and falsely accused thecDivision of committing genocide.b

The Allies investigated and found that the Russians were liars and that the Ukrainian Division fought only military action and justvas the Ukrainians said - fought only the Russians.

The men of the Division were given refugee status and by 1948 started to emigrate to thevZUS, Canada, Australia, and Brazil.

My uncle was one of the men of this Division.

So that was two legs of the three leg stool of my father,s side of the family in WWII.

Some day when we discuss the Red Rmyvand the attack on Berlin during WW II we will get to the third leg.


Bottom line is this- the Russians spewed forth vicious lies and propaganda about any ethnic group that fought for their independence. Russians hate Ukrainians fir their independent attitude. Russuans throw filth, crap, and lies at Ukrainians because today the good Ukrainians want to be aligned with Europe so thecRusduabs and their stooges vomit lies and filth at Ukrainians and Ukrainian Americans.

We can see some of that filth and vomitt right here. But Ibam here to expose their lies and dispel the filth that Russians spew forth.

 

Another example of OUN UPA "fighting" against German Nazis.

The newspaper Dzvin had been released in the city of Krivoy Rog under German occupation. Editor in Chief - Mykhailo Pronchenko, the Ukrainian so-called "poet". His "poetry" today is studied in Ukrainian schools.

The newspaper is full of anti-semitism and hatred. Headline: "Eastern areas of Ukraine are cleaning from Jew-Bolshevik killers".

"Let Dzvin to wake up thousnads, millions of sons and daughters of our nation, let them to build up shoulder to shoulder orderly columns, which together with the invincible German Army move against the enemies of humankind."

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The newspaper Volyn from Rovno, western Ukraine, editor in chief - Ulas Samchuk, the member of OUN and Nazi collaborator.

September 30, 1941.

"Ukraine takes new way!" "Fighting near Kiev is over."

"When on June 22, 1941 we heard about the war of Great Germany against Soviets, we were inspired by new powers as we saw that not only Great Germany joins our silent struggle inside Bolshevism, but along with Germany the whole cultural world, the whole Europe and all creative powers of Europe."

Death machine in Babi Yar already works.

"Kiev is free!"

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Google: Stepan Bandera and Roman Shukhevych in German uniforms.

https://www.google.ru/search?q=step...ved=0ahUKEwiGwcPW_7zPAhXIWywKHYniAC8Q_AUIBigB

 

Ulas Samchuk - Nazi collaborator - is also the author whose works are studied in schools in nowadays Ukraine.

 

Americans build Japanese towns in the US, to test their firebombs and make them as efficient as possible. And with that knowledge they set fire to like 60 cities to burn as many civilians alive as possible, to than eventually nuclear bomb 2 of them. Americans still think it all was perfectly fine. But when their civilians get bombed... good lord.


Besides that. If they get to drag out that event.
How about them Jews asking for the death of Jesus?

 

Just keep blaming the Russians for your own crimes, stupidity and everything else. It might build up your self esteem but it's not going to put food on your table. I read an account of the Polish massacre and there was documented evidence that even hardened Germans were shocked at the atrocities committed by the Banderites.

For heavens sake Partizani, just take a look at what has gone on recently. In the Odessa fire over one hundred civilians including women and children were burned alive and hacked afterwards... and what did these 'civilized' Ukrainian Gallacians do? They were sending out pictures of roasted chickens and calling it the May Day barbecue.

 

White Croats are the first Slavs of Galicia, they were there before Ukrainians, or Polish.

Some historians think that Carpatho-Rusyn people are descended from White Croats.

So, it seems Carpatho-Rusyn people are the indigenous people of Galicia.

But, Polish had controlled Galicia longer than Ukrainians had.

From the 1300's - 1700's Galicia was under Polish rule, as opposed to the Halych which only ruled Galicia from the 1100's - 1300's.

Also note that Halych likely comes from a Magyar (Hungarian) word, who Magyar's did indeed rule Galicia before Ukrainians did.

So, really there's much claims to be made about Galicia.

The City of Lwow was more Polish than Ukrainian by a long shot in the early 20th century, this changed after WW2, when Soviets pushed Polish out of Lwow.

 

Hate to break it to you, but much of Eastern, and Southern Ukraine was in fact Turkic tribes before it was Ukrainian, with such Turkic tribes as the Cuman's, the Khazars, the Kipchak Khanate, and then the Crimean Khanate of Crimean Tatars.

Once the Crimean Khanate was bought down completely by Russia, then Russians bought in Russian settlers.

 

Austrian Franz Stadion helped strengthen Ukrainians, and fostered the Ukrainian movement.

He did such to divide Ukrainians against Polish.