I am Legion

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Margot2, Feb 27, 2017.

  1. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Makes me wonder if the ancient Jews really believed in demons and unclean spirits or if they were talking in code about other things.

    http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Legion.html#.WLQ9640zWyc

    The name Legion in the Bible



    The name Legion occurs twice in the Bible, but in one context. Both Mark and Luke tell the harrowing story of a demon possessed man (Matthew tells the same story but with two unnamed men; Matthew 8:28-34) who wandered the tombs of the Gerasenes — and note that the word for tomb, μνημα (mnema), is really the word for memorial; this man was "living among memories" and doubtlessly suffered from severe psychological trauma.

    He was subsequently continuously crying out and cutting himself with stones. When he saw Jesus he identified Him as the Son of the Most High God. When Jesus asked the man to say his name, he said, "My name is Legion because we are many" (Mark 5:9, Luke 8:30).

    Jesus famously sent the demonic legion into the herd of swine, which promptly destroyed itself. Mark uses the word λεγεων (legeon), legion, one more time as he speaks of the man who had had the legion (Mark 5:15).


    Roman legions were frequently named after the country they were stationed in or near (Legio I Germanica, Legio IV Macedonica, Legio IX Hispana, and so on).

    The word polus was also used to indicate the common people; the grey masses or hoi polloi (2 Corinthians 8:15). The man named Legion is basically saying that he's everybody; his demonic infection consists of the general populace of the Roman Empire. He is Israel and his demonic infection is the Roman occupation.

    The herd of swine



    Pigs were unclean animals and wouldn't have existed in Palestine if it had been up to the Jews (Deuteronomy 14:8). Unfortunately, it wasn't. Palestine was occupied by Romans, and Romans wanted pigs to sacrifice in their temples; there was even a special pig-tax, although it's not wholly clear what that entailed. By sending the legion into the herd of swine, which subsequently destroys itself, Jesus appears to make a statement similar to "render to Caesar what belongs to Caesar" (Matthew 22:21).

    Since Jesus is Truth and Truth will always prevail, whatever systems of belief are enjoying their fleeting moment of support, they will essentially all evolve off the stage of human experience. Jesus seems to say that fighting them is folly; just let them go.
     
  2. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Legion meaning

    http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Legion.html#anc-7



    The name Legion obviously means Legion, but the pun easily evades the modern reader.

    The demon possessed man was not simply a screaming, drooling fool but a man very much capable of intelligent discourse. He was naked and lived among the tombs but his name suggests order and quality.

    In modern times the word demon came to denote a miniature devil, but in New Testament times this was not at all so. Greek mythology used the word δαιμων (daimon) for gods and goddesses and transitive for spirits and even fate and fortune in general. In Roman mythology, such a daimon was called a genius or numen.

    Liddell and Scot (A Greek-English Lexicon) connect the Greek noun daimon to the noun δαημων (daemon), meaning a knowing (skill in combat), but declare a more probable etymology from the verb δαιω (daio), meaning to divide or distribute destinies.

    The Latin word genius denotes "the superior or divine nature which is innate in everything, the spiritual part, spirit," and from there "the tutelar deity or genius of a person, place, etc" and "the spirit of social enjoyment, fondness for good living, taste, appetite, inclination" (quoting Lewis and Short, A Latin Dictionary).

    Spiros Zodhiates (The Complete Wordstudy Dictionary) notes that although Jesus encountered many demon-related challenges and His power over demons was absolute, He never showed anger or raised His voice to them. Demons always recognized Him and always at once realized that they were out of business.

    Mark also tells the story of Jesus driving an unclean spirit out of a man, after which the onlookers (among which the freshly drafted disciples) recognize Jesus' actions not due to some undefined power, but to a new teaching (Mark 1:27).

    The man named Legion, therefore is not simply someone with a lot of evil spirits, but representative of the whole of Greek and Roman society; the entire Greco-Roman way of living and assessing reality, with which Jesus as the Word of God (Λογος, Logos, also derived from the verb λεγω) effortlessly competed.
     
  3. lemmiwinx

    lemmiwinx Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    tl:dr does any of this explain this explain the French foreign legion?
     
  4. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    No.. This is about the Roman legions and the Roman occupation of Palestine. They were a problem for the Jews .......
     
  5. lemmiwinx

    lemmiwinx Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I see it was the Romans who started all this crap. Shame on them!
     
  6. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    French Foreign Legion wasn't established until the 1830s...
     
  7. lemmiwinx

    lemmiwinx Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I believe it was the French and English who divided up the Middle East after WWI and drew those borders in the first place who're most to blame.
     
  8. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Yes.. Gertrude Bell thought it was a fine idea.. later she changed her mind.
     
  9. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Legio X Fretensis was the legion that was in Palestine during Jesus' lifetime... The pigs belonged to them.
     
  10. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    An idiot starts every problem.
     
  11. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    If you are able to receive it........
    Jesus did not say Jesus is the Truth. He said I am the Truth.

    When you have experienced this in all its immediacy, you will fully understand that I am the way, the truth, and the life. Your problem right now is that you don't know who I am. You think I am "Kode".
     
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  12. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What do you think of the idea of a Catholic exorcist going to the Bermuda Triangle,
    praying to be shown how to exorcies the triangle...
    getting the impression that thousands of deceased former slaves had been
    stuck in the next dimension...... and were pooling their energies to make ships or planes disappear?

    After Dr. Omand exorcised the Bermuda Triangle and sent these lost souls off to the light.....
    and helped them to forgive and go on......
    most of the strange events of the Triangle do seem to have stopped.

    https://www.amazon.com/Man-Who-Exorcised-Bermuda-Triangle/dp/0498024679
     
  13. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    First, I notice that this has nothing to do with the post you quoted. But then, I would be more inclined to read a scientific study than to accept a story in a book someone is selling to make money.
     
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  14. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    On the other hand.....
    I am 99% certain that Dr. Omand is deceased.......

    ..... so if somebody promotes his books.....
    only his heirs would benefit..... and he was a priest......
    so heirs in his case...... might not mean children or grandchildren......
     
  15. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I would really like to begin a debate with you in this other discussion........

    Back in 1988 I began to take a nutritional product that had a rather "negative" impact on me........
    I became psychic........
    and had some unusual experiences.............


    http://www.politicalforum.com/index...om-of-satan-and.369227/page-2#post-1064203441


    Does a major fallen angel return to G-d and divide the kingdom of Satan and...
     
  16. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    And?
     
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  17. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I have ended up with something of a possible DElusion of Grandeur.......
    that I have some sort of an "Elijah" calling / destiny..........

    Of the seven billion inhabitants few could come up with a better way to......
    "appease the wrath of the L-rd" than my idea of 'turning" Azazel Baalzebub.......
    and Pan..... and the major leaders of the fallen angelic kingdom.........


    http://drbo.org/chapter/26048.htm


    "[8] Who anointedst kings to penance, and madest prophets successors after thee.[9] Who wast taken up in a whirlwind of fire, in a chariot of fiery horses. [10] Who art registered in the judgments of times to appease the wrath of the Lord, to reconcile the heart of the father to the son, and to restore the tribes of Jacob."
     
  18. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    You're taking a highly symbolic literally. For example if you need it, the "whirlwind of fire" was a vision that the writer had when in deep contemplation and being impossible to communicate accurately, it was necessary to present it symbolically as a "whirlwind" and a "chariot". Taking them as a literal, actual whirlwind and a chariot causes a missing of the meaning of the story and a trail going in the wrong direction filled with error.
     
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  19. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Or... could it be that G-d
    is an even better film producer than Stephen Spielberg?????

    Could G-d be willing to liven things up... partly to benefit the audience.........
    and..... to offend those who wish to be offended........

    who are still at that level of consciousness?
     
  20. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    The story is that of a spiritual master and his disciple. Elijah told his disciple it was time to go off on his own, but Elisha said he would not leave him yet as he wanted more of what Elijah had to reveal and teach. So Elijah consented and they "went on to Jericho". The best evidence that this is a symbolic story is the following:

    9 And so it was, when they had crossed over, that Elijah said to Elisha, “Ask! What may I do for you, before I am taken away from you?”

    Elisha said, “Please let a double portion of your spirit be upon me.”

    10 So he said, “You have asked a hard thing. Nevertheless, if you see me when I am taken from you, it shall be so for you; but if not, it shall not be so.”

    Understand what it is saying. Elisha wants to attain the lofty spiritual heights of his master. He wants a "double portion of your spirit". It is not saying that if Elisha hangs around and watches Elijah and witnesses Elijah as he floats away Elisha will magically have "a double portion of his spirit"! No, it is saying that if Elisha has attained the advanced depth of meditation in which he is aware, as a direct, immediate experience in consciousness, of Elijah rising to elevated spiritual consciousness (which is only possible for Elisha if he, too, rests in that same elevated state at the same time such that they are one consciousness, one life, one Self), then he, too, will have attained the same lofty spiritual consciousness. Note that the phrase "when I am taken from you" means that at that point for Elisha there will no longer be any distinction between himself and Elijah. They will "be one" in Elisha's consciousness. The "other" (Elijah) will no longer be found. He will be "gone" because they will be one Self, one Being, one Life, one "IS".

    So it's like saying "if you see me during my journey through New York City and on to Buffalo, you will be with me on my journey". Yeas, no kidding you would. It's the only way you could see me during that time.

    So taking this as a literal story of whirlwinds and fire and chariots is to entirely miss the spiritual meaning. For more on whirlwinds see Job 38:1, Job 40:6, Psalm 77:18, and Isaiah 66:15. It is referred to as a whirlwind because the experience is so overwhelming and powerful.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2017

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